Gadgey

We've certainly ridden our luck with windass hitting the woodwork twice and we're really frail defensively on the right. To the teams credit though, after that obviously nervous start, they are trying to play the game the right way and getting the ball moving on the deck. That cross for the goal (from Tanner?) was an absolute fucking peach. Quietly optimistic for the second half. Could be a proper humdinger!!!

My point exactly....put in a far better way

Agreed Weeyin, i just thought it was interesting just how polarised fan opinions are of their own and other players, and of other leagues. I think the other thing that has to be bourne in mind is that the market to which we would aim to sell Moult is a particularly slow one. Again, just looking at league 1, with the very odd exception, almost entirely every signing is an out of contract free. According to transfermkt, so far, only 5 players have been bought for cash, three midfielders, one winger and one centre forward. Some good players have moved for free because there's just not the money flowing around. https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/jumplist/transfers/wettbewerb/GB3 Perhaps even more concerning for our hopes of achieving top dollar for Louis is the estimated value and trend of sales of that leagues top scorers. http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/league-one/top-scorers Of the top 10 scorers in league 1 last season, 5 start this season in the championship with 3 on promotion but most telling, the other 2 (James Vaughan 24 goals and Matty Taylor 16 goals) for fees of £480k and release clause of £300k respectively. So in essence, I think it all boils down to what is Louis Moult worth to us as a football club. It just might make more sense in this market to keep him and let him go for free.

I had this very conversation with some charlton fans before the game today and whilst they had all heard of Louis Moult, it is fair to say that he most certainly divided opinion. All agreed that they'd want a striker who averages 15 goals a season but many were concerned by his considered fragility i.e. Groin and perceived lightness of weight. Motherwell are reported to want something in the region of £750k which, in the main, is well out of the reach of all but a couple of league 1 sides. Any team at that level spending that kind of cash will be wanting the proven article and despite what many users of this forum think, the majority of fans (granted not professionals) still consider a 15 goal striker in the spl a bit of a punt. The majority of championship sides could afford the price tag but would Louis want to join the majority of those or more importantly, would they want him? Sorry for sounding like a miserable sod (cos I'm really not) I think if they/he did, he'd be gone by now. The English lower leagues love their big strong target men and their quick runners. Louis is neither of them. It's a different type of game to the spl in so many respects. Quick runner Theo Robinson was a regular and (according to my Southend season ticket holder mate) decent performer whilst Josh Magennis and Tony Watt present the target for fast charlton wingers. Both those teams will be in or around play offs this season and due to the type of player he is, Louis would have to fight to get into the starting 11 of either of those sides. Personally, I think it is that level of club that Louis Moult is likely to end up at where he can hope to push on or get promoted to the championship. Maybe my claret and amber specs are blurring my vision but I would love to see him come to the valley for a fee that Motherwell are happy with and for him to prove all of the doubters wrong but it's reasonable to suggest like Al B has, that not everyone has a pair of claret and amber specs.

Did steelboy write this article? http://www.thefootballlife.co.uk/post/163370695926/spfl-201718-season-preview-motherwell-get-last SPFL 2017/18 Season Preview - Motherwell: Get Last Season Tae It seems odd to say it now, but not all that long ago, Motherwell were consistently in Europe, consistently challenging at the right end of the table as opposed to coming close to falling out of it. Once the Stuart McCall era went to hell, Motherwell have been a team of little else but false beginnings. Ian Baraclough created a positive attacking side that was a mess any time they were pressured at the back. Mark McGhee never resolved that and paid for that with his job, becoming a meme in the process. Stephen Robinson has one hell of a task on his hands. Motherwell, last season, were a joke. Successive big defeats and errors from defenders who talked the talked but were incapable of walking the walk culminated in the famous Get this tae incident at Aberdeen last season. That, possibly, wasnt the nadir of last season as Well came uncomfortably close to the playoff spot. Robinson took over as a permanent solution after a fairly dismal failure trying to go it alone in England. Is there any cause to expect better in Scotland? Stephen Robinson has been busy in the transfer market - nine players have come to Fir Park this summer so far and you would expect that not to be the end of it. Motherwell come into this season after having three poor ones and Robinsons task this season is less to try to recoup former glories and more just to make sure that, this season, the word relegation isnt uttered at any point. But with a side that lacked composure at that back last season, that task doesnt look like it will be an easy one. Motherwells key issue remains the defence. Craig Samsons departure as goalkeeper was met by fans with joy but replacing him with Trevor Carson is not exactly convincing. Carsons recent time has been as a goalkeeper at mid to low table English League Two clubs spending last season playing half of Hartlepools games in a season where they dropped out of the football league altogether. Motherwell have plenty of history picking up rough diamonds from the lower reaches of the English leagues but Carsons record of not being a steady number one at the wrong end of the lowest tier would suggest he will not be one of them. In front of him, the defence is not solid. Robinson may have quietly dropped Stephen McManus, but still has to use Stevie Hammell who, at 35, is no longer effective enough to maintain a solid back line. On the opposite flank, Richard Tait will play out of position bt showed enough last season before injury to suggest that he will be able to continue his progress and grow into a real asset for the side. Charles Dunne, signed on a free from Oldham, will likely allow Tait to go back to the right flank (and move Hammell out) in time but it is concerning that he was not chosen for BetFred Cup duty and Tait played out of position instead.. In the centre, Ben Heneghan seems likely to do the same and Robinson has gambled on Leicester youth reject Cedric Kipre to partner him. Banking on a player from England who has literally zero in the way of first team experience is worrying and something which has bitten Motherwell in the backside regularly with Messrs L Laing and Z Jules. While Kipre could develop into a solid player, backing him so early in his career to make a difference is an extremely risky bet given that it is bound to take him time to come up to speed in terms of the rigours of first team football. The back-ups, aside from Stephen McManus (who has lost too much pace to be of much utility nowadays), are all young academy players with only Jack McMillan having more than ten senior appearances for the club. Its quite difficult, then, to see how Motherwells abysmal defensive record improving much. Aside from Inverness, they were the worst team defensively in the division by some considerable distance. Barring either Robinson showing organisational skills that havent shown themselves so far (Motherwell kept the same amount of League clean sheets in the 14 games before his arrival as in the 14 games he managed after arriving) or him having discovered a gem of a player in Kipre (or a future signing) with untapped talent that hasnt shown itself so far, its hard to come up with an argument to say that Motherwell will be any less weak at the back than last season. Anomalies such as the 7-2 to Aberdeen may not happen but that doesnt bring the goals conceded count down much and any team that is going to concede a minimum of 55 goals in a season is always going to be hanging around the wrong end of the table. That would be enough were it the only issue. Midfield has a similar issue in depth and reliance in the youth set up (albeit, the midfield is arguably the strongest part of this academy crop). The end of Keith Lasleys career robs them of a certain handsomeness in midfield but the new recruits of Andy Rose (with significant MLS experience) and Gael Bigirimana (who managed to make it at Coventry and came close at Newcastle) may not be of a standard to lift the team all by themselves, but both have the pedigree and background to suggest they will be able to make an impact at the club. Added to that, Chris Cadden is continuing his progression and may well do so further as Robinson appears willing to trial him in the centre where he can be more effective (although Hearts remain interested in him) and Well should be able to get a full season out of Carl McHugh after having his face cut open did him in for a period of last term. They should, at the very least, have strength in the centre of midfield be it from a holding or from an attacking perspective. That is where the good news ends. Louis Moults time at Motherwell has to be automatically suffixed with the words for now. He has been constantly linked away and interviews the player himself has given suggest that he doesnt have any intention of staying at the club past this season at most and if someone wouldnt mind arranging a transfer for him right now, that would be very good please and thank you. With Scott McDonald gone, Moult departing would be a catastrophic turn of events. Alex Fisher showed at Inverness he has the ability to do something at this level, but Moult is one of the few players in the league who has the goalscoring ability to keep a team up all by himself. In a side with the issues that Motherwell has, that is absolutely invaluable and Motherwells season will be defined not by struggles in the next few months, but in the struggle to the end of August in terms of keeping Moult at the club until at least May. Keep him, and Motherwells chances will be immeasurably improved. Lose him and they will be in some trouble. Having also lost over the summer Dom Thomas, Lionel Ainsworth and Stephen Pearson, Motherwell also look a little less creative out wide. Without McDonald needling, Ainsworth crossing and Pearson thrusting, Motherwell suddenly look almost solely reliant on Louis Moult to do everything. Motherwell, in some eyes, will be challenging for the top six. After all, they have redeeming features in attack that many other sides dont (namely, Louis Moult). But those strengths are more than offset by their weaknesses at the back. Furthermore, the likelihood of those redeeming features in attack being taken away from them by other clubs seems far more probable than the likelihood of the defence suddenly looking magically competent after three seasons where it has often been a running joke. The Steelmen are left with the probability of yet another season of struggle ahead. At the end of last season, I noted on twitter that, with the players leaving on a free and the likelihood that Moult would be off, Motherwell possibly had the weakest squad in the division. Now we come into the new season and, while enough has been done to avoid that conclusion, Motherwell arent far from the weakest side in the league. They lack the spirit and defensive depth of Accies, who will no doubt be down there, but have more cutting edge - even if Moult were to go, Alex Fisher showed himself more a poacher than any attacker Accies have. Even in July, the first Lanarkshire derby of the season in mid-October jumps out as the stereotypical relegation six pointer, even if Well do benefit from a schedule which means six of their first eight games are at Fir Park. The bookies have Motherwell an incredible 4/6 to be in the top six this season but, for me, Motherwell appear nailed on for the bottom six. The only question is just how bad it could get.

I'm surprised that anyone could be so astonished that a player (particularly a foreign player) may choose not to join motherwell. Also, I guess it must've been a no brainer when the offer to go back home presented itself. I feel no sense of loss for nothing we never had. What did cause the sharp intake of air was to see that a player that would walk into our team has gone to a third tier French team.

Just watched the YouTube highlights. I know I'm a happy clappy who only saw the carefully selected match events through a c&a tinted lense but that was really encouraging. Some lovely link up play with great movement off the ball bringing good goal opportunities. Yes, our finishing could have been better but I think the Morton goalie deserves a lot of credit for the one on ones. Taits goal is an unusual one. You rarely see a RB/RWB in so far out of position to meet such a rebound and we'll not see many right backs deliver such a sweet finish on the left peg at any level of football. I would absolutely love to see them play like that against the h*n. It's almost an entirely new team, do they have a new attitude to the big games? I bloody hope so and I guess only time will tell.

Agreed....but it's not a new phenomenon

I love how people can walk away with completely different interpretations of events from the same football match. Ya Bezzar said "Kipre is good on the ball but unfortunately that's about 10% of defending and I just feel that there are errors in his game." Melvin Bragg said Kipre "Looks to have a mistake in him but there could be potential there". Just a question because I'm not there to see it. What in Kipre's play gives the impression there are errors in his game or that he has a mistake in him? Oh and I'm just glad Sinjy isn't an English scout coming to look at Louis Moult

You hinted at it earlier, do you know (or know of chat) that Robinson doesn't fancy McLean. Cos that would be a shame.

Because he has the natural ability to raise the hopes of people who are used to the humdrum of journeymen and want him to do well for their team. He's young enough to still be an enigma and hasn't yet established himself as a luxury player. He is our most recent best player that never was. The next two years will be what defines him and it's that unknown that will keep us interested.

You know I didn't as I'm in exile. Like I said, let's see what happens, it may be a great move for him, big Lee and Killie. It is fair to say though that to the frustration of many, DT hasn't developed his game beyond what he is instinctively good at. Compare that to his contemporaries such as Cadden then it polarises his shortcomings.

Aye, and if Killie doesn't work out for him, he just might. That article translates to me as "I didn't like working on the stuff I'm not so good at and I'm well chuffed I've got a gaffer that lets me keep on doing the stuff I want to keep doing" which is the reason why he's no longer at fir park. As said in the article, and anyone who's had burst piles or gonorrhoea will vouch, there are indeed many worse things than giving a football away (especially in the final third), but many football careers have been lost by doing just that. It'll be interesting to see how it unfolds, it could prove to be a terrific piece of man management by Lee MCulloch or the unwitting last throw of the career dice from a boy who doesn't appreciate the talent and opportunities he's been given in life.

Based on what evidence?

Great post. By no means your intended target audience, i do have a bit of experience of playing semi-pro for a couple of years. I don't think that makes me more knowledgeable, I can only talk from experience and as a fan like everyone else. I'll have a stab: 1. Robinson summed it up well that they weren't sharp enough on some of the basics and there wasn't the expected consistent application to ensure at the very least the basics were done. This can go some way to answering no 3 also. The other thing for me was that we always knew that QP would tire. By maintaining steady momentum will in essence tire the opposition (who have to work hard off the ball) and exploit gaps. The old firm have done it to us for years. 2. To be honest, that's what I was largely used to after the customary pre season beasting. I guess the added complexity here is the influx of new faces and the expected delay of team cohesion. 3. I think we all know the answer to that. We just can't. 4. Isn't this the much lamented Scottish football culture question? Honestly don't know for the bigger picture. In truth though, in the context described, we are the QP against the Panathanaicos or Steaua Bucharest. Good questions for genuine debate though.

I do find this forum entertaining. Reading this thread, I have learned that booing can be motivational, professional footballers must run at maximum capacity at all times or they are failing as professionals (even in the knowledge that by playing a possession game against an amateur/inferior team there will be pay off in the final quarter of a game) and that playing 3 at the back is just fucking evil!!!! It's easy to focus on the negatives and being honest, there were several there for all to see. The first half was indeed poor, and with such a densely populated midfield, it was frustrating to see so many (often aimless) long balls. I would have much preferred to see the ball being played on the deck on a big surface like hampden. It probably would still have been pretty ugly to watch when trying to penetrate a parked bus but it would've given us all a better look at the new signings and less reason for criticism (though I suspect there will always be those who find something). That said, when done well long balls from McHugh and Kipre, brought good goals. I thought Carson looked good when asked and Kipre looks like he may be a grower. I've never been a fan of Big Ben and today did nothing to change that. It's great to see Bowman get so many goals so early on. I liked him for his endeavour last season. It was clear nothing was working for him. He looks like a different player now and I hope the big man continues to grow. It will be interesting in the fullness of time to see if 3 at the back is what Robbo wants. Logically, if he's ever going to do it it is now with a new squad and new beginnings. If done well, it can work really well and is becoming increasingly popular in modern football. In Scotland, If it is to be his default formation, I suspect that it will be the catalyst for Robinsons ultimate success or failure.

No it is sad. It's sad in the most heartfelt way how Scottish football has declined in every respect to the extent that established top flight clubs cannot afford the wage of an English fourth tier journeyman centre half. I noticed the difference yesterday when considering Lee Erwin. He's a free agent and has been linked with the team for whom I have a season ticket in league 1. I thought about it last night and my thoughts were along the lines of would I want to see him at Motherwell? Yes. Would I want to see him at Charlton? No. Why? Because he could do a job for one and not the other. Both teams looking to use wingers, both looking at using the 451 or 4231. And that is really sad.

Well said Andy!!!!

it will be hard to let go of a guy who scores so many goals, works so hard go the team and interacts with the fans in such a genuine way. But let's not confuse that feeling of loss and it's associated emotion with blaming him for doing exactly what we knew he and the club would do two years ago when we signed him. We can't blame any player for our placement in the football hierarchy. From what I've seen, the lad is just being honest. I can't imagine he uprooted his family and came to Lanarkshire for the weather. He came here because he bought the vision sold to him by the club at the time. The past two seasons have built up to this window. He's earned his move and I wish him luck.

Yes he can and I would wager that is why he has openly been touting himself. I would wager everything he's doing is with the clubs endorsement or indeed behest. I just hope Charlton buy him

From a football academy that apparently isn't good enough to be an academy. Well done lads and well done Motherwell. Good luck in the tournament!!!

Cheers dude

http://www.newsshopper.co.uk/sport/charlton/15409013.Charlton_manager_Karl_Robinson_battling_old_club_to_sign_Championship_striker/ Sorry to goggles&flippers I know you hate just the link. I tried but my iPhone won't let me (or I'm making an arse of it ) copy the content. Story going round that my other team are in for Big Lee. Not sure if I'm too enthusiastic about this but I guess he's likely to be an upgrade on big Josh Magennis

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