fatcalf

Only if I got the jersey after the game

So instead of dealing with the arseholes they have to ruin it for everyone else? Clever that.

Just got a text from a mate on the train, seriously what is the point of such OTT policing of fitba' fans travelling to a game? And what is the point of having ICT in the league if you can't have a good swally on the 4 hour journey?

Likewise but as stated the designs will already have been decided on so it's a case of wait and see. One thing I always hope for is a proper hoop, not just a band on the front. Christ, I might even buy one if they do that

Personally I'm disgusted that they didn't take it seriously enough to fix it during the summer. The conduct of our board over this affair is inexcusable IMO, they gambled on getting away with doing nothing and deliberately misled everyone, including us. Damn right they should be taking it seriously now, they should be rethinking their positions, each and every one.

Can't see why, as fans we want the best for the club. As manager so does he and when it comes to backing the club against outside attacks we're all in it together. Doesn't take away from the fact this is all our boards doing though, should have been sorted last summer as promised. At least everyone knows about it now so will probably get done this time. Shouldn't have gone this far though.

It's official, what we all knew to be true, the gaffer has just announced on Setanta's Press Box, exact words tae. Gaun yirsel Noah

Agreed. Problem seems to be at their end though Yir, trying to make sure both sides of the bigot divide get equal home and away matches. Can't see how our games should be changed though, surely we would have been in their initial group of teams expected to be in the top 6? Hearts are the surprise package so they should be switched if anyone.

Why are they in the league then? They serve no purpose other than a fine day oot on the swally

I can see both sides here, FWIW I believe the people responsible stated this kit was for 08-10 with all good intentions of that being the case but circumstances overtook them. I've spoken out against such kit changes before (typical we had to keep that fuckin' Zoom effort for the full term though eh?) and I would hope the JAXX contract is altered to take this irregular pattern into account now so that we don't face another change in 12 months time. Now the good part, my kids birthdays are in the summer so I'd be spending that dosh anyroads, one pressie sorted

Just mind the fashion parade

Too early for Blue, couple more years yet

We can't very well go back to the installers and ask for compensation when we sanctioned another company to drill holes in the pipes can we? Does no-one listen to the real explanation? Or is it just that blind loyalty thing refusing to accept the decision makers could be so underhand?

I rmember it only too well. wife was due to have our 2nd on the same day meaning I had to change my plans to go. Glad I did in a way but wee Clare T. arived in the early hours that night so I could have made it. Never mind, something to celebrate at least.

Actually I've heard quite a few pitches described as similar to ours these past couple of weeks. Doesn't absolve anyone 'up by' cos they chose not to do anything to rectify things in the summer but it seems to be a general malaise and not only this country either. Just watched Eurogoals and even the commentator there mentioned someone's shitey surface.

Alex McLeish oversaw a 1-0 victory against us when we played them after he moved. I assume that 6-2 drubbing at Fir Park is the game you mean? If so that cost Jim Duffy his job and McLeish moved shortly afterwards, not that anyone really bothered. Mild indifference around Motherwell I seem to recall.

I'd be delighted if we were, they've [decision makers 'up by']proved themselves to be untrustworthy so maybe best if the SPL bigwigs keep a closer eye on them.

Steve got the gist of my post about Nevin's article. I don't doubt he's telling it as he sees it but what I meant was there's far more to it. He was only here for a short time, during Andy's long tenure we had a superb surface so wee Pat's explanation doesn't really hold up over time. Maybe in his short spell here aye that was the case.

Or to put it slightly differently folk fae different countries in our colours are safe, folk fae Scotland in our colours are at risk, folk fae different countries no' wearing our colours are fair game. Only one way to stop it, go tell em to rap it when they start. Otherwise we're going round in circles here.

That's no grovelling, ye can dae better than that

I reckon we'd do better but they might have improved as well. We never really got going but that's true for the most part in this season to date.

There's the wider issue that, due to seating, there have been no role models for young fans to follow in the ways of being a fan. When I started going on the terraces I was 14 and aspired to be up the back of the choir. I hung about on the fringes and learned how to behave at matches through watching the older guys and eventually being accepted in through regular attendance and getting my face known, going to away games and generally worming my way in with group. When seating was forced upon us that signalled the end of the choir, there was no focal point where fans would gather, consequently there was no ladder to work your way up. More importantly younger fans coming through didn't get to learn the ways of a football crowd, what songs were deemed acceptable, the kind of beahviour which would be frowned upon by the older guys. These youngsters now are trying to recreate those days in a way but have no role models to point them on a path, all the auld yins on here slag them but they've had to make it up as they go along without the benefit of our experiences. I learned hunners about behaviour at games and whilst it was a different era, the basic principles of getting behind the team whilst not making yirsel look stupid with shite songs or patter were learned from those above me in the pecking order. Sadly there's no-one going to show the way, the auld yins are too busy slagging Fizzy to bother with creating an atmosphere, very few want to get involved in standing up to the stewards leaving them isolated and probably feeling let down. I know if I needed a hand at any time there would be a good few ready to help me out back then, now it's every man for himself. I don't see the youngsters ever being allowed to recreate the atmospheres we used to enjoy, that's a thing of the past but hopefully they'll think more about the 'unacceptable' part of their behaviour which has some of us cringing. Not because it's young guys patter, it's just not funny I have to say, but like I say you have to learn these things through time and it's harder to do that on your own.

My condolences also, sad to hear.

Dave, my opposition to it is not that I think the idea is wrong, the principle of it is fine but Boyle promised this would be done last summer, the responsibility is his. After taking us for granted so often it will be a while before I'd be volunteering to bail him out which is basically how I see your suggestion. If however he hade made strenuous efforts to engage with our fans the way he has with the Old Firm then the bridges he's burned may have begun to mend and you might get more positive feedback from the wider fan base. It's been one way traffic for too long and he needs to start the healing process, not us. As for Nevin's article, Andy Russell would argue otherwise. I fancy after Andy we just didn't employ the expertise required or find the necessary investment to keep our pitch one of the best in the business. A gradual decline in standards has brought us to where we are today methinks.

I fear he won't be moving anytime soon, it will take years for the value of Fir Park to rise back to it's previous level. Until then I don't see Boyle, or the club, going anywhere.