joewarkfanclub

If his form had been magnificent all season and he had been keeping us in games I would agree. But it hasnt. Now that could just be because he has been playing behind a defence that has leaked goals in recent weeks, but the goal at Kilmarnock was down to him and it hasnt been the only occasion. He makes some very good saves most weeks, but If you compare the individual mistakes he has made to those of say, Mugabi, and compare the criticism that accompanies it, Kelly flies under the radar. Now, Im not saying I would hunt Kelly in January. But if a suitor comes in with a reasonable offer, I think we would be crazy not to consider it.

I think Carson was better as well. Kelly is a good shotstopper, but he doesnt come for cross balls and his distribution is poor. He is definitely a good enough keeper at our level, but whether he is value for money is a different matter. None of us really know what money he is on, but he came in on loan from a bigger club able to pay much higher wages and is reputed to be our top earner. For me if we were looking to trim the wage budget I would have moved him on and gone and got Carson back in the short term. For me he shouldnt be near the Scotland team. The fact that he is shows the dearth of talent among Scottish goalkeepers right now. Given that he doesnt want to talk contracts right now, it seems like he wants to run his contract down and see what offers come to him in January. Thats fair enough and his perogative, but I wouldnt lose any sleep over moving him on in January for whatever fee we can get.

Another point on Saturday would consolidate things going into the break. 3 points would be most welcome. Id go with this............ Kelly Spencer Casey Butcher Blaney Gent Paton Slattery Spittal Bair Biereth McGinn and Miller are the only others in contention for me right now but both likely to remain out. I wouldnt be averse to giving Oxborough some game time, but given we are clearly trying to punt Kelly, Im sure that wont happen.

Good point in the end. I think slowly but surely SK is getting to know the players he can trust and those who keep making individual errors and letting the team down. I expect once this round of injuries clears up we may start to see a more settled team. Another point on Saturday would continue to steady the ship. Three would be awesome.

The circumstances for this game dont feel great for us. Saints have fired their manager, got their first win and will he looking to impress their new manager. We on the other hand are on a poor run, have several injured players and are low in confidence going to a venue we have historically found difficult. Id take a point right now just to stop them gaining ground on us. Glad Im working tonight and can just find out what happened after the fact!

Outwith Celtic and Rangers, I think any of the teams can beat each other. We havent won in 7 games, yet we are sitting in the middle of the table in a group seperated by 3 points. That shows that the form and results of the other teams hasnt really been any better than ours, otherwise we would be cast adrift already. The longer it goes on however, the more pressure will mount and confidence will drop off. Particularly if we were to lose to St Johnstone on Tuesday and they get back within touching distance of everyone else. Dont get me wrong, I am concerned about this slump, and it needs to he reversed soon, so Tuesday would be a good place to start.

Given the context of the game, the pitch we were playing on and the fact that we were far more solid defensively and well in the game at a difficult venue at half time, I think the managers tactic can be justified. I didnt like it and it wasnt great to watch but after 6 games without a win, he had to do something different. Had we won the game 1-0 in an absolute shitfest yesterday, no one would have complained.

If you look at the 7 game run without a win and take the emotion out of the situation, I dont think our form is anywhere near as bad as some are making out. St Mirren - good performance, played them off the park, spurned numerous good chances. Got done on the counter. Rangers - outstanding performance. Done by a wicked deflection and some dodgy refereeing. Celtic - good solid defensive display. Gave little away and did well to come back and equalise after conceding. Should have seen the game out but switched off to lose in injury time. Livvy - solid if uninspiring first half performance on a horrible pitch. Undone by a questionable red card that turned the game in Livvys favour. Ross County - terrible first half performance but dug out a point in the end with a spirited late comeback. Aberdeen - absolutely woeful. The 2 goals at the end paper over some of the cracks in what was easily our worst display under SK. Killie - solid enough first half performance on another poor pitch. Questionable long ball tactics. Coughed up another soft goal that left us chasing the game and open on the counter. As K McAlpin has said, we have been dealt some really bad luck on this run which has contributed to our failure to collect more points. Sure the manager and players could have made better decisions at times, but thats normal for most football clubs during the course of a season. I would say that the only 2 games where I felt our performances were alarmingly bad were the first 60 minutes v Ross County and the Aberdeen game. The fact that both games were at Fir Park and on a fantastic playing surface is my biggest cause for concern. Now I know, the league table doesnt measure performances and a run of 7 games without a win is very poor, so Im not saying that Im not concerned about where we may be heading. But its time for calm heads. We just got Butcher and Biereth back who will be important players for us. I also thought Blaney looked very good yesterday, furst half in particular, so we are starting to get options that allow SK to make changes. The next 2 games are huge. We simply have to take something from them to arrest this slide.

My bad. I meant Mugabi but was thinking about Bair and typed his name instead.

Thought it was quite a bold team selection from SK today. Wasnt really sure what it was going to look like, but he did what a lot of fans were asking for by dropping SOD, Slattery and Bair. It was clear from the outset that he picked a team to combat the pitch and try and keep us competitive in the match. For the most part it worked. We looked more solid in defence and didnt cough up any easy chances in the first half. We made Kilmarnock work for them and they didnt have a shot at goal for the first 30 mins. Not going to say I was pleased at the style of our football or that we created a raft of chances, but today for me was about playing the circumstances, so I wasnt that unhappy at half time. That all changed with the goal. We got a warning just minutes before when we failed to defend a cross into the box and the Killie player headed straight at Kelly. We didnt heed that warning and again got caught in the transition with Kelly spilling a very easy take and none of our defenders making any response to allow Cameron an easy finish. After that it became very much more open as we yet again chased the game. It was clear the players were under instruction to play it long, so it was somewhat ironic that our best play and chances actually came when we got the ball down and played football. Over the piece Killie deserved to win. But it was another game of fine margins where poor decisions from the manager and players have contributed our own downfall. Thats now 7 without a win. We are still in the pack and a couple of positive results would take the pressure off. But every game that passes without that win will just keep heaping on the pressure. Tuesday night now becomes huge.

Very nearly a great post!

Not really. But he did show more in his brief cameos than Wilkinson has showed so far.

McKinstry had ability. But he had no pace whatsoever......

Can we get rid of Dawes and hire whoever identified Butcher, Casey & Furlong? 😎

Been offgrid for a few days so only just getting the chance to comment on this. Really difficult to know where to start. But thats the kind of performance that gets a manager sacked if its repeated too often! We seemed to be in control of the game for the first 15 minutes or however long it was, but their first goal is an absolute bombscare from our defence. Its a comedy of errors and an absolute gift to Aberdeen and gave them all the confidence they needed to start playing their football. After that I thought we lacked any cohesion and could barely string 2 passes together, not helped by the inconsistent referee who seemed to give a foul for every contact we made on an Aberdeen player while ignoring exactly the same challenges on ours! Our defending for goals 2,3 and 4 was similarly shocking and players we have been able to rely on for most of the season lime McGinn, Casey, Miller, Spencer all had poor games. SK has to ring the changes on Saturday. This cant happen again.

Here we go again. Theres no way SK gets emptied unless we are adrift by Xmas. That is possible. But by no means certain. He has, under the instruction of the current Chairman/CEO had to strip the budget right back to a manageable and sustainable level, whilst at the same tome trying to keep a competitive side on the pitch. Initial signs and performances were very good and we got a decent points haul before some injuries and suspensions hurt us big time. What I do think is fair comment is some of the signings were undoubted risks. Offering Obika a new deal was dubious given his injury record. But he has far more ability than Mandron whom he cut lose. The problem for me is he then goes and signs Bair on a 2 year deal. Whilst Ive defended Bair on here, that still felt a bit mad. No doubt Theo will be on way less money than Mandron, but 12 months would have been plenty. Pape Souare also seemed like a proper gamble, but at least that was only a 6 month deal, so you could kinda live with that. Wilkinson for me is the biggest disappointment though. I know he has been injured as well, and is clearly not fully match fit, but I still havent seen anything form him to suggest he is gonna be any good at our level. His body language also isnt the best. Maybe he can do a KVV and make me eat my words? Heres hoping! I still think we have enough in the squad to turn this around. But SK needs to be ruthless and start playing players he can trust and play them in their best positions. A fit Butcher needs to replace Mugabi, who was fine as a stop gap but nothing more. Spencer simply has to start at RB. That leaves us with an issue at left back as Souare is crocked. Gent looks suspect defensively and SoD is a RWB. Could Blaney play there? The other question is should it be 5 at the back or 4? Up front, Id be playing Biereth on his own as he is the only one with the pace and power to manage the job and still have the ability to score goals. (But I wouldnt be risking him today). We have shown already that in the right set up, the midfield have enough about them to create chances for the right striker. It is a big few weeks for SK, no doubt. Turn it around and all this chat will become white noise. We start going 8,9,10 without a win and getting sucked to the bottom of the table and the board may start getting twitchy.

We really need 3 points today. This run has to end soon or we really will be in a relegation battle. I hate having to watch us playing on plastic, but its effectively a home game for me so cant really not go! Dont care how SK does it. Be ruthless as feck. The players have given him plenty reason to wield the axe so none can complain. Get the best 11 for the job out on the park and grind out an absolute shitter of a win. I might even change my mind about "that kit" if he does. Intae these Squirrelhumpers! 😆

I would be surprised if Martindale left Livvy for St Johnstone. Some clubs and managers are just a good fit for each other and I think thats the case for him and Livvy. Its not as if St Johnstone will have a significantly bigger budget than Livvy. They are a club with a longer history and have had some recent success, but how realistic is it that they can repeat that? He knows what he has at Livvy, he signed the players and they are in a much healthier position in the league. Look forward to him being the next St Johnstone manager! 😆

Lots of suggestions about how we should or might set up, and not without merit. However, the biggest factor going forward is going to be the fitness levels of Butcher and Biereth. Neither are ready to start. Biereth was by his own admissions blowing out his arse after 30 minutes and Butcher didnt even make it onto the field. Its gonna be a few more weeks before either is a certain starter. I think most feel that we need the 4 in midfield to help us control the game. No doubt that a midfield of Miller, Paton, Slattery and Spittal helps us keep the ball and allows us to dictate the play and pace of the game. Whenever we drop to a 3 the opposition tend to get more of the ball and thats when the mistakes creep into our defensive set up. That leaves us either playing 1 up top, which we cant at the moment as the only striker capable of it whilst providing a goal threat is Biereth. Alternatively, we could go 4 at the back. However, without Butcher in there, Im not sure thats a wise decision either. Casey and McGinn might make a pair, but It may also limit the ability of Spencer to get forward. I think until Butcher and Biereth are fully up to speed we probably need to persevere with the 5-4-1. Id be interested to see Wilkinson up top to see how he is at bringing others into play. He seems to have a decent touch and on limited viewing appears to be a better finisher than Bair or Shaw. Re the wing backs, I would agree that giving Spencer a go in his natural position is worth a go. If for no other reason than to give the opposition something different to think about. If we start with SoD on the left we could always revert back if it isnt working. It would be good to get young Gent in there eventually but now isnt the time. We need some positive results before we start taking chances like that. Aberdeen have a heavy schedule coming up and although they have some talented players, it doesnt seem to be working for them right now. Hopefully that continues into Wednesday night!

Hard to argue with any of that. I think we have the makings of a pretty decent team that can challenge for top 6 when everyone is fit and available for selection. Circumstances have conspired against us recently and we have had a poor run of results no doubt. You could, and some have, pointed the finger at SK for signing players with a history of injuries (Souare and Obika) or players that have no track record of being good enough at this level (Bair), and that is all fair comment. However, that all has to be taken in the context of who was available to us / willing to sign. Spencer and Biereth look pretty shrewd aquisitions on the loan market. Both players we wouldnt have the resources to sign on permanent deals and we havent really seen enough of Gent to judge him fairly. Shaw similarly hasnt had much gametime to prove himself but as others have said he was a last minute signing to cover for injury. I would expect in the run up to the next international break we will see much more game time for Mika and Butcher will be eased back into the starting line up at the expense of Mugabi. With Miller back we should get back to having more control in the midfield and give us a better platform to impose ourselves on the opposition. Im fully in favour of getting Spencer on the right, but that would mean throwing Gent in at left back, and Im not sure he us ready for that. Big few games coming up. SK needs to show he is capable of transitioning this team and getting the best out it.

Re Ross County. I dont ususally do the "must win game" thing. And in the context of the whole season, it clearly isnt a must win. But in the context of the current run we are on, we really need to stop the slide and do it quickly to prevent confidence being eroded away. This would be a really good time to start.

Not sure how this backs up your point? We were discussing how SOD has done this season for Motherwell. That goal doesnt really compare to any of the goals we have lost this season because the Scotland players are all in position and doing their job. You can say that SOD was culpable for that goal, but I dont recall him being similarly so for us this season. The St Mirren one is the one folk will try and beat him over the head with, but there are 2 players in front of him out of position marking no one causing him to have to come inside to mark the man in front of goal. Thats what leaves the man free at the back. Not just bad defending like the goal above.

The goals that you describe have been caused by players at the front being out of position, forcing everyone in the line to have to move in one to cover whats in front of goal. That leaves the man at the back post looking really stupid. But its not their fault. On one occasion it was Casey that was left high and dry at the back post and he quite rightly went tonto at his team mates. Im hoping putting Butcher back in there sorts that problem out. He is clearly a talker and an organiser. We need that back in our defence.

Aye, wouldnt drop McGinn either. Was really just responding to the question of whether we could play a 4 at the back. Think we are much more likely to stick with the 5. SOD has been much better in a 5, but he still looks a bit awkward on the ball at times and folk cant see past that and his previous performances. I think in our system having Spencer on the right and Gent on the left would make us more dynamic going forward, but neither are our player and it would leave us an issue with SOD again, and he hasnt done that much wrong this season for me. Butcher back in defence for Mugabi and 2 up top seem the most obvious changes sticking with Paton, Slattery and Spittal in midfield.

With Miller out suspended it is definitely an opportunity for SK to change things up a bit in terms of shape. Whether its 3-5-2 or 4-3-3 or some other variation Im not overly fussed. Be interesting to see if Butcher is fit what happens there. I think he and Casey at the back could be secure enough, but that would be harsh on McGinn who has been one of our best players this season. Probably start with the tried and tested with the option to pull a centre half for an extra forward player later in the game if required.....