star sail

I don't think anybody is still of the opinion that we would have been better off with Kettlewell. His time was up. Also I don't think there will be a single poster on here that does not wish MW every success. I think people are reacting to the last 3 games where, had there been a media blackout for a month we could be forgiven for thinking SK was still in the dugout. I thought Wimmer had that all too familiar Motherwell manager ghost look on his face after the game on Saturday. The jovial light-hearted smile has gone now that he realises the enormity of the task. Being positive, we had been really poor under Alexander for months when we needed a reaction against Hearts to clinch Euro qualification and we got it. The same again would be perfect.

Unfortunately I agree with this. It does not have a feeling of having any real longevity at this moment in time.

Likewise, fair enough. I think we were typing at the same time.

It is far too simplistic to say this. You were possibly Kettlewell's most vocal critic and you would have slaughtered him for the last three performances. This squad of players has internationals and the best young player in Scotland in it. It has accumulated 38 points, one shy of Hearts. Is their squad shite too? Only three weeks ago this same squad of players put in a good performance against Dundee and an excellent performance against Rangers. As it stands, Kettlewell had a more impressive start than Wimmer has had. His critics' will say that Van Veen single handedly saved the day but he played KVV to his strengths and reaped the results. I agree that it is absurd to talk about Wimmer being inadequate. I would tend to champion the cause of managers to a fault. I am pleased to read that you are pragmatic in your approach to Wimmer and I hope you continue to give him your patience but the last three performances go beyond the Kettlewell effect. The picture is always way more complicated than that.

It has surprised me a little how honest Wimmer has been about his lack of knowledge of the Scottish game. That is fine if he has an astute footballing brain that can quickly assess the strengths of his own team and the weaknesses of the opponent. There is little sign in the last few games that this is the case. I remember when Baraclough was appointed a Motherwell official commented on how thoroughly prepared he was for interview. He had been meticulous in his preparation. I think an example had been given about him having extensive files on potential signings, one of them being Louis Moult. I am not sure that Managers in the Scottish League are the most sophisticated in world football but they do seem to be street wise and adept at nullifying threat. If Wimmer was able to use an element of surprise in his first few games, that particular honeymoon will be past already. I would like to think that a German manager working at a relatively high level in the past would have that astute footballing brain but we have not seen it in the last three games. The players are clearly running low on confidence. The new manager bounce gave them a lift and we saw in glimpses what they are capable of. Wimmer is going to have to recapture that confidence from the players if the season is going to end with a flourish.

We can argue backwards and forwards about how poor this Motherwell side is but the sending off was the primary reason for the defeat. Even after a poor 25 mins there is still the chance to turn the game around. The sending off killed the game, partly because we were poor anyway but primarily because of the man disadvantage. There surely has to be some belief that your team can get back in the game even after a poor start if you keep a full compliment of players. There were a few posts saying that Hearts would definitely win today. They lost, the 10 men almost certainly being the most significant factor in the loss. This has a feel like the Alexander European season. Terrible from Christmas and then produced a victory against Hearts from nowhere. I am not really concerned about top 6 permutations. What is more important is that a win against Hearts would probably get us over the line from a relegation perspective. To put a different spin on things, if we beat Hearts they will be in a relegation dogfight. They can't be that good if they are in a similar situation to us after 32 games of the season. Anything is possible next weekend as St Johnstone proved today.

Hard to fully judge today's performance because of the sending off. It was really harsh but Balmer does leave his foot in and it gives the ref the option to make the decision. Killie huffed and puffed against 10 men so I don't think we can assume that we would have lost the game if it had been 11 v 11. The teams are so closely matched that a sending off tips the balance. I don't think we will finish 11 th. We will pick up at least one win between now and the end of the season. I would be surprised if 41 points is not enough. No team has any consistency. St Mirren scored 5 last week and lost today. I think Dundee are the best footballing side in the bottom 6. I thought they were very unlucky to lose at FP and they played some nice football in spells. I think they may go on a run after today's result. The other teams are all poor and will trade results. It is sad to see the Wimmer revolution hit the buffers but it is proof for me that a new manager is rarely the solution to all problems. Rangers are proving the same at the moment. It is crazy to think that a victory next weekend could still result in us finishing top 6. It has been yet another weird season.

Thoroughly enjoyed the game last night. The good vibes were back on a midweek evening under the floodlights. Last night proved to me yet again that confidence is such a massive part of the game. There are some decent players in that squad that have been playing with no confidence and last night showed that just a little bit of composure can make all the difference. As an example you could see SOD grow into the game and I have no doubt that he was feeding off the good will from the stands. Proof that shouting at players simply does not work. A word for Dundee. I have seen far worse teams than them take results in the past. There was a spell of 20 minutes in the second half where Dundee looked like a really tidy football team. Generally Motherwell stuck to the task well during that spell. The Motherwell reaction to the equaliser was great to see.

This 100%. I have come to the conclusion that for some, the melodrama and angst the knocking of the team, individual players, the manager, the club is actually their happy place. That is the sport. If there cannot be a doze of positivity, optimism and patience when a new management team comes in then people are not in it for the good vibes. People got what they wanted. Kettlewell is gone. The performance yesterday was better if only slightly. Realism yes. Perpetual pessimism, not for me. Spring is just around the corner. We move to Wednesday night with some hope that a result is possible.

So your saying that it is reasonable to expect that, in the new managers second game in charge, having been in the door just over a week, if the team don't get a result, it will turn ugly? What would ugly look like? Sack the board? Sack the manager? Shout abuse at the players? I know I am a happy clapper and all but even with the most pessimistic of outlooks surely you don't withdraw support after two games? I agree Wednesday is now a massive game but win or lose we have no option but to back the manager and the players to the end of the season.

I did not realise that Dundee Utd had been on a relatively poor run as well. We have not really seen a Jim Goodwin Utd side have to react to adversity yet so that will be interesting. With the two teams hitting a dip in form in recent times, I am going for the new manager bounce to be the difference between the sides. Narrow win for Motherwell by a goal with the Well players being dead on their feet and hanging on for dear life in the last ten having come out the box flying.

I thought he was reserved in his enthusiasm. What he did not seem to say was that everybody was buzzing and excited about Saturday and that the new management team had given everyone a massive lift. There was a hint of realism and managing expectations in the interview. Maybe that is a good thing. It is easy to read too much into these interviews however. How many times have we heard the great week training/ lads buzzing to go comments only to witness flat and insipid performances on the Saturday.

The man himself SOD has been interviewed ahead of the Dundee Utd game. It is easy to read too much into things but he is normally very composed and assured when being interviewed and I got the sense that he was a little edgier in the interview and may be feeling a little out of his comfort zone at the moment. This is possibly very natural. I think there is no doubt that the senior players SOD, Halliday and Watt are big personalities in that dressing room and may have been given significant say under the previous management team. My personal opinion was that it was not an unreserved welcome with open arms to the new management team from him but admittedly he does have a tightrope to walk I suppose. Interesting times.

I agree with what you say but I think a dose of confidence will do wonders for a number of the players including the ones you mention. Let's hope the new men can inject some positivity and confidence into the full squad.

SOD has been one of the most divisive players at the club for some time.. He seemed to rub a small section of our support up the wrong way from the beginning and has not really recovered. Even this comment gets a couple of laughs and a confused emoji. The fact is that before his injury problems he was playing for Scotland in the Euros. The strange thing is, that even then some Well fans just would not back him. What should have been a source of pride for the club became a source of contention amongst the fans. It is a really strange one. He has struggled to find form and consistency in recent times there is no doubt but the statement above seems very reasonable. It will be very interesting to see if Wimmer sticks with him and SOD can recapture some form. Surely that is something all Well fans would welcome?

Welcome Michael Wimmer. I don't think the playing squad is a major concern. There are some decent players in the squad who are clearly lacking in confidence. If the new manager can inject some confidence into the team, identify the best playing position for each player and provide more balance in terms of formation then I this team could just as easily finish 3rd as 11th. Aberdeen's season proves how confidence is king, particularly in a league as tight as ours. Much could depend on how he manages the senior players. I am reminded of Jim Gannon alienating Craigan, Lasley and Hammell. If O Donnell, Watt, Halliday need some tough love then it will require some subtle management skills. I think we will be back to wimming ways soon (sorry Weeyin!).

He successfully managed Maritimo (sp), a Madeiran island team playing in the Portuguese league. Madeira is my favourite holiday destination so this links Grizzly's holiday chat with the manager thread. It is a dead cert!!!

Van Der Gaag? That's my rather hopeful guess.

I think I made the I heard it comment. There was a boy standing right beside me at Perth who shouted ' get tae f**K Kettlewell, you useless c**t' He looked as if he was about to explode with anger. I may have been very unlucky that I was standing beside the only Motherwell fan in the entire stadium making these comments but given that Kettlewell has subsequently resigned I don't think that was a single comment in isolation. I think football is possibly the only environment left where a comment like that is considered reasonable and where fellow supporters will try and defend it.

I think it was a double hit wellgirl. It was actually quite well done. Off the inside of both posts and in. Don't let it get to you. You and I (and a few others) have taken a view over the last few days that has proved to be fairly unpopular. It does not necessary make it wrong but the flack does come with it. It's all part of the discussion.

The lack of empathy and social conscience is staggering. I just listened to the Caldwell interview. This is not some made up shit. He looked genuinely saddened by the whole sorry affair. Not spin, not propaganda. One of his hard working work colleagues has had to resign because the fans that are there to support turned on him. We are talking about a guy who was coming into his work at 6.30am every morning and leaving at 7pm every night quiting because the pressures of the job has taken it's toll. His crime was to have hit a rocky spell in both results and performance. Like every football manager he has paid a heavy price. This is not a man who has landed on his feet. He has lost his job. He has not played some kind of tactical blinder as I have read more than once on this forum over the last few days. He will almost certainly be going through a difficult time just now both mentally and emotionally. He would have to be to walk away from his job in the way he has. The abuse from the fans is real. Not some made up conspiracy against the poor Motherwell fans because they are not fashionable. Just because Celtic and Rangers might be worse, does not make the behaviour of the Motherwell fans acceptable. I was at Perth. I heard it and saw the behaviours for myself. Not a tiny minority but a significant minority if not possibly even a majority. Let's not pretend this is a Kettlewell phenomenon. Baraclough, Robinson, Alexander suffered the very same fate. The icing on the cake for me has been reading on this forum some of the more reasonably minded going to great lengths to justify the fans behaviour and taking the petted lip because the victim of the abuse and the media have dared to even question these behaviours. I have been drifting as a Well fan for a while. I just don't have the sense of pride and identity with the club that I used to have. Age and a changing world view plays a major factor in that l admit. I may well be the one out of step now with the general footballing fraternity but I am happy to be so. I just cannot relate anymore to the attitudes I have seen expressed in recent days. What this incident has proved to me is football fans are generally the same regardless of the club they support. Same attitudes, same mindset just a different coloured flag.

I remember listening to Leeann Dempster talking about that retrospectively and I am sure she said that she regretted the way the club handled the situation. She seemed to imply that Hibs had jumped the gun a little by suspending him. I think she also said that she still had a good relationship with him and held him in high regard.

I agree with you about his second spell at Celtic. It was generally a bit of a disaster. He had a very good first spell however and for a time had Celtic competing with the likes of AC Milan in the Champions League. I think he would have the tactical awareness that SK lacked. Like Dennyc just mentioned, I know a few Hibs fans who talk positively about his time with them. I think a motivated NL could be a big success. If he was to go through the motions however and potentially be wrestling a few of the demons he has clearly struggled with in the past, it could be a disaster. Of the two my preference would be Scott Brown. I think he would be highly motivated to make a success of the job.

I think Scott Brown would be a very interesting choice. I would also be happy with Neil Lennon. They both have a winning mentality and have both played the game at the highest level. NL has Champions League management experience. I am sure our fans would accept him if the football became more enjoyable again. Lennon could actually be like a Craig Brown appointment. A wealth of experience and a strong reputation in the game. I did not ever get the sense that McCall was not accepted at Motherwell. In fact, I would think most Well fans will remember him with a great deal of goodwill.

Nnnnooooooo!! I think it would be difficult to live through all of this again. Anyway we will be busy putting the pressure on our own new man.