Kmcalpin

Oh ye of little faith.

Odd, as he doesn't seem to tick any of the boxes. Maybe we've just offered him training facilities.

He will be after both.

I suspect these lads at Tannadice have received a better financial package than that.

OK so we had 5 pre season games, but its not just the number of games that count in the number of full 90 minutes that players have racked up. By my reckoning only 4 played a full 90 minutes in the Fulham game. How many of our lads racked up a full 90 minutes in each game. Apart maybe from the first game when its fine to chop and change players, surely we should expect our starting line up to have played a full 90 minutes in about 3/4 games.

If we're not that good where does that leave Scottish football? Minnows compared to who exactly? We're one of the biggest clubs in Scotland - probably in the top 8 size wise.

In the main, pretty much the same factors as last season then?

Yes. Both he and Iain Vigurs performed best when in a 5 man midfield. Its been a different set up at Fir Park

For whatever reason, this is the club's preferred route. Its happened time and again. I don't know whether its impossible to bring in decent players early, whether the club is trying to shave summer costs off the wage bill or whether we simply don't take European football seriously enough - maybe its a combination of all three. What I would say is that in terms of European football it does not work. I suspect the club takes the view that our European participation will only be temporary so its not worth the additional input in terms of finance, personnel changes etc. Its better to wait to bring in the kind of of player we're looking for. This season it looks as though disruption to 3 key positions (goalie, centre back and striker) has proved very costly. Possible mistake in signing Twardzik, and no progress in filling the other 2 slots. Stuart McCall is very risk averse as Steve Diggle said. That's all very well if you have the means and personnel at your disposal to implement this approach but we don't and haven't had in the past 3 years. As far as Dundee United is concerned I'm not so sure they've wiped out their debt. When pressed they've been very coy about how reduction was achieved. Maybe soft loans? Rumours that investors bought stakes in high value players.

Steady there. Folk are quite entitled to their opinion without being labelled fools. I too have been going to Fir Park for over 50 years and whilst our league performances have been some of the best in that time our cup performances have been some of the worst. Whilst criticism is quite acceptable I certainly agree that derogatory comments are out of order. Currently our fan base is split on the issue probably 3 ways - each to their own I say. Time will tell.

Seems a talented well respected lad but his injury problems have been horrific sorry to say. A risk.

Agree with a lot of that Noah, but like Keith Lasley, he often disappeared when the going got tough last season. Now that may be because he's a young player and inexperienced, time will tell. To be fair to him and Keith, he's suffered because of the unbalanced midfield set up we played last season ie little or no pace. If you are going to play him then he needs someone pacy beside him and creativity elsewhere in engine room.

Good post with which many will agree. I also agree about Ainsworth but why is this? Is he carrying a long term injury or is it something else? Odd.

Two points. Firstly Stuart McCall - I'm not the protesting outside Fir Park type, and don't want him sacked today. However given his contract is up for renewal at the end of the season I think we should wait to assess his performance this season, before offering him a new deal. Undoubtedly he's done well in the long haul of the league and credit to him for that. The flipside is that he's managed the team to some horrendous defeats in the various cup competitions, where his team selection and tactics were seriously flawed. One or two such defeats whilst not palatable could be accepted but not as many as he's been involved in. So overall his managerial performance has been a mixed bag for me. Secondly Keith Lasley. I must admit to being gobsmacked by the reaction on the net to him. I've never been a big fan of his as some know well and could never quite get his cult status. His determination on the field and loyalty are beyond question in my book. A thoroughly decent guy. However he has always badly lacked pace and all too often in my book gone missing when we're under the cosh. Fans have questioned why our midfield disappeared when other teams attacked but failed to get that Keith was an integral part of that central midfield. A month or two back I questioned why he was being offered a 2 year at his age and was castigated for it. Others are now asking the same question. I'm surprised by how quickly some fans have turned on him. OK he performed poorly against Starnjan and his mistakes were critical but our problems ran far deeper than that. Any questions now about Keith Lasley should be directed at the management team. It may be his performance will improve short term as he gets fitter and hopefully it will.

That may be what you meant I don't know, but it certainly isn't the way that it came across, due to your choice of words. For what its worth I'd like to know the fans' reaction, not just those on the charter. From the limited feedback I've had it was very much anger as opposed to feeling down, especially about tactics and preparation. That at least gives me some hope. It demonstrates that the support still has a lot of passion.

We'll know for sure in 3/4 years time. Certainly something has gone wrong with our youth system in past years, and especially since John Park left, although he was a hard act to follow.

Some good posts on Fir Park Corner just now. One particular one concerned Stuart McCall. His contract is up for renewal at the end of this season. He'll be looking around and we should do the same. He has achieved much in the league but has made just too many cup cock ups. One particular criticism that seems to carry weight is that he doesn't learn from his mistakes. I'd give him this season to see if he can change that and lead us to a degree of success in the cups (draws permitting). By that I don't necessarily mean winning silverware although that would be great. Personally I'd be prepared to sacrifice a very high league finish for strong performances in the cups. Irrespective of the above, some kind of review needs to take place this season to examine the way the club is run. We seem to be making just too many mistakes on and off the field.

At 2-2 we were never going to win on penalties, so yes attack was our best option, but only if you have attackers on the pitch. As we all know this game threw up a number of questions. One I'd like to add is whether or not we had a representative at the Starnjan V Bangor game as both SM and KB were in Portugal - bad planning in itself. The occasional Cup cock up is hard to take at the best of times but they happen to us just too frequently and are proving very costly indeed. We've probably now racked up somewhere £1m and £2m in recent years. The club could have used that cash. This warrants some kind of review surely?

I would never criticise or belittle any Well fan for following the team. If anything I admire their dedication. If that is your attitude you must seriously question why you visit these boards.

So we entered extra time looking for a goal with the only attacking players being Sutton & Vigurs, with Keith Lasley playing up front!!! Incredible.

True to a point, but that's only part of the picture. It wasn't addressed in our cup defeats to Rangers, Aberdeen, Albion Rovers, Celtic and Starnjan.

Great post Alan. I'm sick to death of reading about "our wee club" or "punching above our weight". Irrespective of how bad or good we are we should always look to improve and learn from our mistakes.

To quote Lobey Dosser "Who is at fault for failing to organise friendlies? Who is at fault for failing to replace 3 of our highest earners in advance of a lucrative tie against part time opposition? Answer these questions and then you can then turn your attention to the shortcomings of management and players. Not for the first time, McCall has got his preparation and tactics for a cup game horribly wrong but he has been hung out to dry this summer. " Yes these are all legitimate questions which I myself have been asking. It may be that Stuart McCall has been knocked back by the powers that be on various factors - we just don't know. What is clear now is that our Euro Cup exit was a disaster in the making. Overall I agree with El Grew. Stuart McCall joined us with a mixed track record and that has continued at Fir Park. As far as the league is concerned he has done extremely well - no argument from me on that score. However as far as cups and other competitions are concerned he has done very poorly, probably disastrously. The deciding factor for me though is the long running serial weaknesses which he has been unable or unwilling to address. We all know they include a leaky defence, an imbalanced midfield and latterly poor goalkeepers. Over the past 2 close seasons we've seen questionable 2 year deals handed out to Steve Hammell, Keith Lasley, Paul Lawson and Bob McHugh (for various reasons). Probably now time to change direction. I believe that the management team are contracted for a further year. It is up to the club management how the next 12 months and longer are handled.

St Johnstone seem to be doing ok on a more limited budget. The problem with youth systems is that you have to take long time horizons, unless you're like Dundee United. The success or otherwise of our current set up won't become evident for another 4/5/6 years. You mentioned Mark McGhee - any benefit he reaped was based on the work of his predecessors. We're now reaping the rewards of his input. Of the young players we have released how many have gone onto better things?

I'm not overly impressed with Stuart Carswell. To me he's developing into another Marc Fitzpatrick. A good engine on him but designed more for endurance than speed. Does a lot of routine spade work but that's it. Last week, unlike most I thought he had a mixed game. A better second half than first admittedly; but guilty early on of getting caught on the ball too often and poor distribution. Don't know about last night. The jury is still out on him in my view.