David

Hopefully we aren't looking for a new manager any time soon, but if and when the time comes, I think the title of the thread should be "Our New Manager, who should he look like?"

Oh, it's definitely a minority of fans. And to be fair, I equate those who moan on social media as being the same as me moaning about a game in the pub. Which is fine. Anyone who gets bent out of shape about a social media post that is critical of you as a manager or player within the confines of common decency is probably a little bit precious. I just don't get the end game of the abuse being dished out from the stands. I've yet to hear a post-game interview which goes along the lines of: Reporter: "Well Player A, you were trailing 2-0 at half time and playing terribly. How did you manage to come out in the second half and turn it around for a 4-2 win?" Player: "Well, I have to give a ton of credit to the group of fans sitting in the stand who absolutely lost the rag and proceeded to call me and the other lads absolute f*%&#%g c*$^s while spraying spittle and venom all over anyone sitting close to them. Without them acting like total t*ts every time we misplaced a pass or getting on our backs whenever we had the sheer audacity to play the ball sideways or backwards, it wouldn't have been possible to come back. It's what football is all about, really. I just wish my dad and my son had seen our fourth goal, but they left after my son burst into tears hearing a bunch of grown men who should know better hurling abuse at his old man, but hey, that's the beauty of football!" Anyway, the new man is in place. Let's leave Kettlewell to his interviews, media appearances and possibly the Thistle job. Good luck to the guy.

Absolutely. One thing I’d point out is that it’s often an older crowd who get involved in this sort of thing. Funnily enough, it's not the younger element that gets such a bad rap most times, and is generally looked down upon. There's always the hope that the vitriol and high levels of abuse die out with the generation that seems to be most involved. Hopefully the younger generation aren't quite so stupid.

If there’s one positive to take from this, it’s the attention drawn to the abuse that was handed out. Whatever the reasons for him leaving, his attitude, or what anyone thinks of him, maybe it’s time for that small group of fans to reflect and ask themselves why they believe behaving like that at football matches is acceptable. I’ve seen plenty of people online saying, “That’s just football.” And while it’s true that this kind of thing happens elsewhere and is often brushed aside, it doesn’t make it right. There were plenty of things that happened at football 15–20 years ago that people shrugged off as “just how it is” — and we now look back on those moments with embarrassment. Hopefully, one day, we’ll feel the same about this sort of behaviour. As for Kettlewell, I wish him well. Listening to him speak, I’m not convinced management is the right fit, and I reckon a lot of clubs will feel the same. As a coach, he’s clearly capable. I hope he finds something that makes him happy and that his family are doing well. But we move on.

I know the subject was done to death in the summer, so I won't go back over it, but trust me, it could and likely would have been much worse.

There’s plenty fans may want to critique about Kettlewell – his tactics, his signings, his approach to matches – and that’s entirely fair. Everyone’s entitled to their own opinion. However, to claim he has no respect for the supporters feels quite off the mark. He’s done, and continues to do, a great deal for the fanbase. Whether it’s engaging with the Society, collaborating with various supporters’ group, or taking the time to accommodate requests that most would understandably pass on, especially given the pressures of his role, his commitment is evident. To be clear, I’m not suggesting that people shouldn’t challenge his decisions as a manager. But when it comes to his regard for the fans, I don’t believe that’s something we can fairly call into question.

Absolutely, he’s the one responsible for securing the wins we need to get things back on track. No debate about that. At the moment, I’m relatively calm about the situation. If we were at full strength, with our best XI on the pitch, and still performing poorly, then I’d be seriously concerned. But I think things will balance out as players begin to return to the squad. What I will say is that before Miller, Oxborough, Stama, and McGinn (yet again) picked up injuries, I genuinely thought we had a chance of pushing for a top-six finish. Given the extent of the injuries we’ve sustained and the time these players are expected to be sidelined, I reckon we’re more likely to finish around 7th or 8th. Not ideal, but it’s far from disastrous.

To be fair, I’m not convinced St Johnstone or Hearts supporters would be staging those protests if their team were sitting fifth in the table with a cup semi-final under their belts. I fully appreciate the frustrations about performances—truth be told, we’ve not been anywhere near good enough. Most fans are being reasonable in their criticism, but there are a few speaking as if we’re rock bottom of the league and nine points adrift.

If it really is as simple as you make it sound, I wonder why the club don't just sack him and hire someone from this forum to do the job 😂

What would we say are the KPIs set for the manager at the start of the season?

We'll find out where we are headed. It's on the manager and the players to start putting some points on the board. To be fair, when we defeated St Johnstone in that match, we had our first-choice goalkeeper, our captain was still fit, Miller was available, and so was Robinson. At that time, we had plenty of options when it came to personnel. Of course, it’s the manager’s job to cope with injuries, but you can’t deny there will be a dip in quality when you lose players of that calibre.

Nobody knows where we’ll end up, though. Let’s say we lose this weekend, and Hibs manage a win away at County. Suddenly, we’d drop from 5th to 6th. Would the manager be sacked for that? If so, I’d have some serious questions for the club. Chief among them would be: who’s taking over? I’d assume there’s someone better lined up, ready to step in and make an immediate difference? Because for a club like ours to sack the manager while sitting in the top six would be absolutely baffling. Given all the hand-wringing over a supposed “financial gap” during the summer, I’d also want to know the cost of letting the manager—and presumably his coaching staff—go mid-season. Now, if we were down in 11th, fair enough, that’s a different conversation. But in the top six? Is that really where we’ve set the bar for managers at Motherwell? Have we reached the point where making it to a cup semi-final and being in the top half of the table doesn’t guarantee job security? If so, I’d seriously question the judgement of those making these decisions. For me, it’s about keeping our heads above water, and seeing how things improve once our key injured players are back in the fold. When the season’s over, by all means, let’s reflect on what worked and what didn’t. But making drastic changes mid-season? That should only ever be an absolute last resort.

Would it really be all that shocking if we managed to beat St Johnstone this weekend? How many times have we been written off, told we’re on the decline, and destined to come away with nothing, only to turn it around and notch up a few wins? The reality is, if you take Celtic, Rangers, and perhaps Aberdeen out of the equation, the rest of the teams could face each other ten times and likely split the wins evenly, five apiece. As things stand, we’re sitting in the top six. That’s not speculation or me trying to predict what might happen—it’s simply the truth. We’ve won more matches than every team below us. Again, that’s a fact. This is where we find ourselves at the moment. Could we slip down the table and end up 11th? It’s possible, but the same could be said for most of the sides around us and below. If it comes to that, then it’s a conversation we’ll need to have.

I'm not sure there's anything to buy in that regard. Or even an argument. We are sitting 5th. That's just a fact. Only the teams above us have won more games this season.

If that turns out to be the case, a conversation will likely take place. However, at present, that’s purely speculative. Just as easily, we could win at the weekend, Hibs might drop points, and we’d find ourselves four or five points clear of the team in sixth. At the same time, if Aberdeen were to lose or draw against St Mirren, we wouldn’t be far off fourth place. There’s a range of possibilities over the coming weeks, some positive, others less so. Let's see how it plays out.

I could see it happening very easily if we ended up in a playoff spot, which is where you'd think we are going by some of the reactions over recent weeks. Today’s performance, though, was absolutely dreadful—no two ways about it—and both the manager and players need to take responsibility for that. That said, we’re currently sitting in fifth place in the league. Yes, I understand we might drop down the table, we could end up in the playoffs, and so on. But I’m not interested in speculation—I’m focused on where we are right now, and that’s fifth. I don’t believe he is. He’s likely relying on the points I mentioned earlier: we’re sitting fifth in the table with more wins than half the teams in the league. Of course, that could change, and if it does, I’m sure the situation will be reassessed. But for now? I don’t think the club would consider letting him go. The last time we parted ways with a manager who had us in fifth place, it triggered a difficult period where we were burdened by paying off ex-managers’ wages and the like. In my opinion, unless things completely fall apart, we should wait until the end of the season to take stock. If we choose to move on at that point, there will be a broader pool of candidates available, and a new manager would have time to assemble their own team. Right now just isn’t the moment for a change.

I think the situation with Trump was quite different, as it centred around social media and the algorithms that amplify the echo chamber effect. If you’re on X, for instance, and you’re a Democrat reading and sharing views aligned with your beliefs, the platform feeds you similar content. It’s easy to start thinking that what you’re seeing reflects a broader societal perspective. What I’m saying is that across both forums, you get a fairly decent snapshot of the fanbase as a whole. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to suggest that the majority of fans are feeling a bit fed up with how we’re playing at the moment, for a variety of reasons. That said, most people seem to acknowledge we’re in a relatively good position and hold out hope that things will improve. Meanwhile, a vocal minority with a more negative outlook tends to get more attention than their numbers would suggest. Wouldn’t that description also fit the three stands at Fir Park during any given home game right now? I’m not claiming that every Motherwell fan is active on a forum, but the small sample size does seem to reflect what we’re seeing from the wider fanbase. What I’ve described isn’t far off what I think the majority of supporters are feeling at the moment—or at least, that’s my impression. Unless, of course, I’ve completely missed the mark. In any case, it’s not that big of a deal. Just more of an observation than anything else.

That’s why I specifically mentioned forums “like this one” and not just this one in isolation. I genuinely believe that the opinions expressed across both platforms give us a fairly accurate reflection of what our wider fanbase is thinking—particularly now that some of the more obvious trolls have been put on moderation. Of course, we can’t be entirely certain, as there’s no definitive way to prove it. It’s simply my perspective.

Whether we like it or not, this forum is a mirror of our broader fanbase. Forums like this one are a small-scale representation of the wider support in the real world. Admittedly, the more negative voices may be louder here than they are in the stadium, but they still exist in comparable proportions, in my opinion.

I'm pretty certain that would not be the case. In nearly forty years of following Motherwell, I can count on one hand the times fans have walked away from a cup defeat saying, "Well, we lost to a team destined for relegation, but at least we went down fighting! Fair play to the manager and players for that effort!" We all know that even if we do win, there’ll be the usual crowd reluctant to offer any sort of credit to the team or the manager. Instead, it’ll be a discussion of how poor the opposition were, how we should have beaten them anyway, and the usual nitpicking about aspects of our performance. And of course, we can’t forget the classic, “Why don’t we play like that every week?” if we happen to put in a good shift and everything clicks for us.

That’s an excellent point. We should also consider that the pool of available midfielders in January is likely to be quite limited, especially for a club that can’t afford to spend millions or offer substantial wages. Additionally, as Joe mentioned, we’ve got a few midfielders currently sidelined with injuries who are expected to return at various points this season. The key question is: what’s the standard of midfielders available right now in the January window? Is the quality we need even out there? Furthermore, among those who meet the required standard, how many would actually be keen to join a club where competition for places could become very intense once others regain fitness? Many larger clubs insist on guaranteed game time for players they send out on loan, which may complicate matters. I suspect this is why West Ham recalled Hegyi. There are a lot of variables to consider, and I believe our style of play and formation are heavily influenced by the players we have fit and ready for selection.

I’ve never paid much attention to him before, but looking at his recent stats, am I overlooking something? He played 37 matches last season, 36 the season prior, and 41 the season before that. Is he typically seen as an injury risk?

No worries, it happens to us all at some point, the discussions are so back & forth it's easy to do. While I wouldn’t describe it as "severe," I do believe the issue of ownership plays a role. I’m as much of a supporter of our fan ownership model as anyone—of course, I am—but it does impact our ability to compete with clubs that are backed by wealthy owners or majority shareholders. That’s simply the reality of the situation. I’m not complaining about it, particularly since, in the main, we’ve outperformed those clubs where it truly counts—on the pitch. As we’ve seen, spending more on players doesn’t necessarily guarantee success. However, it’s undeniable that if a club has greater financial resources and uses them wisely, it’s more likely to achieve better results than those with less funds at their disposal. That said, our recent track record shows we’re actually doing quite well against the clubs around us, for the most part. Do bear in mind that having higher staffing costs doesn’t automatically mean we’re paying, or even in a position to pay, more in player wages or transfer fees compared to the other clubs you’ve mentioned. On the deficits you’ve pointed out, it’s worth highlighting the role ownership plays in that. For instance, a club like Kilmarnock benefits from Billy Bowie, who has the ability to dip into his own resources to cover such shortfalls. We, on the other hand, don’t have that luxury, which is precisely why we need to be cautious about overextending ourselves on player salaries. It’s vital to ensure we avoid putting the club at risk of financial difficulties. There’s a distinction to be made between an unforeseen, urgent expense and choosing to commit to a cost for a player when it isn’t a necessity, isn’t there? And while it’s true that the Society has funds in reserve, I’m not entirely convinced the board would have been willing to allocate as much as £140,000 of members’ contributions to fund the wages of a player we'd only have at the club on loan. I’m not entirely sure about the situation with Hibs and Hearts, to be honest. However, when it comes to us and other clubs in a similar position, I believe it largely comes down to the financial support that owners or majority shareholders at those clubs can offer. They often have that safety net to fall back on if needed, whereas we simply don’t have that luxury. In a way, that’s not necessarily a bad thing. We’re forced to operate within our means, which is how it should be. Clubs that spend beyond their income tend to end up in serious trouble sooner or later—unless, of course, there’s someone willing to absorb the debts.

Did you see where I said the following? So we are competing. And more often than not, we're bettering them.