LadywellToi Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 A real standing comparison I'd make would be England, some League 1 and League 2 teams will have average attendances similar to us, and terracing will be perfectly ok, but because our team is in the top division we need to sit down? I'd say its because in the division we play in of 12, 7 of the clubs have played in European competition in the past few years. UEFA makes the rules and we have to jump to their tune otherwise you don't play or you have to hire another ground. The difference with English 3rd or 4th tier teams is that unless they win the FA or League Cup they aren't ever going to be involved in European competition so adhering to UEFA dictates is something they never have to think about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 The problem for me isn't so much the actual idea of moving, it's more the idea of where we're moving to. I'm not keen on the Ravenscraig site. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inthebasement Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 If we had an old failing ground on land the value of which would fund a stadium the majority of the fans would love then moving would be the obvious answer. That is not the situation we are in. We have a brilliant, historic, central, ground with one failing stand and pitch issues. Over the next ten year FP needs only to replace the O'Donnell, with something comparable but contemporary, shift to a top range artificial pitch (as most Scottish clubs will anyway) and stick standing areas across the length of the East. This will have to funded in the slow boring way that these things are always funded. I think a lot of the support for moving comes from the same impatience for change for changes sake that sees some sections of our support go mental and bang on about 'disgrace' every bloody year because we haven't signed enough players, or got the new strip out, or whatever. I mean, Amonvale, are you fxcking joking, that would break my heart. Sober assessment - we are a wee club in a run down area with a 5k home support, we do not need a hotel or a dedicated train line. We do need to address a stand and pitch which have become tired and uneconomic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john_M_F_C Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 I'd say its because in the division we play in of 12, 7 of the clubs have played in European competition in the past few years. UEFA makes the rules and we have to jump to their tune otherwise you don't play or you have to hire another ground. The difference with English 3rd or 4th tier teams is that unless they win the FA or League Cup they aren't ever going to be involved in European competition so adhering to UEFA dictates is something they never have to think about. Our past European runs haven't lasted more than 3 home games would it be worth installing safe standing sections? When perhaps just making the likes of the end section an old style terrace, like AaFK and OB. The sections would of course be left dormant in European sell outs like Nancy perhaps losing some revenue, but given the chances of that sort game happening and the initial outlay of safe standing would it be worth spending it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjw Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 The problem for me isn't so much the actual idea of moving, it's more the idea of where we're moving to. I'm not keen on the Ravenscraig site. I cycle through it twice a day to and from work and it always seems to be the coldest and windiest part of my journey.I know it may change with time but we have to remember all the building work on it is about 3 years behind schedule. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ya Bezzer! Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 At the end of the day if something is hugely beneficial and possible it will happen. The fact that Motherwell will be playing next season at Fir Park and the season after that and the season after that proves that such a move is either not hugely beneficial or not possible. Someone mentioned it earlier but right now there is a sort of 'Hysteria of Change' around in society as a whole, where everyone wants instant change in everything without actually looking into the real and practical problems that changing something actually entails. For a realistic look at what moving from Fir Park would actually mean forget about St. Mirren, St. Mirren got an unbelievable, once-a-life-time deal on their land which won't be replicated by the sale of Fir Park. Think instead of Falkirk. Falkirk got £9 million for the sale of their stadium, probably at least twice, if not three times, what we would be likely to sell Fir Park for. In that time they have been relegated from the Premier League into the 1st Division and are currently in a perilous financial state, barely able to support a squad of 16 players. The stadium which was started in 2004 is to date still not complete with 3 stands built and one temporary stand. For a number of seasons two sides of the stadium were open. The ground has required bail outs by the local council, the company that runs it has been rumored to be staving off liquidation and the club do not own the ground themselves which means they have to get approval for any plans they want to develop, leading to huge delays and financial mismanagement. Put it simply the club is now in a very serious financial position because of its move, which was more necessary due to the condition of Brockville and at least initially better funded than any move we could realistically hope for. We live in the real world not Sim City. Any plan to move away from Fir Park carries with it huge financial risks that could take 10, 15, 20 years to remedy. If that's what you want for a slightly less scuffed plastic seat, fine, but at least accept you'd be leading the club down a razors edge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 We have a brilliant, historic, central, ground with one failing stand and pitch issues. Over the next ten year FP needs only to replace the O'Donnell, with something comparable but contemporary, shift to a top range artificial pitch (as most Scottish clubs will anyway) and stick standing areas across the length of the East. We should put this guy in charge of the stadium redevelopment I reckon. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadywellToi Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 Our past European runs haven't lasted more than 3 home games would it be worth installing safe standing sections? When perhaps just making the likes of the end section an old style terrace, like AaFK and OB. The sections would of course be left dormant in European sell outs like Nancy perhaps losing some revenue, but given the chances of that sort game happening and the initial outlay of safe standing would it be worth spending it? There is merit to that John, as you say a club of our size and success would need all seater for what? 5% of our total games. I suppose the SFA/SPL would like it if every Scottish club had all seater as its no doubt something they'd put on their promotional material and reinforces our 5 star status they go on about all the time. Personally I've always thought if we introduced a 3/4 seat like they have in bus shelters such as this: A seat where you effectively lean on it to take the weight off your feet, no moving parts to get broken. The benefits of these for me is they allow a higher density of fans as they would take up less space and come between a full seating position and standing hopefully placating everyone, while maintaining the back of stand to pitch movement of fans to avoid crushing. I think these would work a treat in the East, however you'd keep the standard seats in the Cooper and Main to satisfy their patrons who now prefer a seat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobra Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 I really hope we stay at Fir Park. Appreciate it has its problems but it is distinctive and unique in terms of football stadia. Most of all, simply the history of the place, I'd love to be able to take my kids to the ground one day and sit in the same spot! The place holds so many special memories for all the fans. If we were to move it would have to be to somewhere special and unique. I'd imagine, however, that we'd do it on the cheap. Would hate to end up in one of these bland, out of town developments that most clubs of similar size end up in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiderpig Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 I really hope we stay at Fir Park. Appreciate it has its problems but it is distinctive and unique in terms of football stadia. Most of all, simply the history of the place, I'd love to be able to take my kids to the ground one day and sit in the same spot! The place holds so many special memories for all the fans. If we were to move it would have to be to somewhere special and unique. I'd imagine, however, that we'd do it on the cheap. Would hate to end up in one of these bland, out of town developments that most clubs of similar size end up in. History should be exactly that we need to look forward and not back, this is the 21st century peoples tastes have changed there are loads more opportunities for them to spend their leisure cash and time than there were 30 or 40 years ago. Lets not forget that Motherwell FC is a business these days and it has to be run as such so that means attracting as many people as possible to the ground to generate income. This means the facilities on offer need to be good, catering, saftey, comfort etc. If all this can be achieved by moving to a new purpose built stadium then it needs to happen, forget all the sentimental pish about the history of the ground, sitting in the same spot etc, i am old enough to remember some of the shite holes i used to go to to watch Motherwell, Brockville, Kilbowie, Broomfield and many others. I dont want to go back to that and i am sure many other fans have the same opinion, if we have genuine ambitions of being Scotlands community club, then we need a stadium the community can be proud of, Fir Park is past its best, its time we got started on the Ravenscraig arena. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weeyin Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 I really doubt that new facilities are going to attract more people back to the game. The 2 deciding factors are price and product on the park. I would much rather watch Falkirk v Motherwell for a tenner (standing) at the old Brockville than Motherwell v St. Mirren for 20+ quid in a wee plastic seat at the 'New Ravenscraig'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 I really doubt that new facilities are going to attract more people back to the game. The 2 deciding factors are price and product on the park. If we did move to the Ravenscraig site, the location would maybe play a part. It's easy to underestimate how far into that area you need to walk from the bus stop to get even close to the new sportscentre, for example. I don't think it's the best choice of venue. Too out of the way for my liking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busta Nut Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 has this thread ended in a scrap yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiderpig Posted July 18, 2011 Report Share Posted July 18, 2011 Anyone still unsure about why we need to move from Fir park, should have sat in the POD on Saturday, and seen for themselves the state of the place. We had a decent turn out of Leeds fans in the POD a couple of hundred mile round trip to sit on seats covered in Pigeon shite, rubbish that looked as though it had been there since the last home game last season, broken seats, catering points that are too small and run out of pies etc. I have just renewed my season ticket, £380 to sit on Crappy manky seats, that have not been cleaned in years ffs !!. I cant judge the East stand (assuming the South and Cooper are ok) but i suspect its just as bad. Fir park is dirty, tired and well past its best its time to go and build a new stadium we can be proud of. The slogan in May was "Time for new Hero's" we should be building a stadium fit for hero's, we should go and go soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john_M_F_C Posted July 18, 2011 Report Share Posted July 18, 2011 Anyone still unsure about why we need to move from Fir park, should have sat in the POD on Saturday, and seen for themselves the state of the place. We had a decent turn out of Leeds fans in the POD a couple of hundred mile round trip to sit on seats covered in Pigeon shite, rubbish that looked as though it had been there since the last home game last season, broken seats, catering points that are too small and run out of pies etc. I have just renewed my season ticket, £380 to sit on Crappy manky seats, that have not been cleaned in years ffs !!. I cant judge the East stand (assuming the South and Cooper are ok) but i suspect its just as bad. Fir park is dirty, tired and well past its best its time to go and build a new stadium we can be proud of. The slogan in May was "Time for new Hero's" we should be building a stadium fit for hero's, we should go and go soon. The pigeons will indeed not shite on a new stadium, lets build it now and nip this pigeon fiasco in the bud. As for the pies, I can imagine as it's a pre season game they were unsure of what they would sell. Sure they'd rather sell out their pies than have spares at the end. What your suggesting though is like buying a new car 'cos you can't be fucked cleaning the old one. All it'd take is getting afew people in and scrub the seats every now and then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amber_nectar Posted July 18, 2011 Report Share Posted July 18, 2011 Is the plan to let Fir Park fall into such disrepair that the board will find it easier to persuad us that a new stadium is the only option? The thought of having a stadium to be proud of would be great but what chances of this actually happening.? A stadium to be proud of 20 million, a lego stadium 10-12 million. Probably the lego one then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dosser1886 Posted July 18, 2011 Report Share Posted July 18, 2011 Was firmly in the let's move camp, but after being at the old place again on Saturday I'm starting to change my mind. Must be getting nostalgic in my old age. Find the money to replace or upgrade the East & POD stands, one at a time over time - hell even level the pitch, yeah I know where the fuck is that money going to come from but I have real fears of what kind of stadium we would realistically end up with and what it would would do to the club if we moved to Ravenscraig. If we had a core support of 20,000 that go week in week out then I'm all for it, seeing as we have a core of around 3,500 I can't see why it is worth the hassle or how it would work financially. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfc Posted July 18, 2011 Report Share Posted July 18, 2011 sell murphy for £5 million and build a new east and POD stand Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StipeIsGod Posted July 18, 2011 Report Share Posted July 18, 2011 Put simply for me - Heart - Stay. Head - Move. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe90 Posted July 18, 2011 Report Share Posted July 18, 2011 i would watch motherwell dwn the calder park.for me it dosent matter if we stay or go,fir park needs upgrading there is no doubt about it.but it is and has been for a very long time our home, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted July 31, 2011 Report Share Posted July 31, 2011 After visiting Rugby Park yesterday I was thinking that a stadium like that would suit us right down to the ground. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finlay Posted July 31, 2011 Report Share Posted July 31, 2011 Trouble with that is it's about an 18,000 capacity and there was less than 5,000 (which isn't far off the norm) in it yesterday. Looks ridiculous at times. Design isn't the worst I'll give you that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted July 31, 2011 Report Share Posted July 31, 2011 Yeah, it was the design I was on about. I like the set-up of the place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteelmaninOZ Posted August 1, 2011 Report Share Posted August 1, 2011 Yeah, it was the design I was on about. I like the set-up of the place. I suppose you could say the same about Tynecastle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rico Posted August 1, 2011 Report Share Posted August 1, 2011 There is a massive difference between Tynecastle (the best atmospheric stadium in scotland and Rugby Park . After being to Norway the ideal Stadium would be to build something similar to Aalesunds...smaller scale if need be. Just as long as if (maybe when) we move its not the plastic arena's that we now see at ict,st.mirren,hamilton and falkirk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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