Lobey_Dosser Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 So, should the deal go through. does Boyle hand his shares over to Hutchison/Society? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richie Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 Unless Im reading it incorrectly, I think Hutchinson is holding the shares and the Well Society have 5yrs to accumulate funds? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoF Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 Am I getting this right, he's loaned the money to the club to fend off the need for finding a buyer, and this will give the society time to find the funds to eventually own the club? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kmmfc Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 Presumably if the society don't repay the loan , he'll own the club? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoF Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 Presumably if the society don't repay the loan , he'll own the club? The loan is to the club, not to the society. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lobey_Dosser Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 Few congratulatory tweets from the well society. Would appreciate further clarity first on how Hutchison and Society dovetail ownership, if at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddog Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 Well Socirty saying on twuitter that full details will be announced when deal is done for good. am told statement had to be agreed by a number of different parties so it is just a starter and hence why it's not as full as it could be. But Les Hutchison will own shares and they will transfer to Well Society in full when his loan to the club is repaid, which is what is happening with Hearts. Only Hearts fans have to raise £6million and us nothing like that, although still a bit vague. Here's a press story here that is more accurate than other stuff written this week. Motherwell have announced plans for a Hearts-style route to fan ownership after confirming Well Society backer Les Hutchison is on course to complete a Fir Park takeover. Motherwell v Ross County. Click here to bet. Motherwell: Set for takeover Hutchison is set to take over John Boyle's 70 per cent stake after putting up an interest-free loan to the club, with the fans' group set to assume control further down the line. The deal would fend off interest from an Argentinian consortium if it is completed in the coming weeks and the announcement allows the club to move closer to appointing a new manager. Confirmation could even come on Saturday, although caretaker manager Kenny Black will take the team for their crucial Scottish Premiership clash with Ross County. Former Scunthorpe and Sligo Rovers manager Ian Baraclough has replaced former Fir Park defender Mitchell van der Gaag as the red-hot favourite with the bookmakers and the club say they will make an announcement shortly. A joint statement read: "Motherwell Football Club and the 'Well Society can confirm that they have entered into a memorandum of understanding (MOU) with Mr Les Hutchison. "If the transaction set out in the MOU is concluded, Mr Hutchison will provide the club with working capital finance, alongside the ongoing funding support provided by the Society, which has just provided another loan totalling £100k to the club. "This finance will take the form of an interest-free loan, repayable over a maximum period of five years. "During that time the Society board have committed to growing both membership numbers and funds in order to demonstrate that the supporter base is fully behind the concept of fan ownership. "Once Mr Hutchison's loan has been repaid in full, it is anticipated the Society will become the owners of the club." New Sky Bet customers: Free matched bet up to £50!The club say they have entered a "30-day exclusivity period to enable financial and legal due diligence to be undertaken". Hutchison added: "I look forward to working with the Society and the club to help them achieve their objective of fan ownership and be financially sustainable within five years." The details of the deal have yet to be announced but it is understood that the combined backing from Hutchison and the fans group is worth more than £1million. Recent reports have described the South American bid as more lucrative, but the Well Society is convinced its plan is better. The Well Society will play a meaningful role in the running of the club but, like Ann Budge at Hearts, Lanarkshire-born Hutchison will be in control, although he is based in Barbados for most of the year. It is understood he was heavily involved in the selection of a new boss after signing up to a deal in principle early this week along with the club and Well Society, although an announcement was delayed by other factors in an extremely complicated negotiating process. The electrical engineer-turned-successful businessman, who went to school in nearby Uddingston and began his career in several Lanarkshire steelworks, has been in talks with Well Society chairman Brian McCafferty for more than six months but his identity was kept secret until it was leaked to a newspaper on Monday. McCafferty added: "We would like to sincerely thank Les for his generous loan to the club which has kept alive hopes of community ownership. We emphatically believe the partnership between Les and the society provides, by far, the best solution to both the club's short-term financial needs and its long -term sustainability and success." The fans' group was given an ultimatum of raising £800,000 by the end of November and talks, initially centred on a loan to the society, but the plan moved towards the Foundation of Hearts blueprint in late October. That was prompted by Boyle's talks with the Argentinian group - which reached an advanced stage - and a bleaker financial forecast from the club following their early cup exits and poor league form, which prompted the £800,000 target to be raised. Motherwell have lost close to £1million in the last three seasons and the Well Society believe Hutchison's expertise can put them on the right track financially before the club potentially moves into fan ownership. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
underboyleheating Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 Former Scunthorpe and Sligo Rovers manager Ian Baraclough has replaced former Fir Park defender Mitchell van der Gaag as the red-hot favourite with the bookmakers and the club say they will make an announcement shortly. So Baraclough is the new favourite? I thought Mitch was a shoe in for the job? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaka Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 Cheap option! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suprawell Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 I enjoyed this part of the official announcement: "During that time the Society Board have committed to growing both membership numbers and funds in order to demonstrate that the supporter base is fully behind the concept of fan ownership." Eh, no the fans aren't, hence the need to borrow more money and build the club on debt with falling crowds. Let's bleed the fans dry as predicted...stupid idea I for one am gutted this is going through. How many times will true fans have to dip into their pockets to keep this daft scheme afloat? We should have been cutting our cloth accordingly, not running at a loss all those years Dempster was in charge. This is the last I'll say on the matter, however I see administration within 3-5 years, perhaps sooner, but in a town like Motherwell with our small supporter base the scheme simply will not work. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lobey_Dosser Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 Cheap option! Better get used to it, there's a loan to repay in addition to offsetting the routine losses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onthefringes Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 I enjoyed this part of the official announcement: "During that time the Society Board have committed to growing both membership numbers and funds in order to demonstrate that the supporter base is fully behind the concept of fan ownership." Eh, no the fans aren't, hence the need to borrow more money and build the club on debt with falling crowds. Let's bleed the fans dry as predicted...stupid idea I for one am gutted this is going through. How many times will true fans have to dip into their pockets to keep this daft scheme afloat? We should have been cutting our cloth accordingly, not running at a loss all those years Dempster was in charge. This is the last I'll say on the matter, however I see administration within 3-5 years, perhaps sooner, but in a town like Motherwell with our small supporter base the scheme simply will not work. You've really not got a handle on this have you? No bank debt, creditors paid in full... Who is likely to put us into administration? And for the avoidance of doubt, the scheme has worked with another dipping into the reserves at the moment... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suprawell Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 You've really not got a handle on this have you? No bank debt, creditors paid in full... Who is likely to put us into administration? And for the avoidance of doubt, the scheme has worked with another dipping into the reserves at the moment... Yes I have. Did I say we would go into administration today, now? No as I know there is no-one chapping at the door. However in 3-5 years when we are back on our uppers and the coffers are running dry where exactly are we going to get the fans to keep paying the bills....sorry it's a scheme designed to rip the arse out of us the fans, The whole thing is still built on a wait and see approach if the fans adopt it and so far it's not been a success as The Well Society hasn't raised the money from the fans. Simple. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteelEdge Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 You've really not got a handle on this have you? No bank debt, creditors paid in full... Who is likely to put us into administration? And for the avoidance of doubt, the scheme has worked with another dipping into the reserves at the moment... Agreed. And as for the cutting cloth to suit, I'd imagine that's exactly what'll be happening over the next 5 years. And isn't that what fans have been crying out for? I don't know much about the Hearts situation, but from the outside it looks like their fans are right behind their fan ownership with Budge (which seems similar to us with Hutchison). In contrast a sizeable amount of our support seems against our fans owning our club. Maybe that's because we're not in the situation Hearts were in a year ago? Whether someone bought the club or the Well Society own it, the old cutting cloth to suit philosophy would have to be employed. We're never going to be in a Man City or Chelsea type situation for example. So given that, what's the difference? Far as I can see it's a choice between someone or some group that probably won't have the club's interests at heart and those that absolutely do have the club's interests at heart. Lack of expertise amongst our fan base doesn't wash with me. It's not going to be wee Davie fae the East Stand suddenly looking after the club's accounts and making financial decisions. We have experienced business people at the club already and they will undoubtedly be Well Society members. As far as I can see, they'll be strong, strong favourites to carry on in charge. Everyone might not agree with how the club has been run by those people, but as I've said twice before, I'm sure the club will now change to suit. Like it or not, it's the Well Society option that's happening. As such, I'd like to think as many fans as possible will get behind it now. If you think you can't afford it, pay £10 a month (it's what I'm doing) - which is what? 3 less pints per month? 3,000 fans doing that on the basic £300 package gives the Society £900k. Obviously, we might not get 3,000 members, but there are people that'll take up the higher value memberships etc. If you're genuinely living on the breadline and so can't afford that £10 then fair enough, but I firmly believe there are a lot of fans out there that can afford it and haven't signed up. And if enough people bang on about how it's not going to work, we're not big enough etc, so don't sign up and the Society doesn't work... Then that's just a self fulfilling prophecy isn't it? I can't stand this defeatist lack of self-confidence that so many have... bit of a Scottish thing I reckon. And the Well Society has worked so far anyway with Society funds vitally helping the club on more than one occasion. Join the Society. It'll only take you two minutes to complete that online form. Rant over. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the traveller Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 The particularly interesting point in the club statement as regards future ownership is " provided there is clear evidence that more of our fan base is willing to support the initiative ". So what are the determining factors for that and how is the Well Society going to achieve this? The Well Society failed to raise both the £800k and the £1million pledge it was seeking to do so what is going to change?If they do not meet this Mr Hutchinson could have been repaid all the money he lent the club by the club and essentially have become the owner at no cost to himself. Does this sound a worryingly familiar story that echoes the problems faced by fans down south? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brazilian Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 Yes I have. No you have not, and sadly rather than looking in to whats happening and more importantly the changes occuring, you and some others seem intent on trying to publicly destroy the very essence of whats been built and belittle what has been done or choose to ignore it completely. another £100k short term loan has just been transferred from the society funds to the club and that keeps the club trading , that is the society 'Working' the club could not trade without that capital. sure there have been mistakes, most crititcally by the club not trading on a realistic budget after the Rangers Fiasco played out, and my personal moan that the communication outwith society meeting has been almost non existant, if you go to meetings and participate all the answers and the troubles are there to be seen and explain a lot. but when you have less than ten? volunteers, working on a project, and the goals are frequently changing, but they still raise what around £6-700k and in a recession like one not seen for many decades from a community with a core support of around 3500 then I'd say they are doing pretty well particularly when the almighty Dempster and Boyle have forced the situation and plunged the 'club' into a crisis situation, which the society and the club management have doen tremendously well to get to this point out off. All the digs about coffers running dry? thats the club, not the society, its essentially bad management or a difficult trading situation dependant on how you look at it, the Rangers fiasco hit hard but in reality the reaction to it was not strong enough, the society has it funds and is using them exactly as was designed, its not donating money to the club that dissapears, its supporting the club, through these very tough times. I think there are flaws, but admire how much effort has been put in to secure the future of the club but also to fundraise outwith the memberships from a very cynical support base, that wishes for far more than is available and sometimes does not appreciate the gravity of the situation or at very least offer alternatives, if they do not think something is the best option for the longer term. or to put it simply, the Society and the Club are on the brink of signing a 0% loan for 5 years to stabilise the club, what is the other option that is a.) better value or b.) available in your wee world? EDIT: in response to the traveller , the Society did raise the £800k but then Boyle pulled a nasty and upped the goal, take of that what you will double EDIT: and while im on it, remember Boyle writing off his debt, servicing 'his loan' payments over the last decade would have covered much of the losses 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the traveller Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 Boyle did not up the goals. The money was required to be able fund the projected large six figure loss for this year. What would the point have been in the Society taking over if it couldn't have then properly funded the running of the club ? We would then have ended up in administration pretty sharpish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richie Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 Sportsound just had a fairly lengthy interview with Les Hutchinson there. Sounds promising. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goggles & Flippers Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 From the interview I took that Les has asked 2 members of the current board to stay in place (I don't know if that is the two who were already appointed to the the main club board or the WS board). He's also appointed 3 people to the WS board including his daughter who has a background in finance. It would appear he is dictating the makeup of things which considering he is successful and also contributed so much he is entitled to do. I would strongly urge the WS who do montier these boards to furnish the membership and wider support of details of the arrangement as a matter of urgency. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weeyin Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 He's also appointed 3 people to the WS board including his daughter who has a background in finance. It would appear he is dictating the makeup of things which considering he is successful and also contributed so much he is entitled to do. I know beggars can't be choosers, but I hope there's not too many strings. I'm a supporter of the Well Society and don't like the idea of unelected board members - goes against the grain of members having control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairhill Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 I know beggars can't be choosers, but I hope there's not too many strings. I'm a supporter of the Well Society and don't like the idea of unelected board members - goes against the grain of members having control. Are you for real??? It strikes me the more strings from someone who knows how to succeed, and who is prepared to step up, the better. Not to belittle the work done by the society, but it seems obvious the current business model is not working. I'd rather have an appointed board of people who have proven skills than an elected board of people who have gotten us into this situation in the first place. You can bet the new money will come with measurable conditions that are intended to see the club survive and prosper, and I hope one of those conditions relates to the number of supporters who attend home games once the performance on the field gets straightened out. I don't know much about our benefactor, but he does seem to know how to measure success, and that also implies he knows how to deal with failure as well. Regardless, the one thing that should be understood is that expectations will be different than they have been in the past. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lobey_Dosser Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 From the interview I took that Les has asked 2 members of the current board to stay in place (I don't know if that is the two who were already appointed to the the main club board or the WS board). He's also appointed 3 people to the WS board including his daughter who has a background in finance. It would appear he is dictating the makeup of things which considering he is successful and also contributed so much he is entitled to do. I would strongly urge the WS who do montier these boards to furnish the membership and wider support of details of the arrangement as a matter of urgency. Didn't hear the interview but just had a wee read: http://m.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/30463715 I'm not sure if the 2 or 3 he is bringing in are to the club or society? Either way I'm happy to see fresh involvement. I remain sceptical about fan ownership being sustainable but we now have up to 5 years to prove it's viable. If we have some fresh faces supplementing and possibly leading the cause in conjunction with a structured vision to how we deliver fan ownership, then even sceptics like me will back it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weeyin Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 Are you for real??? It strikes me the more strings from someone who knows how to succeed, and who is prepared to step up, the better. Not to belittle the work done by the society, but it seems obvious the current business model is not working. I'd rather have an appointed board of people who have proven skills than an elected board of people who have gotten us into this situation in the first place. You can bet the new money will come with measurable conditions that are intended to see the club survive and prosper, and I hope one of those conditions relates to the number of supporters who attend home games once the performance on the field gets straightened out. I don't know much about our benefactor, but he does seem to know how to measure success, and that also implies he knows how to deal with failure as well. Regardless, the one thing that should be understood is that expectations will be different than they have been in the past. I'm deadly serious for various reasons. The main one being that the leagues north and south of the border are littered with clubs who have gone to the wall or are in serious financial straits thanks to benefactors who decided they knew best. From Hearts to Gretna to Dundee to Livingston to Rangers. I'm not saying it will be the case here, but nepotism is rarely beneficial and I'm wary of deal conditions that involve giving family members jobs. Having a successful business is great, but as many have shown in the past, football is not your regular business model. If it was, we'd have a healthy league with healthy profits every year from every club. A look back at my posts will show I'm in favour of outside investments, but as a Society member, I feel there should be consulation on the details of the deal. I have been around the block enough times to know everything in business is negotiable. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldonmac Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 I don't see how he can appoint 3 members onto the WS Board. At the moment there are 6 (or possibly even 7 if Douglas Dickie is still on the Board) Directors and a further 3 brings it to 9/10. Rule 53 state a maximum of 8. Also the Board composition under Rule 53 (a) states that "4 members of the Society Board (or such higher number as shall be required so that elected members of the Board are in a majority over co-opted members) will be elected by the members in accordance with such arrangements as shall be determined by the Society Board;" Then again maybe the Rules don't matter .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coolhandluc Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 Coolhandluc Today, 10:28 http://www.bqlive.co.uk/2014/10/03/forging-a-better-business-future-for-scotland/ So our new backer is a true steelman in every sense of the word. Sounds like we could do worse than utilise his common sense and business knowledge on the board too Seems a better thread for this link Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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