hoof hearted Posted August 9, 2012 Report Share Posted August 9, 2012 We would've beat them 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJC_MKI Posted August 9, 2012 Report Share Posted August 9, 2012 Yet you laughablly ignore the 5-0 drubbing tonight meaning they lost by the same overall goal difference as we did. Yet they did this in the 'secondary' competitiion. Although to suit your depressing vision they would have fared better than us in the top tourney Hasnae a clue! That smacks of clutching at straws. The fact is that in European competition, which both ourselves and Dundee Utd were involved, Dundee Utd gave a far better account of themselves than we did. Panathinaikos were not brilliant, but they didn't have to be and I'd wager that they won't get past the next round of qualifiers... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJC_MKI Posted August 9, 2012 Report Share Posted August 9, 2012 We wouldnt have drawn at home to Moscow. Ssshhh that won't sit well with some folk on here.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ONeils40yarder Posted August 9, 2012 Report Share Posted August 9, 2012 1344543170[/url]' post='354809']Dundee Utd gave a far better account of themselves than we did. really? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finlay Posted August 9, 2012 Report Share Posted August 9, 2012 That smacks of clutching at straws. The fact is that in European competition, which both ourselves and Dundee Utd were involved, Dundee Utd gave a far better account of themselves than we did. Panathinaikos were not brilliant, but they didn't have to be and I'd wager that they won't get past the next round of qualifiers... They lost by the same overall goal difference as we did. In the lesser competition. Better result at home but MUCH worse result away. Lost by five and had conceeded within first two mins, and were three down after forty. Aye, a much better account. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tweed Posted August 9, 2012 Report Share Posted August 9, 2012 Comparing what we did against Panathinaikos to what Dundee Utd did against Dinamo Moscow is just a pointless comparison. They played against a different type of opponent and they are a different sort of team to us. Going back to Lobey-Dosser's original point the question is did Motherwell not throw everything at it or were the Greeks so good defensively that they stopped us doing it. I thought we were dangerously open last week and tried everything to get in behind and their defence was just better than our midfield and forward players and manage to cut out the little angles and spaces we needed. On the TV last night you don't get the same idea of how the play is building but i suspect it was similar but we looked a bit slower, probably due to the heat. For the most part Panathinaikos seemed content to let us play when we had it and they knew that eventually they would either pick us off or we'd give away a set play or we'd just get tired. If we draw a more open opponent next time will be interesting to see if the jugular can be thrown! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finlay Posted August 9, 2012 Report Share Posted August 9, 2012 Panathinaikos would have easily beat any team in the SPL over two legs outside of Celtic. No doubt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted August 9, 2012 Report Share Posted August 9, 2012 Sorry MJC, I usually see where you're coming from but Finlay is bang on. Don't see how you can use one leg to support your argument and totally discount the other? I fear it is you clutching at straws in this case. Nothing to do with not being what the majority on here want to read. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJC_MKI Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 I don't discount the 2nd leg, overall Dundee Utd were well beaten over the two games just like we were, but that only tells half the story. They went into their 2nd leg still in with a chance of going through, albeit a slim one given the two away goals they conceded. We on the other hand were dead and buried going into our second leg and at no point looked like giving Panathinaikos a run for their money. That suggests to me that Dundee Utd gave a better account of themselves than we did. And Panathinaikos were not brilliant by any stretch of the imagination. They were good and probably would get past most SPL sides outwith Celtic but as I've said, had they come up against someone like Utd then they would have been run closer than they were against us. All just my opinion of course but I've seen Dundee Utd and others give the likes of Rangers a fair game of it and even beating them on a good few occasions in recent years all while we've meekly rolled over and made them look a far better side than they actually were. As I said above, I predict that Panathinaikos won't qualify for the group stages of the Champions League. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 I don't discount the 2nd leg, overall Dundee Utd were well beaten over the two games just like we were, but that only tells half the story. They went into their 2nd leg still in with a chance of going through, albeit a slim one given the two away goals they conceded. We on the other hand were dead and buried going into our second leg and at no point looked like giving Panathinaikos a run for their money. That suggests to me that Dundee Utd gave a better account of themselves than we did. But by that logic, we had nothing to play for and kept the score down to 3-0 while Dundee United had everything to play for and got humped 5-0? So surely we gave a better account of ourselves in our second leg than United did in their second leg, just like United gave a better account of themselves in their first leg than we did? I'm sorry, I just don't see how one team's performance can be considered better or worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJC_MKI Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 But by that logic, we had nothing to play for and kept the score down to 3-0 while Dundee United had everything to play for and got humped 5-0? So surely we gave a better account of ourselves in our second leg than United did in their second leg, just like United gave a better account of themselves in their first leg than we did? I'm sorry, I just don't see how one team's performance can be considered better or worse. . Or maybe Panathinaikos already knew that they were as good as through and didn't play at 100% in the second leg, while Dynamo Moscow knew they were in a game and so moved up a few gears and really went for it? I'm sorry but anybody who can't see that Dundee Utd's performance against Dynamo Moscow was better than our's against PAO is looking at this through Claret & Amber tinted spectacles. They DREW 2-2 with them last week, came to within seconds of beating them which would have been a superb result against what was clearly a better and stronger side, as last night's result proved. As I said last night, had we played Dynamo Moscow, we wouldn't have drawn with them at home, infact I doubt we'd even have scored. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnstone Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 Can we put this in the pointless drivel thread? Here are the facts. Scottish football is pish. Motherwell and Dundee Utd were both papped out of Europe easily. We are miles behind other nations and we need to sort it right now for the future of our game. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burn_Broomfield Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 Can we put this in the pointless drivel thread? Here are the facts. Scottish football is pish. Motherwell and Dundee Utd were both papped out of Europe easily. We are miles behind other nations and we need to sort it right now for the future of our game. Spot on. PAO aren't a great side, to back up MJC's statement, when they draw a half decent side today they could be on the end of an absolute doing. What was very noticeable however was the difference in quality all round. None of these Panathinaikos players are ever going to be superstars outwith Greece, but their touch and just being comfortable in general on the ball made all the difference. Just that good first touch which all of their players possessed gave them that extra second with it, Motherwell players(in the main) don't have this and it causes no end of problems and permanently put us on the back foot when PAO started to press. Hot Tattie springs to mind. Plenty of effort from the lads(apart from thumbs down Daley) but unfortunately that only gets you so far, but this isn't a problem exclusive to MFC, it's endemic throughout British Football. We were outclassed when they decided to turn up in the second half and were lucky not to concede 6. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 'Well fans at 3-0 down... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjEGzKIGwB0&feature=plcp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finlay Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 Stu, ye cannae reason with him. Madness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottW1886 Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 As I said last night, had we played Dynamo Moscow, we wouldn't have drawn with them at home Prove it. The game didn't take place, you have nothing other than speculation to back that statement up. How do you know that Dynamo Moscow wouldn't have set up differently to Panathanaikos did and Motherwell wouldn't have created more chances. You can't because the game didn't happen. For some reason you are determined to compare apples and oranges in an attempt to argue that Motherwell are shite. This is a Dundee United team that finished below Motherwell last season remember so why not bring that into your comparisons of the two teams in two completely separate matches played in two completely different situations? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJC_MKI Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 Prove it. The game didn't take place, you have nothing other than speculation to back that statement up. How do you know that Dynamo Moscow wouldn't have set up differently to Panathanaikos did and Motherwell wouldn't have created more chances. You can't because the game didn't happen. For some reason you are determined to compare apples and oranges in an attempt to argue that Motherwell are shite. This is a Dundee United team that finished below Motherwell last season remember so why not bring that into your comparisons of the two teams in two completely separate matches played in two completely different situations? Dundee Utd's record against 'better' sides is a lot better than our's is, that's what I base my statement on. I firmly believe it, we would not have drawn with Dynamo Moscow in the Europa League. Can I provide you with concrete proof? No of course I can't because the game didn't happen. I have however seen how we play first hand and we struggle to create and take any chances that come our way against superior opposition. Dundee Utd on the other hand have a much better record against sides like these. Just compare our record against Rangers to their's. Last week they drew 2-2 and by all accounts could and should have scored more goals against DM, whilst we have failed to score in three competitive matches this season so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brazilian Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 MJC is Hugh Keevins, very occasionally has a hint of a valid point, but only acknowledges other views if it suits his argument Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottW1886 Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 Dundee Utd's record against 'better' sides is a lot better than our's is, that's what I base my statement on. I firmly believe it, we would not have drawn with Dynamo Moscow in the Europa League. Can I provide you with concrete proof? No of course I can't because the game didn't happen. I have however seen how we play first hand and we struggle to create and take any chances that come our way against superior opposition. Dundee Utd on the other hand have a much better record against sides like these. Just compare our record against Rangers to their's. Last week they drew 2-2 and by all accounts could and should have scored more goals against DM, whilst we have failed to score in three competitive matches this season so far. You maintain week in week out that every team in the SPL is better than Motherwell and will beat us comfortably. Last season; Motherwell 3rd Dundee Utd 4th Our record against what you consider superior teams was better. Again, Dynamo Moscow and Panathanaikos are 2 completely different teams with completely different styles of play - you cannot compare the 2 ties and definitively state that Dundee Utd would have taken anything off of Panathanaikos, the same way that you cannot state that Dynamo Moscow would have taken more goals off us unless the games took place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJC_MKI Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 Right it's pointless continuing this conversation because we're just going round in circles now, so I'm out. I've made my point and I stand by what I said. I'm not going to change other people's opinions on this matter and other people aren't going to change mine so I shall say no more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 Despite the result, this made me laugh a little. A Rangers fan got this through the post from a Motherwell-supporting mate. It was postmarked Greece. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steelboy Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 i thought in the first half we did well without creating anything. i was hoping to see some attacking changes at half time as we had nothing to lose but that's obviously not mccall's style, two subs standing on the touchline when their 2nd goal went in pretty much sums up mccall's use of subs in his time here. that moment was up there with the triple sub at 2-0 nil down to killie and using his first sub after rangers scored against a knackered team in the 89th minute. how omar wasn't the first man off is a mystery. sitting high up in the stand you got a great view of the game unfolding and daley's lack of movement and tactical stupidity was staggering. i've never seen anyone who appears to give less of a fuck about playing for us. the couple of occasions in the first half when we worked the ball left and he just stood stock still in the middle of the park rather than trying to get into the box were beyond belief. one of the local greek papers gave him the worst man of the match award and it was well deserved. we played some nice football but we seem to have a problem getting into the final 3rd at moment. everyone is playing in areas of the park the opposition are happy for us to be in. we're not good enough to score goals playing the ball out the back and playing 25 passes. we need to have options up top that can put defenders under pressure rather than the cigar smoking displays we've seen from grant munro and boumsong recently. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StipeIsGod Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 Steelboy is correct. Kills me to say it, but every word of the above is true. Especially the point about the opposition allowing us areas of play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.