Motherwell Vs Celtic Discussion Thread

[Finlay]

Rank rotten when you consider how well the likes of ICT, St Johnstone, Killie, Dun Utd, and Hearts have done against them in the last couple of seasons.

 

So combined OF score is 45-5?

 

I'm officially scunnered. Bed time.....I need plenty rest for sll the side splitting belters I'll have to 'enjoy' tomorrow.

[SteelmaninOZ]

Rank rotten when you consider how well the likes of ICT, St Johnstone, Killie, Dun Utd, and Hearts have done against them in the last couple of seasons.

 

So combined OF score is 45-5?

 

I'm officially scunnered. Bed time.....I need plenty rest for sll the side splitting belters I'll have to 'enjoy' tomorrow.

 

Nite Finlay

[Finlay]

[steelboy]

the team i'd like to see

 

randolph

hateley hutchinson page hammell

law lasley carswell murphy

higdon mchugh

 

if humphrey is playing it's a sign mccall has winged it since he took over.

[gordon_mfc]

Would love to see this team against celtic...

 

Randy

Hately - hutch - Rambo a hammell

Humph - law - las - f angol

Ojamma - higgy

 

Won't happen tho....

[GazzyB]

I'd go with

 

Randolph

 

Hateley

Hutch

Ramsden

Hammell

 

Daley

Lasley

Carswell

Law

 

Ojamaa

Higdon

 

I like McCall, but surely he's got to see that Humphrey needs dropped, Hateley needs to go to full back and Ramsden needs to be in there with Hutch.

 

1-1, Ojamaa for us!

[David]

This game is a write off for us.

That's how I view every game against the Old Firm. Celtic have much better players than us, and short of us pulling the odd shock we're always going to be up against it.

 

Our games against the likes of Dundee United, Hearts, St Johnstone and Aberdeen will dictate where we finish in the table this season, not games against Celtic.

 

I'd take a draw all day.

 

Rank rotten when you consider how well the likes of ICT, St Johnstone, Killie, Dun Utd, and Hearts have done against them in the last couple of seasons.

I wonder if any of those teams would trade us our past few league positions in exchange for the odd victory over Celtic?

[GrahamH]

That's how I view every game against the Old Firm. Celtic have much better players than us, and short of us pulling the odd shock we're always going to be up against it.

So you viewed last nights game against a reserve team as a write-off before a ball was kicked?

 

Are you Stuart McCall?

[MelvinBragg]

I wonder if any of those teams would trade us our past few league positions in exchange for the odd victory over Celtic?

It's an interesting question. Finish eighth (or thereabouts) as St Johnstone are likely to do but have a win against Celtic or finish higher up the table by being more consistent against the other sides?

 

Obviously in terms of measuring success, financial and sporting, the second option would be the way to go. But as fans, we don't tend to sit around waxing lyrical about the season we went unbeaten against St Johnstone or Inverness. What really sticks in our memories are the victories against the odds. Which tends to mean against the old firm. Great memories is what we as fans want. To be able to look back and say "D'you remember the night...?"

 

Would I swap a third place finish for a couple of nights like we had in Butcher's first season (6-1 vs Hearts, beating Rangers) and an eighth placed finish? I probably would. But I'm a fan, not the guy balancing the books...

[Finlay]

That's how I view every game against the Old Firm. Celtic have much better players than us, and short of us pulling the odd shock we're always going to be up against it.

 

Our games against the likes of Dundee United, Hearts, St Johnstone and Aberdeen will dictate where we finish in the table this season, not games against Celtic.

 

I'd take a draw all day.

 

 

I wonder if any of those teams would trade us our past few league positions in exchange for the odd victory over Celtic?

 

A ridiculous argument. I wonder if anyone at the Club would swap our recent league finishes for the Scottish Cups and League Cup won in recent seasons by these teams.

[MJC_MKI]

6-1 Celtic.

 

They'll be right up for this one as they try to get their SPL season back on track and they've got the best place to start. If they are up for this one then this will be over by half time.

 

 

[SteelmaninOZ]

Another wee trip tae the past.....

 

Scottish Premier League match, 25th August 1990. Goals from Bobby Russell and Dougie Arnott, a red card for Dariusz Wdowczyk, Billy McNeill has an 'Annie Rooney' and 'Psycho' O'Neill gets some retaliation in on Peter Grant...

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vp1RIzNdUfo&feature=related

 

 

 

 

 

 

Scottish Premier League match, 7th December 1996. Struggling Motherwell overcame Celtic thanks to goals from Billy Davies and Ian Ross. Don't miss a goalkeeping masterclass from 'Well midfielder Jamie Dolan...

 

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6Y5JtoCmrs&feature=relmfu

[Stevie Wids]

After last night, I'm not overly enthused for Saturday.

 

I would like to see this team play

 

 

Randy

 

Hately Hutch Ramsden Angol

 

----- Lasley---- Carswell* -----

 

-------------Law----------------------- -

------------------------- Ojamaa-----

--Murphy -----------------------------

------------Higdon--------------------

 

*Or maybe try Hammell in there again.

 

 

 

Ideally we need to be trying to find a replacement for Jennings in January if possible. Last night showed we need an anchor in the middle of the pitch to break play up, and get the ball back in our possession.

Edited September 27, 2012 by Stevie Wids

[David]

So you viewed last nights game against a reserve team as a write-off before a ball was kicked?

I viewed last night as a game we could win just as easily as we could lose. The bookies obviously thought the same.

 

This talk of us losing to a 3rd division side, as though we were beaten 2-0 by Annan Athletic or Peterhead simply doesn't wash. The Rangers side that was on that park last night would give any club bar Celtic some trouble at Ibrox, especially coming in as fired up as they were.

 

Couple that with the fact that we played nowhere near our best and you get what happened last night.

 

Disappointing, without a doubt. But not the catastrophe that it's being made out as.

 

It's an interesting question. Finish eighth (or thereabouts) as St Johnstone are likely to do but have a win against Celtic or finish higher up the table by being more consistent against the other sides?

 

Obviously in terms of measuring success, financial and sporting, the second option would be the way to go. But as fans, we don't tend to sit around waxing lyrical about the season we went unbeaten against St Johnstone or Inverness. What really sticks in our memories are the victories against the odds. Which tends to mean against the old firm. Great memories is what we as fans want. To be able to look back and say "D'you remember the night...?"

 

Would I swap a third place finish for a couple of nights like we had in Butcher's first season (6-1 vs Hearts, beating Rangers) and an eighth placed finish? I probably would. But I'm a fan, not the guy balancing the books...

The memories are all well & good, but I'd take a season of us challenging for a European place and losing against Rangers & Celtic over us sitting mid-table with nothing to play for, and getting the odd victory over the Old Firm.

 

Are you Stuart McCall?

Yes.

[Lobey_Dosser]

I personally love challenging for a European spot and then listen to the club telling us that we don't have a hope in hell in progressing.

 

Team for Saturday: Randolph, Hutchinson, Higdon and 8 reserves.

[David]

A ridiculous argument. I wonder if anyone at the Club would swap our recent league finishes for the Scottish Cups and League Cup won in recent seasons by these teams.

It isn't ridiculous at all. I'm simply highlighting that fact that I'd take consistency over the course of a season rather than the odd win over Rangers or Celtic. Three points is three points at the end of the day, and we managed to amass more points than any other non-Old Firm club last season despite only taking one point from a possible twenty four against both Old Firm clubs.

 

Not too shabby at all.

[MelvinBragg]

The memories are all well & good, but I'd take a season of us challenging for a European place and losing against Rangers & Celtic over us sitting mid-table with nothing to play for, and getting the odd victory over the Old Firm.

I can see your thinking there. I'd love us to be able to do both frankly. Compete against Rangers and Celtic when we play them and beat the rest. The two shouldn't be mutually exclusive. Reason I asked the question was that I think that's the real reason for our frustration. Teams like Dundee United, Kilmarnock and St Johnstone finish below us and, logic would state, we're better than them. Yet they somehow know how to play against the Old Firm.

 

Personally, I'd take a season of finishing eighth and a couple of magical cup nights and beating Celtic at least once. I don't want to be sitting in ten years time and the last truly great night the Well having given me still being the CIS Cup semi in 2005.

 

There have been great games and great moments since then (2-2 vs Hearts in the cup, Jutkiewicz's last minute belter against Hibs spring to mind) but in terms of games that will live long in the memory like boxing day 2002, it's been too long. That's what I as a fan wait for, that's why we put up with the innumerable terrible games against St Mirren. They're the dues we pay so we can go absolutely tonto when Fitzpatrick scores a last minute winner at Easter Road or when Bobby Russell slaloms through a Rangers or Celtic defence. Finishing third is great but doesn't bring you the pure unadulterated joy that these moments do (with Fitzpatrick's goal and the last day of the season against Celtic, I'm sure I lost three minutes of my life in 2005).

 

But like I say, I understand the opposite argument. I just go the football to experience the extreme emotions, and we haven't had enough of extreme joy for some time...

[Finlay]

And I'm pointing out I'd rather win any Cup than finish 3rd and appear in Europe, David.

 

Irrelevant in the matter at hand which is discussing our ridiculously poor record against Rangers in the last ten years and the negative comments from certain people pre and post fixture.

[Ya Bezzer!]

Going to miss this one as I'm working - maybe not such a bad one to miss!

 

I think it's going to hard to get the players heads up for this one after that midweek defeat. We've been beaten so many times now it must be next to impossible to get the players to believe. Last night was a huge opportunity for us to break that record and instill some confidence but obviously it wasn't taken but the important point is last nights defeat will, I think, affect our league performance. Already this season Ross County, St. Johnstone, Hibs have taken points off Celtic but it's hard to see how we possible can.

 

Just a point. This time last season we'd kept 4 clean sheets. This season we've kept 1 and that on the first day of the season. We miss Craigan a lot and we are going to have to improve defensively because Higdon isn't going to score 7 goals every 7 games all season. I've only seen Ramsden once due to not making it to many games this season but you'd think he'd have to come in if fit. We desperately need some experience at the back.

 

Sadly you can see someone like Tony Watt to score and their new guys Miku and Lassad to get their first for the club because we just don't look capable of defending well enough at the moment.

[mfcdez]

Really like big Hutch , but got to remember he is still a young guy learning his trade . Maybe the added pressure of being the more experienced of our central defensive pairing is too much for him at the moment and adding to some of the rashness and conceding of needless fouls around the box by trying to do too much in helping Cummins through the game .

Would like to see Hateley back to R/B with Ramsden in the middle with Hutch as a bit of a calming influence , as if we start with the same back line as last night and concede an early goal , we could be on for a serious pumping .

[David]

And I'm pointing out I'd rather win any Cup than finish 3rd and appear in Europe, David.

 

Irrelevant in the matter at hand which is discussing our ridiculously poor record against Rangers in the last ten years and the negative comments from certain people pre and post fixture.

As I said, it was a disappointing performance and result, no doubt. The fans have every right to be critical of the team & the manager.

 

What I refuse to accept is the usual suspects, who have pretty much just been waiting in the wings for something like this, going to town on McCall, talking as if the guy secretly sets out to give Rangers the win and suchlike.

 

That's absolute nonsense, and anyone with half a brain should know that.

[ankles]

As I said, it was a disappointing performance and result, no doubt. The fans have every right to be critical of the team & the manager.

 

What I refuse to accept is the usual suspects, who have pretty much just been waiting in the wings for something like this, going to town on McCall, talking as if the guy secretly sets out to give Rangers the win and suchlike.

 

That's absolute nonsense, and anyone with half a brain should know that.

 

 

yep, nobody more dissappointed than me , we lost last night for all manner of reasons but suggest any sort of lying down due to Rangers sympathies is utter bollocks

[Finlay]

As I said, it was a disappointing performance and result, no doubt. The fans have every right to be critical of the team & the manager.

 

What I refuse to accept is the usual suspects, who have pretty much just been waiting in the wings for something like this, going to town on McCall, talking as if the guy secretly sets out to give Rangers the win and suchlike.

 

That's absolute nonsense, and anyone with half a brain should know that.

 

I have no real interest in people who perversely wait for a defeat etc. to jump in with their post mortem and false agendas.

 

However, anyone with a quarter of a brain wouldn't jump in with an irrelevant argument about which is 'the best to have'. As Dun Utd and Hearts have proved regularly ( teams we have pretty solid records against) it is possible to do both. It's not a choice of one or the other it is a sporting contest and one that we have been failing at miserably for ten solid years and it needs addressed..

[Special aka]

The Stevenson deal, or lack of, was a blow. Hateley is out is zone tho, and should be returned to full-back - where is far better than Kerr imho.

Add to that Randolph, Hutch, Lasley, Law and Higdon pick themselves, but we have a struggle elsewhere ................ really not sure what to propose for Saturday, (by far our biggest test of the season).

[David]

However, anyone with a quarter of a brain wouldn't jump in with an irrelevant argument about which is 'the best to have'. As Dun Utd and Hearts have proved regularly ( teams we have pretty solid records against) it is possible to do both. It's not a choice of one or the other it is a sporting contest and one that we have been failing at miserably for ten solid years and it needs addressed..

Whatever blows your hair back I guess. I'm as disappointed as any about us losing the game last night, and the manner in which we did so, but I'm not going to lose the place about it and act unreasonably.

 

We've consistently finished in the upper half of the table despite our record against the Old Firm, so I'm happy enough as far as the big picture goes.

 

I don't even want to think what this place will be like if we lose to Celtic this weekend...