Motherwell V Dundee Utd 9/11/13

[punk_in_drublic]

I waited a day before posting after the Hibs game, but I'm so pissed off with that today that I'm not waiting til tomorrow. That performance was Malpas-esque, utterly shameful how bad we were today.

 

I've come to the conclusion that McCall and Black have next to no tactical nous, even when changes were made to the personnel today, the formation and tactics stayed exactly the same. A 4-4-2 (with Carswell man-marking Gauld) was never the way to go against a team who play a 4-2-3-1, we were outnumbered in midfield and their pace left us chasing shadows. Yet another game where we've hardly stuck a shot in on goal.

 

The first two goals were school-boyish from our viewpoint, poor header from McManus, shocking goalkeeping from Gunnar for the 1st, god awful play from Angol for the 2nd and for the 3rd, they obviously took advantage of us being down to ten men.

 

For me, some of the players just aren't good enough. We are a fair portion through the season so it's hardly a knee-jerk reaction when I say;

 

Neilson is no better than Hollis and quite possibly could be worse

 

Angol is worse at left back than he is in midfield which is fucking saying something

 

Vigurs is far too pedestrian, it's a bad day when the full home support has to let home no there is a 'man on'. He put in a shift today, but I was under the impression he was signed to offer a scoring threat from midfield?

 

Ainsworth would have been as well sitting beside me today - hopelessly anonymous

 

Anier, has gone right off the boil, still putting the effort in, but it looks to me that he can't read a game at all, and he struggles to link up with the lump of wood up front

 

The lump of wood up front, puts in a shift, he tries like fuck, but he is, and always has been, an extremely limited footballer - spends more time on his arse than on his feet - just rotten.

 

I hate to say it, but Faddy is getting right on my tits as well, he's a hero of mine, and it pains me to see how bad he is just now. First touch isn't great, decision-making is poor and he is quickly becoming a luxury we can't afford.

 

Struggling to think of many positives, Moore done ok when he came on.......and.......that's about it.

 

 

P.s. Thought United were excellent from start to finish, it really should have been more than 4. Gauld is getting all the plaudits but I thought Armstrong was their most accomplished player today

 

Malpas was going through my heed as well!!!

[ONeils40yarder]

1384027987[/url]' post='398868']

Malpas was going through my heed as well!!!

 

I was just waiting on McCall saying 'sometimes it's just your Donald Duck' in his post match interview

[Andy_P]

In a sense I wasn't that surprised we took a drubbing. When the team lines came through I immediately feared a tough afternoon lay ahead and if we could take anything we'd be doing well.

 

We've generally been quite fortunate with the calculated gamble of running with a tight squad but I think there will be few teams who could lose their keeper, and three of their recognised back four at the one time and not suffer consequences.

 

I thought we were OK initially, had won a few corners and Sutton wasn't too far away from Vigurs cross but the game was lost in the space of about three minutes. For their killer second I thought we might have had a case for high feet but you simply can't ignore the poor decision making of Francis-Angol that lead to their chance in the first place. This past couple of weeks has been a tough learning curve for young ZFA. I hope he has the character to get through it and be better for the tough experiences.

 

The third, what can you say? At first glance perhaps not our most professional hour that we were still scrambling about with 10 men trying to make a change. Why the delay before Murray replaced Carswell?

 

The fourth was the rubbing of salt into the wounds. In truth by that stage if it had been five, six, seven even I doubt I really could have complained.

 

Good side United, look lively, creative. All the things we weren't today. I do find it irritating losing to them though. There is just something incredibly smug and arrogant about their fans - like their "New Firm" partners further up the coast. Half a dozen decent games and they think its 1983 again. "You're only here to see United" Fuck Off!!

 

Felt a bit for Vigurs with the booing at the Man of the Match announcement and ZFA to a lesser extent. Unless we are somehow contractually obliged to do this lets at least use a bit of discretion. Announcing a Man of the Match when you are 3-0 down is just embarrassing and leaves you open to the type of reaction the announcement got. A stupid and unnecessary position to put either player in.

 

And on a slightly similar vein we've made plenty of strides with stats, tweets and the like around the matchday experience. Announcing match sponsors when the game is certainly not one of them. Irritating as it as it to hear all the sponsors read out for each player at half-time, it is at least at half time. During the game, it's not on.

 

Positives few and far between. Moore liked interested when he came on. Certainly should be starting against Albion Rovers in a few weeks, you could even argue he might be worth a shot against Killie. Pleased also that Euan Murray got some first team game time too, even if not in the best of circumstances.

 

I always think it's best if you can go into these international breaks on a high after a win, but I'm actually just grateful we have it, so we can let those who need it gain fitness, those who need it rest and generally have a couple of weeks to regroup and put today behind us.

[smiddy]

vigurs iv gave him the benifit of the doubt !!!! but know what ! GIT HIM TAE FUCK and want somebody to defend him they say hes good with dead balls ! but so is james sherry ! so tell m your pish !!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Steve Diggle]

vigurs iv gave him the benifit of the doubt !!!! but know what ! GIT HIM TAE FUCK and want somebody to defend him they say hes good with dead balls ! but so is james sherry ! so tell m your pish !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Excellent point, well made

[ONeils40yarder]

I can't wait for Steelboys full analysis, I reckon I'll agree with the vast majority of it this week

[siebsbarmyarmy]

vigurs iv gave him the benifit of the doubt !!!! but know what ! GIT HIM TAE FUCK and want somebody to defend him they say hes good with dead balls ! but so is james sherry ! so tell m your pish !!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Cool story bro!!! What happens next week??

[madscot]

vigurs iv gave him the benifit of the doubt !!!! but know what ! GIT HIM TAE FUCK and want somebody to defend him they say hes good with dead balls ! but so is james sherry ! so tell m your pish !!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Vigurs wasn't the worst Well player on the park today .By a long shot !

[madscot]

vigurs iv gave him the benifit of the doubt !!!! but know what ! GIT HIM TAE FUCK and want somebody to defend him they say hes good with dead balls ! but so is james sherry ! so tell m your pish !!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

"GIT HIM TAE FUCK " Right back at you ! GET YOU TAE FUCK (sorry Yabba )

[mfc88]

Where to begin? We were utter shit, utd were excellent at times and we were beaten by a far superior team.

 

It has not worked for us this season at all really, our points tally remains respectable but performances have not. Must now be time for McCall to shake things up...take a gamble by either trying a different set up or giving the young players the chance to stake a claim in our current set up. Persisting as we are isn't working.

 

The one thing Dundee utd should be embarrassed and ashamed of though is how often and how much time they're players spent on the ground feigning injury. Call me old fashioned but i didn't think Scottish or indeed British teams behaved like that.

[Tid]

First goal was bad enough but to lose another right after that was a right boot in haw maws. Already missing a 3/4s of your back 4 it was never going to be an easy shift but for once you have to give credit to the opposition. They blew us away & in the end 0-4 flattered us. First 10 mins or so we actually started quite well but we don't half look fragile at the moment. A real lack of confidence coursing through the team right now. Let's however have a reality check here. Should we be finishing top 2 or 3 every season on the budget we've got? No chance. Even when we're flying & challenging right up there at the end of the season we still can't attract a half-decent crowd. We've enjoyed a right few good seasons of relative success albeit in the higher league positions rather than in the cups but at the end of the day what gives us the God-given right to be ahead of the likes of Hearts, Aberdeen, United, Hibs or even Killie, St Mirren or whoever? All the talk of "the worst I've seen ever" is a lot of bollocks. Knee jerk reactions after a few poor performances. At the end of the day the match day experience is about far more than the result. For me it's meeting the mates, having a few scoops & catching up on the last week or two. Obviously it's disappointing to lose, especially in the manor we did today or more so against Aberdeen the other week but I for one have seen some dross over the years & still stuck with it so the least we can do is get behind the team when they do lose a few games. We weren't great today but holy f*ck I've seen a hell of a lot worse.

 

get yir heads up & give a bit of support rather than constantly putting the boot in. You never know it might just get a positive reaction on the pitch.

[dosser1886]

Unfortunate truth is that we have lost most of our best players and the guys that have been brought in to replace them aren't really up to the job. We lost most of the best components that we had from last year that made us a decent football team. We are in all honesty a pretty poor team in a very poor league and our current league position totally flatters us.

 

Yes we've had some bad injuries and the team today was cobbled together but even when we are full strength we aren't a patch on the team that we were the last few years.

 

 

 

Can't fault most of the guys for effort, I feel for guys like Sutton and Lasley who knock their pan in week in week out.

 

Utd have some decent players but they really didn't have to do much today, some totally kamakazie amateurish defending and they are two up and it is game over as we never tested their keeper for the whole game.

 

Ironic thing is that I thought that Vigers had his best game for us today, about time he put his arse in gear and put a shift in.

[Tweed]

Terrible performance from start to finish, I'm not even sure what tactic we were trying to play with. Melvinbragg used the phrase at the game about wingers being all sugar or all shite. Sadly today ours were shite and the United ones were sugar. We knew we were going to struggle with our defence the way it was today so it was our job today to try and prevent United from putting too much pressure on them. We failed miserably in that front and you have to wonder what the hell our midfield were doing. Lasley and Carswell both simultaneously had their worst game of the season; Vigurs is still struggling to get involved but didn't do much wrong on the ball and Ainsworth had one of these days everything went against him.

 

Also when you are struggling there is an expectation that your strikers would drop back and try and get involved in the game. Sutton did, Anier didn't and contributed close to nothing.

 

All that said, I thought we were very unlucky to be 2-0 down. We had started OK, no more or no less. The foul by Cummins that led to the first goal was soft at best and the United player who won the knockdown blatantly pushed Kerr which prevented him challenging him. Neilson should have done better but I think we should have had a foul.

Second goal, Angol was tripped before his mazy backward run and should have either taken a fall and we'd have got the foul or kicked it to hell. Again, though I think it was a foul and shouldn't have stood.

 

They then had one disallowed which looked onside and we just looked a dejected sorry lot. Second half we should have come out and pressed them hard to try and get back into it. That lasted about 10 seconds but once an apology of a tackle was ridden we were back to the same abject nonsense as before half time.

 

Goal 3 was a disgrace too. Carswell injured himself preventing a goal but we couldn't get someone on quick enough and they passed round the hole and into the net. Playing a man down for a few seconds was unforgivable and whilst I don't want to greet at a kid, but why didn't he have a shirt on so he was ready? That time cost us a goal and completely sealed the deal. The point of Carswell saving the goal and getting injured was precisely what?

 

After that it was a time passing mission. No idea where our defenders were when Robertson scored at the end. Moore did OK when he came on but all in that was one of the sorriest lacklustre displays I have ever seen and having three defenders out does not excuse it.

[ONeils40yarder]

To be honest, we've rode our luck in a few games this season - it was only a matter of time before a team gave us a bleaching

[dosser1886]

One positive today was seeing so many decent young Scottish players with real potential on the park, pity none of them play for us.

 

Also

 

Did I hear right did ZFA get young man of the match? Really!! like honest to fuck was that for real or does someone just have sick sense of humour?

[Ya Bezzer!]

Did I hear right did ZFA get young man of the match? Really!! like honest to fuck was that for real or does someone just have sick sense of humour?

 

The young player award is a lot of nonsense as you can have one young player on the field who is rank rotten who wins it by default.

 

Also I thought it was embarrassing when the main man of the match award was announced as Vigurs and the crowd booed and jeered.

 

We were very poor today but that is no excuse for supporters to do that.

[Lobey_Dosser]

Dundee Urd have a great record against us at Fir Park in recent times and for me are capable of running Aberdeen close for 2nd place.

 

Up against Robertson, Gomes, Gauld, GMS, Armstrong and Ciftci ( although he may be suspended) we could be in for a proper doing if they are on song.

 

Record of 1 point against the current top 6 not to improve any time soon.

 

Know my stuff. I just sat back and enjoyed watching United's young Scottish talent. we were always going to get pumped as soon as we came up against a half decent team. Worst squad since Malpas days.

[Spiderpig]

The young player award is a lot of nonsense as you can have one young player on the field who is rank rotten who wins it by default.

 

Also I thought it was embarrassing when the main man of the match award was announced as Vigurs and the crowd booed and jeered.

 

We were very poor today but that is no excuse for supporters to do that.

 

The supporters have every right to boo and jeer as they see fit, especially when the chosen man of the match was dross the whole game. Not everybody will agree when the MOM is announced each week, but yesterday was the exception..the whole team were rank rotten,but vigurs in partucular was anonymous and contributed feck all afternoon and most of the crowd saw that, hence the jeers.

[Tweed]

I'd actually just finished saying, is that Vigurs, I'd forgotten he was still on when the announcement came. To be fair, he was so anonymous he was one of the few that didn't give the ball away as often. ;-)

[Andy_P]

The supporters have every right to boo and jeer as they see fit.....

 

They do indeed....

 

But in doing so those supporters should realise their booing and jeering is probably going to be counter productive, that is more likely to make the player retreat into a shell, to take an easy option and hide rather than the opposite. That they won't actually start running faster, pass more accurately, become deadly in front of goal etc.

 

They should acknowledge that booing and jeering is more likely to result in barriers being built up rather strengthening the relationship between players and fans. Boo if you wish but don't then expect those players them to give you a wee wave or a clap at the end of the game, to be your best pal on twitter, to expect them to turn up at and hang around at functions signing autographs and having their pictures taken for hours with you when you've been slaughtering them and their team-mates.

 

But aye, the supporters have every right to boo and jeer as they see fit!

[Steve Diggle]

Now folk are just making shit up

[Steve Diggle]

The supporters have every right to boo and jeer as they see fit, especially when the chosen man of the match was dross the whole game. Not everybody will agree when the MOM is announced each week, but yesterday was the exception..the whole team were rank rotten,but vigurs in partucular was anonymous and contributed feck all afternoon and most of the crowd saw that, hence the jeers.

Everybody's entitled to their opinion, I get that.

 

But your statement on Vigurs is untrue and unjustified.

 

Unless in the few times that Anier and Sutton got balls to run on to, particularly in the first half, they just appeared there through divine intervention.

[100percentsteel]

Utd were faster, fitter, more skillful and more tactically aware than we were/are. The same could be said in the Aberdeen cup game and St Johnstone away.

 

I'm surprised that nobody has asked why Utd can produce and give the opportunity to so many home grown youngsters but we can't. Other than carswell no home grown youngster has been given a run under McCall. Are we not producing these players or is McCall just to stubborn to give them a chance?

 

Many mention that we have punched above our weight, lost many good players and don't have the devine right to finish in the top 3 which of course is correct, however we do as a paying supporter have the right to expect 100% effort from every singe player that pulls on a Motherwell jersey - that just didn't hppen yesterday and the best example of that was Ainsworth - one lazy lazy guy who is more interested in himself than the team - 3rd goal proved that.

 

McCall has signed the wrong type of player during the summer, has a squad that appears unfit, sends the team out without a left side' ensures both full backs raealways exposed and doesn't know how to change things - hiding behind injuries and past successs can't gloss over any of these issues.

 

To finish on a positive note I thought Fraser Kerr played well yesterday and was our best player, but I am sure he will find himself back on the bench shortly

[Spiderpig]

Everybody's entitled to their opinion, I get that.

 

But your statement on Vigurs is untrue and unjustified.

 

Unless in the few times that Anier and Sutton got balls to run on to, particularly in the first half, they just appeared there through divine intervention.

 

Yes i agree one or two good balls but time and time again Untd just ran straight through our midfield and we backed off. Vigurs and Lasley are in there to try to stop that, hold the play up win back the ball and as you say give Sutton and Anier something to work with.

But with a couple of exceptions they both failed to do that and for large parts of the game they were spectators as untd ran through them.

[something else]

Unfortunately Vigurs and Lawson have been targeted by the boo boys and no matter what they do they'll be jeered.

 

Vigurs was far from worst player yesterday but the minute he gave a ball away you could hear the booing. Same when Lawson plays. On the other hand if faddy, lasley or Carswell do it you hear nothing.

 

Vigurs and Lawson are not poor players. We just don't know how to fit them in. Mccall can't seem to see past our current central midfield partnership so it poses the question why sign them? We seem to have signed them without any thought of how they fit in to our team.

 

I also can't work out the change in our tactics recently. Sutton and Anier were doing great early season with balls into feet and playing it on the deck. Now we seem to just get McManus or someone else to lump long high balls up to them. Everyone can see its not working apart from the management.

 

Kilmarnock will be a big test for us in 2 weeks. They are really struggling and with 2 key players missing and us having all ours back, it'll be interesting.