Ya Bezzer! Posted October 5, 2014 Report Share Posted October 5, 2014 It mite only be me who thinks this but stephen mcmanus seems to swerve any criticism from motherwell fans. Hes terrible on the ball and must lose it 8/10 times he gets it, very slow at the back and gets turned very easy. A player of his international credentials should be strolling through games and controlling our defence. He doesnt seem to have any leadership qualities either. Would like to know if anyone else agrees I don't think Stephen McManus is terrible but what concerns me is what we are paying him (which I assume is a good wage) divided by what he delivers. To me is he really any better than a Steven Anderson or a Josh Meekings? I admit it's speculation on my part but I'm pretty sure he'll be one of our biggest wage earners and to me he puts in bog standard performances. For a 'big name' player with his experience with club and country he doesn't show any out of the ordinary ability or leadership qualities. I know Stephen Craigan divided opinions but putting aside his ability as a defender (which I think was good BTW) I don't think anyone could deny he was a real leader on the pitch and playing and winning for Motherwell meant something for him. I don't see that in McManus. He is not commanding, he doesn't take a game or team mates by the scruff of the neck, he doesn't organise. He seems to me to be very passive which is not a good thing in a centre back. McManus isn't the biggest problem in the team right now but we are in a hole right now and when I look around the team and look at players that should be the spine of our team, the experienced pros, the guys that can be depended on when the chips are down I just don't see it in McManus. The phrase I think sums him up would be 'disappointing'. I expected more from him than he has shown so far and I'd like to see more from him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milo Posted October 5, 2014 Report Share Posted October 5, 2014 It mite only be me who thinks this but stephen mcmanus seems to swerve any criticism from motherwell fans. Hes terrible on the ball and must lose it 8/10 times he gets it, very slow at the back and gets turned very easy. A player of his international credentials should be strolling through games and controlling our defence. He doesnt seem to have any leadership qualities either. Would like to know if anyone else agrees You're certainly not the only one who thinks this. With the experience and pedigree McManus has I was expecting much more from him and frankly from the off I've never warmed to him. Maybe it's the ex-Celtic connection but mainly it's because not only is he guilty of everything listed above but he has the look of a player who has made his money and is now merely playing out his final years close to home. His tackle in the first 30 seconds the Accies is one of the single most ridiculous, reckless, stupid and utterly needless excuses of a tackle considering not only the minutes on the clock but also the area of the pitch and the certain ramifications that I have ever seen from a Motherwell player ever. In short, he couldnae lace Craigans boots Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dosser1886 Posted October 5, 2014 Report Share Posted October 5, 2014 His tackle in the first 30 seconds the Accies is one of the single most ridiculous, reckless, stupid and utterly needless excuses of a tackle considering not only the minutes on the clock but also the area of the pitch and the certain ramifications that I have ever seen from a Motherwell player ever. Looked to me that day that he wanted to get himself sent off. Don't believe that it was an injury that meant he was subbed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lobey_Dosser Posted October 5, 2014 Report Share Posted October 5, 2014 On the whole, I like Manus but he's not quite the leader I envisaged. Pure speculation on my part but I don't think McManus would have been so quick to sign a new contract if he thought there would have been a lack of quality signed during the summer. The departure of Faddy may have caught him by surprise too, like Hammell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steelboy Posted October 5, 2014 Report Share Posted October 5, 2014 Pure speculation on my part but I don't think McManus would have been so quick to sign a new contract if he thought there would have been a lack of quality signed during the summer. we should offer him a mulligan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoF Posted October 5, 2014 Report Share Posted October 5, 2014 I've said it since about McCalls second month that he is tactically inept, however we have been fortunate to have fit squads and high quality players which have carried us - this is no longer he case I agree with most of your post, but I think this bit completely underestimates Mccall's part in firstly getting the most out of players and secondly getting them playing together. When we signed Higdon and Sutton, did any of us see them as 20+ goals per season players? Did we anticipate that Lasley and Hammell would become the beating hearts of a Motherwell side that finished 3rd, 2nd and 2nd in the league? I doubt it. Mccall's contribution goes far beyond simply having 'high quality players'. Like most on here, I am worried he's ran out of ideas and from the games I've been at this season I actually can't see how we are going to turn this corner, but I think Mccall has done more than enough to be granted more time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tweed Posted October 5, 2014 Report Share Posted October 5, 2014 We had nothing going down the sides, perhaps due to have a left footed player playing right wing and a right footed player playing left wing. To a degree, I agree that the wings are a problem but we lost three goals because the gap between midfield and defence was hug. If we stop losing cheap goals we have a chance of winning. The wingers could be better, but they should be guys who win you the game, at the moment I think our top priority needs to be sorting out the guys who can stop you losing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfc Posted October 5, 2014 Report Share Posted October 5, 2014 agreed about the gap between our defence and midfield being huge its been like that all season and for me thats where our biggest problem lies,we simply don't defend well enough as a team were all over the place as soon as we lose possesion and the majority of the time the defence are left to deal with it themselves.we need to get the finger out and start making ourselves harder to beat cause if we keep giving away the amount of daft goals that we are nothing much is going to change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StipeIsGod Posted October 5, 2014 Report Share Posted October 5, 2014 See, the disturbing thing is that the defence don't look anywhere near the strikers either, from any knockdowns from the hooooooooooooooooofed passes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shire Greats Posted October 6, 2014 Report Share Posted October 6, 2014 1412465828[/url]' post='422463']I'm not convinced by Stuart Carswell although he has the odd very good game and odd very poor one. I reckon he's a bit like Mark Fitzpatrick - a hard working journeyman no more no less. Maybe Championship standard. Agree about Stuart McCall. If he is in there to win the ball, he is too easily beaten, check out highlights fron Saturday.if he is not in there to do something other than ball winning, I don't know what it is Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fat_tony Posted October 6, 2014 Report Share Posted October 6, 2014 Was it the first goal that people are saying Vigurs didn't bother tracking back? Just seen the highlights and it clearly shows him sticking with the man all the way, despite being obviously well beaten for pace. No sign of anyone else near him. Apologies if I've got the wrong incident! Great strike from Ainsworth and maybe it's time he was given another chance in the starting line-up. Despite his habit of hiding at times, he's one of the only players capable of a moment of magic from time to time. Very disappointing goals to lose though. From the lack of cover at the first, to letting the Partick player run straight down the middle of the pitch unmarked at the third, we really need to sort out the mistakes before it's too late. To those suggesting that Carswell's not good enough - remember that despite the amount of time he's been in the first team, he's still only 21 and not yet the finished article. I definitely think he's shown the makings of a decent SPL-level midfield at worst, but his game is still developing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onthefringes Posted October 6, 2014 Report Share Posted October 6, 2014 Was it the first goal that people are saying Vigurs didn't bother tracking back? Just seen the highlights and it clearly shows him sticking with the man all the way, despite being obviously well beaten for pace. No sign of anyone else near him. Apologies if I've got the wrong incident! Great strike from Ainsworth and maybe it's time he was given another chance in the starting line-up. Despite his habit of hiding at times, he's one of the only players capable of a moment of magic from time to time. Very disappointing goals to lose though. From the lack of cover at the first, to letting the Partick player run straight down the middle of the pitch unmarked at the third, we really need to sort out the mistakes before it's too late. To those suggesting that Carswell's not good enough - remember that despite the amount of time he's been in the first team, he's still only 21 and not yet the finished article. I definitely think he's shown the makings of a decent SPL-level midfield at worst, but his game is still developing. Not so much the tracking back, it's the inability to tackle on his right hand side given the way the manager had them set up to play. Again Fraser Kerr caught way up the park and no cover from our centre pairing either... Very similar to that of the 3rd goal. Carswell has all the attributes to play the holding role in midfield, not the box to box midfield duties being asked of him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coolhandluc Posted October 6, 2014 Report Share Posted October 6, 2014 Fat tony - Vigurs does not cover for Kerr (who has ventured forward )for the first goal and so the winger gets a free run. Vigurs nearly gets back , but it's his initial awareness that's the problem I reckon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siebsbarmyarmy Posted October 6, 2014 Report Share Posted October 6, 2014 Fat tony - Vigurs does not cover for Kerr (who has ventured forward )for the first goal and so the winger gets a free run. Vigurs nearly gets back , but it's his initial awareness that's the problem I reckon Got to ask yourself. WTF is Vigurs our most creative attacking footballer doing at right back in the first instance..... Fucking stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelvinBragg Posted October 6, 2014 Report Share Posted October 6, 2014 Got to ask yourself. WTF is Vigurs our most creative attacking footballer doing at right back in the first instance..... Fucking stupid. In general, I agree with you but as I pointed out earlier with wide midfielders not providing much actual width, the onus is then on the full backs to do so. That being the case, Vigurs and Law then have a responsibility to drop back in and cover should we lose possession with full backs up the park... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wellfan84 Posted October 7, 2014 Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 Vigurs is a luxury. Ten mins at the end of a game is his best position in my opinion. Im not sure Josh Law should ever be in the 16, the boy doesnt work. At all! The main problem is shape. As said in the earlier post we are persisting with a 4-4-2 with the wrong personel. This points to the manager! Also i think its time we gave big sutton a rest! It gives us an excuse to play pointless, hopeful long balls to no one. Ojamaa up there in a 4-3-3 with erwin and Ainsworth please. Pace is what we need! P.S. Our problems do not relate to Twardzik or Mcmanus. The defence is under so much pressure every game because the midfield battle is lost at the first whistle! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbcmfc Posted October 7, 2014 Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 I agree that Vigurs is a luxury, that at the moment we can't afford, with us having quite a few players who aren't the most mobile. McCall can't seem to get his head round the fact that just because they are brothers, Josh and Nicky law are not the same player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noah Dosser Posted October 7, 2014 Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 I've not been at FP recently due to work,but from what I'm reading and seeing on telly, McManus seems even slower than last season and Twardzik makes saves for the camera. Neither are bossing the defence which is an integral part of their respective positions, especially big Mick given his pedigree. Playing Kerr out of position is starting to really undermine any good points the big fella has. Bump O'Brien who imho is no better at cb than Kerr and give McManus the pace Kerr brings beside him. Give Sutton a rest and play Henrik and Erwin for a few games to inject a bit of freshness up front. The midfield has to be sorted and maybe going 'solid' ie leaving out Vigurs, might be an option. Oh and playing guys in their correct positions in all areas might help. Anyways roll on Dundee, 3 points in this match and consolidate from there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ya Bezzer! Posted October 7, 2014 Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 Fat tony - Vigurs does not cover for Kerr (who has ventured forward )for the first goal and so the winger gets a free run. Vigurs nearly gets back , but it's his initial awareness that's the problem I reckon This. Got to ask yourself. WTF is Vigurs our most creative attacking footballer doing at right back in the first instance..... Fucking stupid. And this. Vigurs was responsible for that goal but he shouldn't have been in that position in the first place. Also, it was an excellent pass from Lawless to set it up, someone I've said over and over again should have never been allowed to leave Fir Park. As for leaving Vigurs out of the midfield, he's the only guy we've got in the midfield that can create something out of nothing so if you want to score even less goals, have even fewer goal scoring chances, even less opportunities to break the opposition down then go ahead lets do that. Vigurs has at least put the ball in the net this season and gone close elsewhere so when the entire team is playing below par why is it that the creative player gets the chop? All these 'solid' players - Carswell, Lawson, Lasley have they been so much better than Vigurs? Don't think so. You can hardly point to a player in a Motherwell shirt that's done anything this season. What we should be doing is playing a modern system of 4-2-3-1 into which Vigurs would fit perfectly while giving us some security in front of the back four. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fat_tony Posted October 7, 2014 Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 Fat tony - Vigurs does not cover for Kerr (who has ventured forward )for the first goal and so the winger gets a free run. Vigurs nearly gets back , but it's his initial awareness that's the problem I reckon Fair enough - I wasn't the game so can only comment from the highlights, which made it look like Kerr was posted missing and Vigurs forced to track the guy from the half way line. Regardless, as seen at the third goal, this is exactly the type of situation that seems to happen all the time at the moment. One player gets caught out and nobody covers them. Totally agree with you, YB regarding the system. If we want to play all our best players, and use their strengths while shoring up their weaknesses, we have to use a different system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weeyin Posted October 7, 2014 Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 McCall can't seem to get his head round the fact that just because they are brothers, Josh and Nicky law are not the same player. Do you honestly believe he is that stupid? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbcmfc Posted October 7, 2014 Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 Do you honestly believe he is that stupid? Not really, no, but he's a right back or defensive midfielder (from Alfreton town) according to all the info I can find on his career before he arrived, and McCall has tried to play him in right midfield or central midfield, even up front, all positions he played his brother in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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