Baraclough Out

[capt_oats]

You can say it takes time until you're blue in the face but it's difficult to continually make that point when one of our peers who undertook a rebuild in much the same fashion as we did (mid-season change of boss, large incomings in two transfer windows) appear much further along the road than we are. Yes we certainly were of County's equal yesterday but you could argue the same since Baraclough took over? Certainly not.

For what it's worth Andy I agree with pretty much everything you said in the post that I've lifted this quote from but I thought this was an interesting point in terms of just exactly how much McIntyre & Baraclough's record compares;

 

Ross County (under McIntyre to 12/09/15)

P W D L F A GD Pts

40 15 10 15 54 56 -2 55/120 (45%)

 

37% - win

 

Motherwell (under Baraclough to 12/09/15 not including play offs)

P W D L F A GD Pts

29 9 5 15 32 35 -3 32/87 (36%)

 

31% - win

 

(Based on the games Baras been in charge of then 2 additional wins from those played would have brought him level with McIntyre in terms of win %. Those are the sort of margins we're talking about.)

 

Ultimately you can look at the above and dismiss it with the notion that statistics can be manipulated depending on what narrative you want to put across but nevertheless there's a bit of context there so make of it what you will. 6% difference in win % and 9% difference in terms of available points won.

 

One might be more swayed by the idea that McIntyre came in and took Ross County from the foot of the table to safety and he has had an effect on the club and the team whereas in our case we've been plagued by inconsistency we've seen some excellent performances and we've equally seen some utterly abject displays which has only added to the feeling of uncertainty and doubt around the manager.

 

As it stands we're 4 points off 4th place but equally 4 points off the bottom, personally I think we look like a team that whatever reason simply isn't clicking rather than a team in complete freefall and it's the manager's job to address the reasons why we're not as fluid as we should be. As I posted in one of the other threads, for all yesterday was a complete shitfest I'm almost certain that had we been in the same position last season playing against a team in the sort of form Ross County have been in of late then we'd have lost.

 

I completely agree that getting a run of positive results with some consistent performances would go some way to alleviating the concerns.

[capt_oats]

Following on from that post earlier here's a breakdown of the records of the other managers in the league (not including Hearts and I've covered McIntyre above). Outwith Aberdeen and Celtic it's really much of a muchness, you can see that a number of teams were able to pick up points through seeing out draws but when it comes down to actual win % there really isn't that much between the majority. Where the manager has been in charge for longer than Baraclough I've just used the same time-frame.

 

Apologies for not including for and against and goal differences but frankly I couldn't be arsed adding them all up. As I said above you can take what you will from this information. Ultimately if the team isn't coherent on the park and we're seen to be struggling then it's clearly difficult to look beyond that. It's interesting to see how managers who have developed the reputations of Hartley, Hughes and Wright compare though.

 

Aberdeen (under McInnes during same period as Baraclough)

P W D L Pts

28 19 5 4 61/84 (72%)

 

Win - 67%

 

Celtic (under Deila during same period as Baraclough)

P W D L Pts

29 22 4 3 70/87 (80%)

 

Win - 75%

 

Dundee (under Hartley during same period as Baraclough)

P W D L Pts

29 9 9 11 36/87 (41%)

 

Win - 31%

 

Dundee United (under McNamara during same period as Baraclough)

P W D L Pts

29 8 5 16 29/87 (33%)

 

Win - 27%

 

Hamilton (under Canning)

P W D L Pts

24 6 6 12 24/72 (33%)

 

Win - 25%

 

ICT (under Hughes during same period as Baraclough)

P W D L Pts

29 10 9 10 39/87 (44%)

 

Win - 34%

 

Kilmarnock (under Locke)

P W D L Pts

22 4 7 12 19/66 (28%)

 

Win - 18%

 

Motherwell (under Baraclough not including play offs)

P W D L F A GD Pts

29 9 5 15 32 35 -3 32/87 (36%)

 

Win - 31%

 

Partick Thistle (under Archibald during same period as Baraclough)

P W D L Pts

29 7 9 13 30/87 (34%)

 

Win - 24%

 

St Johnstone (under Wright during same period as Baraclough)

P W D L Pts

29 11 9 9 42/87 (48%)

 

Win - 37%

[Guest]

That's actually a really interesting comparison. Perception is interesting, isn't it?

[johnstone]

Only been to the Dundee Utd game this season so not really in any position to comment, but is the fact we are missing Pearson really affecting us? I get the feeling he is the man who this whole team was built round and him getting injured has scunnered us a bit.

[Happy Dosser]

That was a dire match, but I think last year we would have lost it. The only consolation is that the equaliser was well worked and we kept going right to the end.

 

My concerns are really about simple things which seem obvious.

 

1) We can't play with two wingers because it leaves dangerous gaps in midfield. I don't think even with Pearo back this will work because if the wingers don't work hard enough by tracking back we bring pressure on our defence. I spoke to Mr P on the way out and he said two weeks anyway before he's back.

2) The lone striker tactic simply isn't working. Moult slogs his guts out but is often too isolated. He shows an excellent attitude, though.

3) Why don't we know what to do at shies? Painful to watch. The ball is usually lost.

4) Ditto with throw outs. Gannon may have been mad but he was right that kick outs should be a last resort. And when we play one up, the same result.

 

My impression of the manager is that he is too reasonable, even cerebral. Sometimes a right good boot up the jacksy is required but I don't think this is his style. This may be his downfall. And now we have our plastic pitch game coming up.......

 

No more excuses, please. Surely 442 is the most secure option at the moment? Oh, and getting right stovied in to them on Saturday.

[punk_in_drublic]

Following on from that post earlier here's a breakdown of the records of the other managers in the league (not including Hearts and I've covered McIntyre above). Outwith Aberdeen and Celtic it's really much of a muchness, you can see that a number of teams were able to pick up points through seeing out draws but when it comes down to actual win % there really isn't that much between the majority. Where the manager has been in charge for longer than Baraclough I've just used the same time-frame.

 

Apologies for not including for and against and goal differences but frankly I couldn't be arsed adding them all up. As I said above you can take what you will from this information. Ultimately if the team isn't coherent on the park and we're seen to be struggling then it's clearly difficult to look beyond that. It's interesting to see how managers who have developed the reputations of Hartley, Hughes and Wright compare though.

 

Aberdeen (under McInnes during same period as Baraclough)

P W D L Pts

28 19 5 4 61/84 (72%)

 

Win - 67%

 

Celtic (under Deila during same period as Baraclough)

P W D L Pts

29 22 4 3 70/87 (80%)

 

Win - 75%

 

Dundee (under Hartley during same period as Baraclough)

P W D L Pts

29 9 9 11 36/87 (41%)

 

Win - 31%

 

Dundee United (under McNamara during same period as Baraclough)

P W D L Pts

29 8 5 16 29/87 (33%)

 

Win - 27%

 

Hamilton (under Canning)

P W D L Pts

24 6 6 12 24/72 (33%)

 

Win - 25%

 

ICT (under Hughes during same period as Baraclough)

P W D L Pts

29 10 9 10 39/87 (44%)

 

Win - 34%

 

Kilmarnock (under Locke)

P W D L Pts

22 4 7 12 19/66 (28%)

 

Win - 18%

 

Motherwell (under Baraclough not including play offs)

P W D L F A GD Pts

29 9 5 15 32 35 -3 32/87 (36%)

 

Win - 31%

 

Partick Thistle (under Archibald during same period as Baraclough)

P W D L Pts

29 7 9 13 30/87 (34%)

 

Win - 24%

 

St Johnstone (under Wright during same period as Baraclough)

P W D L Pts

29 11 9 9 42/87 (48%)

 

Win - 37%

Good work at putting that together. But by fuck does it surprise me!

[AndyRoss]

Me too! Does this include the play-off wins?

[capt_oats]

Apologies in advance for another tl,dr post;

Good work at putting that together. But by fuck does it surprise me!

Cheers. It's one of those things I suppose. You see Motherwell and the level of football they're playing every week it's not necessarily the case with the other clubs you see them once a round of fixtures. So as thisGraeme says, it's all about how things are perceived. A good example that someone over on Pie & Bovril posted was that according to Sportsound McNamara needs "more time" (he's been there since 2013) while the "pressure in on" Alan Archibald (who's been manager at Thistle since...erm 2013).

 

As I've suggested those are just basic figures, they don't tell you anything of performances. Dundee's 9 wins within that period may well have been Bayern-level exhibitions of total football whereas another team may have scraped a series of 1-0s. In a sense Baraclough and the club have made a rod for their own backs by selling the idea of bringing through youth and a pressing, positive style of football so ultimately regardless of results they're going to be judged by this to an extent. I'd put forward the argument that deciding one way or another 7 games into the manager's first full season in charge is a bit premature.

 

Just for the sake of clarity that post isn't meant as anything other than what it is. I'm not putting forward the idea that we have the new Ancelloti or Guardiola at Fir Park just simply that within the context of the league he's managing in then Baraclough's record (given he took over the team at a particularly low ebb) actually holds up reasonably well against guys who are being lauded as unqualified successes (we're talking about a difference of 4 draws between Bara and Hartley for example though I acknowledge Dundee finished top 6.) What is certainly the case is that of our bottom 6 rivals last season he's comfortably ahead of Locke, Archibald, Canning (3 of his 6 wins are this season) and obviously Teale.

 

You can argue that Baraclough's been backed and supported by the board but so too has Locke (I don't imagine Boyd is playing for pocket money and they're chucking 3 year deals about like they're going out of fashion) while it's pretty well accepted that Roy MacGregor is chucking money at Ross County (if Jackson Irvine's reported wage is anything to go by). When it comes down to it, we're 7 games into the manager's first full season in charge so for me the level of full on knee-jerk fatalism that's accompanying every dropped point or poor performance is slightly early. He may well go on to lose another 6 in a row but similarly he might win 3 of the next 6 and we find ourselves sat mid-table.

 

Actually related to Ross County since McIntyre is being used as something of a benchmark in terms of "impact" his record from taking over til the end of the January transfer window when they hit that exceptional run of form was such:

 

Ross County

P W D L Pts

18 2 6 10 12/54 (22%)

 

Win - 11%

 

Baraclough from taking over until the end of the window was (not including the 2-2 Ross County game as Black took the team for that IIRC):

P W D L Pts

8 2 1 5 7/24 (29%)

 

Win - 25%

Me too! Does this include the play-off wins?

Nah it doesn't Andy just league form to date. I think the bulk of my numbers are right but I'll happily stand corrected if there are any errors in the arithmetic.

 

Edit: If you were to add in play off wins then that's 11 wins in 31 games so a win % of 35%.

[postiejim]

5 goals in 8 league matches, and never scoring more than 1 goal in any of those games is a damning statistic. Once again the next game is massive. Morton best us on Tuesday night the pressure on Barra will be cranked up a good few notches.

[Kmac]

Can we get rid of this imposter yet?

[Bart Verheul]

So similar to our last league cup tie. Again away to a potential banana skin and then a home time against a fellow struggler. A similar outcome would be pleasing but again would that just be re-papering over those same cracks which keep appearing.

I'll always back whoever is in charge but it is becoming increasingly difficult, in fact sometimes I feel like a lunatic constantly telling myself it'll come good eventually.

[punk_in_drublic]

It's getting me quite down now. The cycle seems to be, get pumped five or six on the trot, then scrape a couple of wins for some degree of redemption, get pumped five or six on the trot, then scrape a couple of wins for some degree of redemption and so forth.

[milo]

The people who hired him are going to have to admit they got it wrong and get him to fuck.

 

The writing is on the wall. We are fucking awful and I have seen nothing to suggest the corner is in sight, let alone about to be turned.

[swami]

Might be worth taking a scudding from Morton to get him to fuck. It's the worst brand of 'football' ever seen on the planet Earth.

[underboyleheating]

Morton will have the opportunity to put another nail in Bara's coffin next week, however, no matter the outcome I still think we should give him until Christmas to turn it around. Although I do agree at this present time it’s not looking good for Bara and the people who appointed him.

[Lobey_Dosser]

The people who hired him are going to have to admit they got it wrong and get him to fuck.

 

The writing is on the wall. We are fucking awful and I have seen nothing to suggest the corner is in sight, let alone about to be turned.

The culprits who hired him should also be getting the bullet. The incompetence spreads far wider than the coaching team.

[dossertillidie]

Really wish we could bring someone else in, the guy has contradicted himself since day dot. Don't think he's far away from losing the dressing room either. Change while there's still time to salvage this season. Can't face another like last year

[Shaka]

The culprits who hired him should also be getting the bullet. The incompetence spreads far wider than the coaching team.

Turkeys voting for xmas?! Aye ok.

 

Hutchinson isnt going to admit he was wrong and Flow is hardly going to admit he made a cunt of it either. Were stuck with this fraud until were either clear at the bottom and out the cup come january or he decides to walk.

[insrebus]

A complete imposter directing a team to play football that is brutal to watch. If I didn't have a season ticket no way would I pay in to watch that.

[GazzyB]

Held out for as long as I can, as I really genuinely like the guy and want it to work for him, but it just isn't happening. It's time for him to go.

 

We were 'punching above our weight' for a good few years, but after time what was once classed as 'punching above our weight' is surely now 'expected'. Never thought I'd say this, but us getting pumped every week is unacceptable. We as Motherwell fans should expect better, and we won't get better with this guy at the helm.

 

Time to go.

[WellTiliDie]

Imposter. Got to go, regressed big time under him and no sign of improvement. Dire again today.

[the traveller]

If the Board can not see his time is well and truly up then they should join him in disappearing as soon as possible.

[Bop]

If he doesn't disappear, the fans will. Chancer.

[MearnsWell]

It's an easy decision, do the board feel, given the clear level of investment in recruitment over the close season, that the results reflect this accurately? If not, who is accountable?

[David]

The problem I have is that whilst the manager is certainly responsible for his part in how the season has went thus far, the way in which certain players seem to have just downed tools is pretty galling.