capt_oats Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 No names doing the rounds but it wouldn't surprise me if Conor Grant was a player to come in if we're looking at two midfielders. Doesn't seem anywhere near the Everton first team and Baraclough knows what he's capable of. I could be a mile out but wouldn't be stunned if he arrived... Grant signed a new deal with them in the summer so it'd be a loan. He was playing in their Dev. Squad team the other week & seems a definite part of the team at that level. http://www.evertonfc.com/news/2015/08/29/grant-relishing-goodison-test If Flow's Twitter posts that it's more likely to be 2 players we bring in are anything to go by then I'm interested to see whether it's 2 CMs and what sort of attributes they have. As others have picked up on, all of the 5 forwards we have now (whether you think 5 is excessive or not), offer noticeably different qualities and there are still key attributes that we lack in the centre of the park (creativity, physicality, pace). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dossertillidie Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 A creative cm with pace and a defensive cm with pace would be what I'd like, not asking for much eh? Ok rb would be an area I'd like to look at but I'd prefer the above first and foremost Really don't think their could be any excuses if we got those kinda players. Board will have armed the management with all the correct tools 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ya Bezzer! Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 No names doing the rounds but it wouldn't surprise me if Conor Grant was a player to come in if we're looking at two midfielders. Doesn't seem anywhere near the Everton first team and Baraclough knows what he's capable of. I could be a mile out but wouldn't be stunned if he arrived... Couldn't break into the team last season and free kick against Ross County apart didn't show much that would turn things around for us. Better off going with some of our youngsters than a Conor Grant in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superward Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 Couldn't break into the team last season and free kick against Ross County apart didn't show much that would turn things around for us. Better off going with some of our youngsters than a Conor Grant in my opinion. He was rarely played in position. If he is brought back I don't want to see him on the wing again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelvinBragg Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 Couldn't break into the team last season and free kick against Ross County apart didn't show much that would turn things around for us. Better off going with some of our youngsters than a Conor Grant in my opinion. To make it clear, not saying that I'd go for him but wouldn't surprise me if the club did. At this point, I think if we bring in two more players then at least one of them will be a loan signing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ONeils40yarder Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 I'd like to see us bringing in a competent right back as well as a central midfielder. Law is quite obviously the weak link in the backline, and needs replaced. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lobey_Dosser Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 I think if Baraclough was keen on Grant, he'd have made a move when Pearson got injured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siebsbarmyarmy Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 I think if Baraclough was keen on Grant, he'd have made a move when Pearson got injured. May already have done, however a lot of English clubs are keen to wait till the last minute for these types of loans once they get their squads completely sorted. Flow said on Twitter how hard it can be when negotiating with other clubs and that seems to be the hold up with the other signings awaited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infamous Wee Grafter Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 I think if Baraclough was keen on Grant, he'd have made a move when Pearson got injured. If I was Conner Grant, i'd be delaying my decision and hoping for a better loan deal to a Championship club. I'd only sign for Motherwell on deadline day when I knew nothing else was happening elsewhere. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infamous Wee Grafter Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 On a sidenote, am sure I just spotted Freddie Dindeleux in Upper Crust........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malky79 Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 If I was Conor Grant I wouldn't be back unless the manager signed in blood that I was going to play in my preferred position. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goggles & Flippers Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 I always saw Conor Grant as a creative middle to front midfielder, he was also brought in before McDonald who often drops back from the forward line. Centre circle to opposition box isn't our issue. We have plenty of options, just unfortunate that quite a few are taking time to find form/adjust. If we are going to pay a portion of someone's wages with an asset we won't see any return on, I'd rather it's for something we're lacking, namely a ball winning, steady head with an engine. Conor Grant isn't that I'm afraid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelvinBragg Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 If we're looking for a ball winning midfielder, someone to break up opposition attacks then it's unlikely we'll find this player in the loan market. Players loaned out from EPL or Championship clubs tend to be young players. Very rare to find a 19/20 year old with the positional awareness and discipline to play that role. More likely to find that kind of player among the free agents out there. Having said that, a player that may be available on loan and could do a job would be Andy Murdoch at Rangers. Generally seen as their best midfielder last season (not saying much, I know) and is out of the picture at Ibrox now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capt_oats Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 The issue with a loan signing, as evidenced by Grant last season, is that the parent club is going to want the player to get substantial game time in their preferred position. If that doesn't happen then it's a bit of a waste of time for both player and parent club. If we're working on the premise that when fit our central pairing is going to be Pearson/Lasley with some rotation that sees one of those two drop down to the bench now and again then that's a pretty hard sell. Similarly you'd think that the sort of player that a club would be open to loaning to us based on a proposal of them being cover probably won't be that much better than the younger guys that we have here just now so doesn't really benefit us. Ripley being here for example is presumably on the basis of the fact that Boro have been told he'll play every week. Taylor perhaps less so but you'd imagine he's likely to be getting more game time with us than under Clarke at Reading. I suppose the ideal is to bring in either a) a younger guy with qualities the likes of Leitch and Cadden don't have that we can transition into the team over time in place of either of the senior pros or b) a more experienced player who can rotate with say Pearson or Lasley to allow the likes of Leitch or Cadden to get game time without the idea of running the midfield being on their shoulders at this stage. Our apparent business plan and approach to signings so far would suggest that the former is more likely I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dennyc Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 I always saw Conor Grant as a creative middle to front midfielder, he was also brought in before McDonald who often drops back from the forward line. Centre circle to opposition box isn't our issue. We have plenty of options, just unfortunate that quite a few are taking time to find form/adjust. If we are going to pay a portion of someone's wages with an asset we won't see any return on, I'd rather it's for something we're lacking, namely a ball winning, steady head with an engine. Conor Grant isn't that I'm afraid. Strange how different folk see different things. To my mind a creative middle to front midfielder is exactly what we are lacking. How often do we look incapable of opening up defences and killing off the opposition? In the two games last week it was up to either MacDonald or Clarkson to feed the ball through to the forwards/wingers and, with the odd exception, it just did not work. Lasley and Leitch are just not able to fill that role and it looks like the Manager does not think Cadden can either. Result, our keeper and defenders lose faith in their midfield and start humping 50 yard passes trying to pick out the wide players. The ball flying into touch over the heads of Ainsworth, Thomas or Johnson is just frustrating and pointless. With the correct supply I have no doubt any of the three wingers could tear most defences to shreds and provide numerous chances to Moult or Fletcher. Surely a mix of Lasley, Leitch, Taylor and Pearson when he is fit can provide the drive and ball winning required. If played centrally I am sure Conor Grant could provide the link up/creativity required. If that means tough decisions have to be made about who plays and who sits on the bench so be it. Under McCall I was sick of watching players struggle in positions they could not adapt to. Unless we sign someone along the lines of Grant I fear more of the same this season. Players should start in their correct position or not at all, injuries permitting. Oh, and Watt if fit must play right back. May be only my view, but there you have it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goggles & Flippers Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 If we're looking for a ball winning midfielder, someone to break up opposition attacks then it's unlikely we'll find this player in the loan market. Players loaned out from EPL or Championship clubs tend to be young players. Very rare to find a 19/20 year old with the positional awareness and discipline to play that role. More likely to find that kind of player among the free agents out there. Having said that, a player that may be available on loan and could do a job would be Andy Murdoch at Rangers. Generally seen as their best midfielder last season (not saying much, I know) and is out of the picture at Ibrox now... Players loaned out are a mixture of out of favour, out of form or young guys. Taylor is a prime example of that and who knows, maybe over the next few weeks he may grow into the role and give Pearson a run for his money when he returns. I don't see the point in bringing in another 20 year old and blooding him at the detriment of our own 20 year olds. However as you point out yourself, your argument is quashed by listing Andy Murdoch. I can understand some of the acquisitions, I'm sure Theo Robinson was seen as a "why not?", I took it as the club felt they could make money on him without major outlay almost a too good to be true he was available. What is evident, the superiority of too many down south looking at our game and thinking it is poorer than it is in reality. "Oh I'll head up there and set the heather alight" has been shown on quite a few occasions to be a tad arrogant. I recall Marvin saying the step up in fitness and sharpness required from Kidderminster was massive. I think that's been shown with a number of our southern acquisitions. Combine that with adjusting to the nuances of the SPFL and interacting with their teammates on and off the park is why we haven't had as auspicious start to the season as we all would have liked. Be under no illusion though, the excitement that has been evident over the past two windows, will be firmly footed by us in 4.5 years time. What I do like is seeing what is being built, just hope its on decent foundations and we don't replace the contractor after knee-jerk reactions to results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weeyin Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 Of course, if we are looking to sign free agents, then the window deadline is irrelevant. Also, Baraclough said in the summer they already had ideas for who the might target in January, so there will still be work to be done regardless of who comes in this month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wellfan1984 Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 True, deadline for free transfers is not till April Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weeyin Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 On a different note, seems like Ryan Christie is likely on his way out of ICT. That will be a big loss to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malky79 Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 Strange how different folk see different things. To my mind a creative middle to front midfielder is exactly what we are lacking. How often do we look incapable of opening up defences and killing off the opposition? In the two games last week it was up to either MacDonald or Clarkson to feed the ball through to the forwards/wingers and, with the odd exception, it just did not work. Lasley and Leitch are just not able to fill that role and it looks like the Manager does not think Cadden can either. Result, our keeper and defenders lose faith in their midfield and start humping 50 yard passes trying to pick out the wide players. The ball flying into touch over the heads of Ainsworth, Thomas or Johnson is just frustrating and pointless. With the correct supply I have no doubt any of the three wingers could tear most defences to shreds and provide numerous chances to Moult or Fletcher. Surely a mix of Lasley, Leitch, Taylor and Pearson when he is fit can provide the drive and ball winning required. If played centrally I am sure Conor Grant could provide the link up/creativity required. If that means tough decisions have to be made about who plays and who sits on the bench so be it. Under McCall I was sick of watching players struggle in positions they could not adapt to. Unless we sign someone along the lines of Grant I fear more of the same this season. Players should start in their correct position or not at all, injuries permitting. Oh, and Watt if fit must play right back. May be only my view, but there you have it What Pearson and Lasley provide for me is a jack of all trades type of player. Tenacious, decent in possession, able to put in tackles, can provide a bit of creativity but not in spades. For me as the younger and physically stronger of the two Pearson is the one with the stronger all around game with a bit more going forward than Lasley generally shows. Without Pearson my biggest issues is how we cope on the defensive side, we have wingers who can create and forwards who can link play and show a bit of creativity deeper even if it not exactly clicking right now. If we can bring in a player that ticks all the boxes fantastic but I'd settle right now for a strong physical presence who can break up play, protect our back four and play it simple. We might not be banging them in left right and centre but if we were just a bit harder to beat when it isn't clicking I reckon we'd be sitting with at least a few more points right now. I trust in Johnson, Ainsworth, and Thomas to provide a creative spark, Fletcher and Moult have done enough to provide cautious optimism. McDonald and Clarkson in different ways are a concern, one is playing plenty but not looking that great and the other already looks out in the cold and fitness rather than quality seems to be the issue. If we looked more solid in the middle then hopefully McDonald can play further forward and do damage in the final third, at 32 he should be more than capable still. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capt_oats Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 On a different note, seems like Ryan Christie is likely on his way out of ICT. That will be a big loss to them. Is it not part of the deal that he gets loaned back to them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weeyin Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 It's a tricky one. The problem if we play any 2 of Johnson, Aisnworth & Thomas is that inevitably leaves the 2 central midfielders to to all the heavy lifting. If they are up against a 3-5-1 (which is often the case, especially at home), that is a lot of ground to cover. On the other hand, if we sacrifice a winger for a more defensive midfielder we are losing a large part of our attacking advantage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weeyin Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 Is it not part of the deal that he gets loaned back to them? Depends who buys him presumably. Celtic are in the frame and I'd think they'd be keen on putting him in the first team given his SPFL experience. If he goes south (which is still possible), who knows what kind of deal they'll require. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capt_oats Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 Depends who buys him presumably. Celtic are in the frame and I'd think they'd be keen on putting him in the first team given his SPFL experience. If he goes south (which is still possible), who knows what kind of deal they'll require. Yeah, Hughes was banging on about it a while back. To be honest, I don't really see that he'll be in much of a position to make demands like that unless the buying club are feeling particularly charitable. http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/spfl/john-hughes-wants-ryan-christie-back-on-loan-1-3858296 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capt_oats Posted August 31, 2015 Report Share Posted August 31, 2015 Grant's actually playing in the Everton U21s team right now: https://twitter.com/Everton/status/638321168496369664 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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