Kmcalpin Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 The GB get that level of policing because of the damage in the South Stand, at Tynecastle, Pittodrie etc. not because of the fact they break a football behaviour law. Not to mention their "song book" consists of song that would break other, more serious laws if Police Scotland, Celtic FC and the other clubs had more of a backbone Unfortunately religious sectarianism runs much deeper than that in Scotland. I'm not defending Police Scotland here but if they took action serious questions would be asked at Holyrood and pressure brought to bear on it by by politicians. In the great scheme of things Police Scotland is simply a pawn in a much larger game here. For various reasons sectarianism is just too hot a topic for our establishment to deal with. In this regard Scotland is still living in the Jurassic age. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McCusker Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Without wanting to defend the green brigade, I'm very glad we don't get the treatment they get. The level of policing they get is mental, all for singing songs that some folk don't agree with. what a statement to make, i cannot believe that has been said by a motherwell fan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steelman1991 Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Without wanting to defend the green brigade, I'm very glad we don't get the treatment they get. The level of policing they get is mental, all for singing songs that some folk don't agree with. LOL and another reason why the legislation was introduced - because certain elements of their support and society in general took offence at the singing of songs they didn't agree with. How ironic. Clearly they reckoned that the legislation would be introduced purely for the 'other' side and now aren't best pleased when they realise that bigotry is a two way street. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superward Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Without wanting to defend the green brigade, I'm very glad we don't get the treatment they get. The level of policing they get is mental, all for singing songs that some folk don't agree with. ....oh dear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 what was the tennis ball relevance? I saw someone on twitter mention they did it in Switzerland as a protest re tennis holding up a KO time. but not sure what it was about here. Spain. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PUgYpJyZIA4 The Sevilla - Levante game was delayed so that the telly could show the post match press conference after Barcelona - Madrid, so their ultras section organised everyone bringing in a tennis ball. Great protest. FWIW, I fully agree with what Dee posted on this. The OB act is an absolute nonsense, chucked through a government because two grown men had a bit of a shoving match on a touchline, while a collection of people who don't watch football got awfully upset and started talking about ONLY IN SCOTLAND WOULD WE ALLOW THIS, apparently ignorant that across the world, there are rivalries based on just about anything you'd like to think of which are far more violent and intense. Not to suggest that the issue of sectarianism in Scotland isn't one which should be addressed, but really, arresting football fans will make absolutely fuck all difference to this. By the time you're big enough to go to the football and start chucking around yer songs and whatever, getting lifted isn't going to change that. It's a sticking plaster on a gaping wound which made good soundbites on a front page. "Sectarianism? We're fixing it by arresting everycunt!" Ultimately, neither stewards or police are going to get torn into crowds of 3000 Old Firm fans and start rooting people out, as we saw when they decided to smash up the south stand. However, they will go diving into crowds of a few hundred, as we've seen for our own support at St Mirren, and start trying to put the shiters up young supporters. Smaller clubs were always going to suffer from this more, due to smaller numbers. Previous legislation was in place to deal with 'sectarian' issues within football supports, the OB act adds a whole other level to this. This isn't in any way a suggestion that either the Green Brigade, or the Bois, or whoever else in Scotland is getting hassle are entirely blameless in any of this. As groups, they need to take responsibility for some of their actions and appreciate that running on to pitches, pyro and whatever does have consequences (although it doesn't massively concern me, as its hardly causing huge amounts of harm, but that's an entirely different debate). However, when you see Police threatening folk with their CS Spray, dragging teenagers out their beds at the crack of dawn and chucking them in cells, videoing fans for 90 minutes and launching batons at folk, I'd suggest that the fan groups aren't the only ones that need to be held responsible. I understand that fan groups have been contacting MSPs and MPs seeking responses to this, but really, when those that are elected are the ones that decided it was required in the first place, I can understand why that avenue doesn't really hold a great deal of hope, so the other option is to raise awareness and have a movement of fans, pushing for it. Such circumstances dictate that, like it or lump it, you have to stand alongside Celtic, Rangers, Aberdeen, Hibs, Hearts and whoever to do so. I disagree with a large chunk of what each of these other groups say or the way they say it (Except #BattleFever, cause that was fucking hilarious), but crack on, let them do what they want to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
something else Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 what a statement to make, i cannot believe that has been said by a motherwell fan. I have my doubts on whether he actually is a well fan. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busta Nut Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 What was #BattleFever ? It sounds good Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mio Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 The Celtic fans i know are about: 70% (good guys) want rid of the Green Brigade and find them an emarrassment and hinderence to their club. 20% (questionable beliefs) Think they help the atmosphere at a generally dead stadium. 10% (moronic imbeciles) Believe their political agenda should be listenened to. i always follow the 70 / 20 / 10 % rule with most things to do with Scotland and its population!! 70% ok 20% iffy and 10% cocks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weeyin Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Even the good guys can show a level of bigotry though - and not just OF fans. I have known a few fans of various teams who seem pretty level-headed before coming out with some weird sectarian comments. It runs deep in the West of Scotland on both sides of the religious divide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john_M_F_C Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 what a statement to make, i cannot believe that has been said by a motherwell fan. Why would you want folk to get the jail for singing songs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superward Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Why would you want folk to get the jail for singing songs? You are making this worse. I would probably stop now mate. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milo Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Even the good guys can show a level of bigotry though - and not just OF fans. I have known a few fans of various teams who seem pretty level-headed before coming out with some weird sectarian comments. It runs deep in the West of Scotland on both sides of the religious divide. You're totally right, but there are only 2 clubs who pander to these beliefs, act as a vehicle for them and exploit them (quite successfully) to their own financial gain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McCusker Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Why would you want folk to get the jail for singing songs? because they dont just sing songs do they, thats a very naive thing to say, they also wreck stadiums, chant and display things that have no place in a civilised society in 2015, attack people and politicise football for their own means and yet a section of our OWN fans thought it would be a great idea to do a joint protest. dear oh dear. im glad the majority on here think it was a stupid idea. maybe the bill isnt what it should be but i still stand by my post of "dont act like a dick and you wont get ejected or get the jail" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milo Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 The Celtic fans i know are about: 70% (good guys) want rid of the Green Brigade and find them an emarrassment and hinderence to their club. 20% (questionable beliefs) Think they help the atmosphere at a generally dead stadium. 10% (moronic imbeciles) Believe their political agenda should be listenened to. i always follow the 70 / 20 / 10 % rule with most things to do with Scotland and its population!! 70% ok 20% iffy and 10% cocks. For the Celtic (and Sevco) fans I know or have encountered I would have it at 70% cocks, 20% iffy and 10% ok. The strongest condemnation I've ever heard of their songs is "I wouldn't sing them at the games". I usually then would put it to them "but you'd sing them in the pub" to which they would usually just wink and it would need to be left there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fizoxy Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 If the bois and HHES want to gain any traction with their protests, they need to do a far better job of engaging the folk who are indifferent to their plight. This thread has shown that currently they are miles away from achieving this. It may be worth trying to look at this from the point of view of the average supporter, who really just wants to watch their team play football and doesn't feel the need to jump around or sing. What they see is every now and then some supporters run on the pitch, let off flares, etc, and therefore are hardly surprised when they hear of fans getting lifted. Then on the occasion when the bois have been hard done by, it's difficult to give them the benefit of the doubt. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 What was #BattleFever ? It sounds good It was before the first leg of the playoff, they decided to start saying #battlefever on twitter. It was fucking wonderful: https://twitter.com/AlexofHunter/status/603983939913519104 https://twitter.com/micklangrangers/status/603973912381267969 https://twitter.com/ya4_sure/status/603968689101217792 A small selection of the absolute riddy that it was. Wonderful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjw Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 It was before the first leg of the playoff, they decided to start saying #battlefever on twitter. It was fucking wonderful: https://twitter.com/AlexofHunter/status/603983939913519104 https://twitter.com/micklangrangers/status/603973912381267969 https://twitter.com/ya4_sure/status/603968689101217792 A small selection of the absolute riddy that it was. Wonderful. It's from a Jock Wallace team talk. The had a card display at the pawnshop cup final against Raith Rovers. They maybe should have retired it then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wellfan1984 Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Why would you want folk to get the jail for singing songs? Why do people want people jailed for singing or creating signs for praising Al Quida? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steelboy Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Did we not have a daft slogan for one of the cup finals? On the topic of the Bill pretty much everything people are getting arrested of the stuff was already illegal the problem is the Bill creates a different burden of proof and punishment for football fans compared to the rest of society. It's massively discriminatory and would have been laughed out of Westminster or any country with a credible press. The maximum sentence for internet based football abuse is harsher than for carrying a knife which is mental. However could repeal the Bill tomorrow and Police Scotland would still do all the same things. The problem is that they have been given extra money because football fans have been identified as a problem and as long as that is a source of funding they will ensure it remains a problem. If people want football policing to return to reasonable levels pressure should be put on Holyrood to focus police resources on things like money laundering and pursuing violent organised crime because if they can get away with continuing to pick on motorists and football fans they will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DunnyMFC Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Why would you want folk to get the jail for singing songs? You done goofed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john_M_F_C Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Why do people want people jailed for singing or creating signs for praising Al Quida? Because of intolerance. Personally I wouldn't want people supporting an extremist islamic group to get the jail either. You don't change peoples views, no matter how repulsive they are, by making them illegal. It pushes them further underground, and further entrenches people. The green brigade's views are going to be repulsive to some, I fully understand that, but we can't let a political class dictate what is right or wrong. or in the case of the bill, where you can be more wrong, that's verging on the totalitarian groups like al Quieda and ISIS. Did we not have a daft slogan for one of the cup finals? On the topic of the Bill pretty much everything people are getting arrested of the stuff was already illegal the problem is the Bill creates a different burden of proof and punishment for football fans compared to the rest of society. It's massively discriminatory and would have been laughed out of Westminster or any country with a credible press. The maximum sentence for internet based football abuse is harsher than for carrying a knife which is mental. However could repeal the Bill tomorrow and Police Scotland would still do all the same things. The problem is that they have been given extra money because football fans have been identified as a problem and as long as that is a source of funding they will ensure it remains a problem. If people want football policing to return to reasonable levels pressure should be put on Holyrood to focus police resources on things like money laundering and pursuing violent organised crime because if they can get away with continuing to pick on motorists and football fans they will. You're wrong on the count that the bill is getting people arrested for things that are already illegal, but certainly convictions for it have all been for things that were already illegal. You're right on the burden of proof though, it makes it very easy to get arrested now, as the police only need to say that your actions may have offended any right minded person, or that they could have caused disorder, even if measures were in place to prevent disorder. That isn't right. The bill helps perpetuate the notion that we, as football fans, are all working class yobs, that drink, fight and offend, as we all know, that's far from the truth. It suits a political agenda that makes football fans look loutish, and it suits the police to collect extra money to make us look like apes. It doesn't matter what else we as Motherwell fans stand for, we should be standing against this act of parliament. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al B Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Everyone's thinking it, but I'm going to ask... Are you about 15? Or a teenager at least? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john_M_F_C Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Everyone's thinking it, but I'm going to ask... Are you about 15? Or a teenager at least? Can't come back on content, boils it down to a self righteous comment about age... Come back to me on the offensive behaviour at football act. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al B Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 There's about 5 pages now, chock full of people coming back to you on content, and not one single person agreeing with you. At best there's a couple of examples of (to paraphrase) "I see where you're trying to come from, but have gone about it in a wrong and completely counterproductive way". So I think we can put your claim about not being able to come back on content, firmly to bed. Aside from that, it wasn't a comeback or attack in any way, shape or form. It was a genuine question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjw Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 The bill helps perpetuate the notion that we, as football fans, are all working class yobs, that drink, fight and offend, as we all know, that's far from the truth. It suits a political agenda that makes football fans look loutish, and it suits the police to collect extra money to make us look like apes. Oh dear.You've just described most of the people I sit with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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