The Stewarding/policing Thread

[mjw]

 

Can you point to the singing of any offensive sectarian songs sang at Fir Park this season, by the 'Well Bois? the "rules" were brought in to tackle sectarian abuse. As it stands it's to tackle anything offensive, which again, there's not been anything offensive from the 'Well Bois.

 

There's been individual incidents where individual Motherwell fans have acted in a way that might incite disorder, part of the act, but on the whole, the "rules" have been adhered to by those trying to change it.

 

The problem here doesn't lie with the 'Bois, it's with the "holier than thou" folk, who seem incapable of a better solution to change things yet feel the need to call everybody else's "childlike".

Is 'holier than thou' the same as a bed wetter?

[Graeme Bremner]

 

Thought it was quite ironic that both sets of 'Bois' at Perth on Saturday, home and away, seemed to be co-ordinated in displaying their 'anti-Bill' banners at kick off then at full time some of them were kicking seven shades of shite out of each other down where the buses were parked. Yeah, it's the establishment's fault....arseholes.

 

Agree with u completely mate but watch we cant criticise the bois on here some people get really sad and it hurts they feelings

[superward]

Noticed all the St Johnstone kids running towards that way when I was walking to the car. Wondered what was happening and if anything had kicked off.

[Onthefringes]

Agree with u completely mate but watch we cant criticise the bois on here some people get really sad and it hurts they feelings

 

[Joeboy]

 

Can you point to the singing of any offensive sectarian songs sang at Fir Park this season, by the 'Well Bois? the "rules" were brought in to tackle sectarian abuse. As it stands it's to tackle anything offensive, which again, there's not been anything offensive from the 'Well Bois.

 

There's been individual incidents where individual Motherwell fans have acted in a way that might incite disorder, part of the act, but on the whole, the "rules" have been adhered to by those trying to change it.

 

The problem here doesn't lie with the 'Bois, it's with the "holier than thou" folk, who seem incapable of a better solution to change things yet feel the need to call everybody else's "childlike".

 

I certainly remember you singing a song about our own manager at the St. Johnstone home game, which hardly painted the bois or the club very well.

[Onthefringes]

 

I certainly remember you singing a song about our own manager at the St. Johnstone home game, which hardly painted the bois or the club very well.

 

Snitches get stitches mind

[Al B]

 

Can you point to the singing of any offensive sectarian songs sang at Fir Park this season, by the 'Well Bois? the "rules" were brought in to tackle sectarian abuse. As it stands it's to tackle anything offensive, which again, there's not been anything offensive from the 'Well Bois.

 

There's been individual incidents where individual Motherwell fans have acted in a way that might incite disorder, part of the act, but on the whole, the "rules" have been adhered to by those trying to change it.

 

The problem here doesn't lie with the 'Bois, it's with the "holier than thou" folk, who seem incapable of a better solution to change things yet feel the need to call everybody else's "childlike".

You aren't interested in anyone else's suggestions if they don't match your own. You just want to be told you're doing it right. Anyone who doesn't is "Holier than thou".

 

Here's a clue though...solutions to problems generally start with listening. Give it a try sometime.

 

If there are 5 points to a rule, and you want to change point 5 because you dont think its fair, the authorities will refuse to listen if you have flaunted rules 1-4. You can't then turn round and say..."yeah but that doesn't matter because we only want to change point 5 and we've not done anything wrong with that one".

 

Life doesn't work like that.

 

Yes, there are some Motherwell fans who are critical of what you do, but there are also those whose comments are trying to help, but until you pay attention to the difference and stop lumping everyone that doesn't tell you what you want to hear into the same category, then you are just making things harder than they need to be.

 

There is a large cross-section of fans who are explicitly tell you you that they agree with what you are trying to do, but it all-too-often comes across looking like the intent has nothing to do with changing anything, but purely revolving around being able to do whatever you want. You need to listen to these people because the sooner you realise that isn't actually criticism or disapproval, then the sooner you will find these "better suggestions" for change that you say you are looking for.

 

If that's how it looks to the people who are generally on your side, then you'd have to be a prize moron to not appreciate how it looks to those on opposing sides to your argument. Motherwell fans are trying to give you a heads up, and you're generally telling them to piss off. Which proves them right unfortunately.

[john_M_F_C]

You aren't interested in anyone else's suggestions if they don't match your own. You just want to be told you're doing it right. Anyone who doesn't is "Holier than thou".

 

Here's a clue though...solutions to problems generally start with listening. Give it a try sometime.

 

If there are 5 points to a rule, and you want to change point 5 because you dont think its fair, the authorities will refuse to listen if you have flaunted rules 1-4. You can't then turn round and say..."yeah but that doesn't matter because we only want to change point 5 and we've not done anything wrong with that one".

 

Life doesn't work like that.

 

Yes, there are some Motherwell fans who are critical of what you do, but there are also those whose comments are trying to help, but until you pay attention to the difference and stop lumping everyone that doesn't tell you what you want to hear into the same category, then you are just making things harder than they need to be.

 

There is a large cross-section of fans who are explicitly tell you you that they agree with what you are trying to do, but it all-too-often comes across looking like the intent has nothing to do with changing anything, but purely revolving around being able to do whatever you want. You need to listen to these people because the sooner you realise that isn't actually criticism or disapproval, then the sooner you will find these "better suggestions" for change that you say you are looking for.

 

If that's how it looks to the people who are generally on your side, then you'd have to be a prize moron to not appreciate how it looks to those on opposing sides to your argument. Motherwell fans are trying to give you a heads up, and you're generally telling them to piss off. Which proves them right unfortunately.

 

There's been no suggestions around how to gain support for a repeal of the OBFA, and the wider issue of fan treatment.

[dennyc]

 

There's been no suggestions around how to gain support for a repeal of the OBFA, and the wider issue of fan treatment.

Absolute nonsense. Several people have made well intended, supportive suggestions. In particular a post I made on 21 October Under the "Issues With Stewarding On Tuesday Night " thread. Page 12.

 

Don't know how to copy it over to this thread but maybe someone more able than me could fire it across for you to have a read at. Thought you might have remembered that discussion though, as it followed post after post by you trying to justify standing side by side with your Green Brigade allies.

 

And as if by magic. On the weekend before a Fans' Petition questioning the merits of the Legislation was due to be discussed at the Scottish Parliament, a number of your Celtic supporting friends decided to undo any progress achieved by disgracing themselves yet again at their cup tie in Stranraer. The media loved that one - Pyrotechnics, fighting with police/stewards and sectarian singing. A full house. No wonder the Politicians feel justified in supporting the legislation.

[weeyin]

Aye, unfortunately, the OF fans' behaviour was responsible for a lot of the laws we endure now - especially in regard to drinking at, and travelling to, matches. Sadly, not much has changed.

[underboyleheating]

 

Motherwell fans arrested over fight against Hearts supporters

[mjw]

Motherwell fans attacked by hearts fans arrested for defending themselves.

[weeyin]

No idea what the circumstances were, but under the law, typically the "defending yourself" test means running away unless you're backed up against a wall with no escape route.

 

Whether that's fair or not is up for debate.

[steelboy]

The 'fight' was a non event but it'll all be on cctv.

 

Very difficult to claim self defence when your throwing a traffic cone

[1991]

Of what I saw it was handbags but did see the cone incident but wasn't sure it was a well fan, surprised to read a 51 year old arrested as what I saw it looked like young boys involved. The steward who locked the gate keeping the Well fans on the street should have a few questions to answer too

[Busta Nut]

I was "trapped" outside the closed gate. I never saw any real fighting. think one guy got punched once or twice.

[underboyleheating]

...surprised to read a 51 year old arrested

This surprised me as well, what the hell is a 51 year old doing getting involved in a scrap between young boys? Mental.

[Kmcalpin]

Given the very political and high profile nature of football policing and stewarding, its often very hard to make much sense of any incidents that occur from the reporting, unless we are present. Whether we like it or not, incidents involving football fans are treated differently from other types of incidents.

[Onthefringes]

This surprised me as well, what the hell is a 51 year old doing getting involved in a scrap between young boys? Mental.

 

Conjecture. Dare say the truth will out though.

[Ya Bezzer!]

At least we know where all the Well Bois were on Saturday - in hiding!

[underboyleheating]

Not sure how many are involved, however, Motherwell supporters are among 100 teenage football fans banned from attending matches during the past three years. The clubs named are: Celtic, Dundee United, Dunfermline, Hamilton, Hearts, Hibs, Motherwell and Rangers

[cambo97]

Not sure how many are involved, however, Motherwell supporters are among 100 teenage football fans banned from attending matches during the past three years. The clubs named are: Celtic, Dundee United, Dunfermline, Hamilton, Hearts, Hibs, Motherwell and Rangers

 

The BBC mentioned that 13 were from Scotland.

[underboyleheating]

 

The BBC mentioned that 13 were from Scotland.

Any numbers on which clubs the banned fans support? Hopefully Motherwell fans are in the minority.

[cambo97]

Any numbers on which clubs the banned fans support? Hopefully Motherwell fans are in the minority.

 

No but there's 8 teams mentioned so the most it is 6.

 

Link to BBC story >> http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-36571259