MelvinBragg Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 Have to say that I agree that our youth system should be the priority. Have been impressed with what I've seen of Ross MacLean and if he could have a similar impact to Cadden then we would save ourselves some money. Also not impossible to see Mackin jump ahead of Blyth in the queue for a first team spot. What we have to hope for is that we try and get these guys on longer contracts and try and avoid losing them or avoid losing them for less than their value as seems to have happened with Hall and Robbie Leitch. MacLean is only contracted until the summer and I'm not sure of the situation with the others who have shown promise. It's one thing for the fans to show patience and understand that the club is going down this route and for the club to develop these guys well at under 20 level. The club also has to plan long term, being wiling to offer contracts to some that might not make it is a risk but protects us if players do develop as we hope. Also there has to be a willingness at first team level to take a calculated risk. McHugh got injured with us 2-0 up at Kilmarnock. Chalmers was brought on rather than Campbell, a more natural replacement. It's great that the U20s are showing promise. The club have to make the most of it though... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joeboy Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 One of my thoughts coming away from the game last night was that we need to take this opportunity to send Campbell out on loan till January, maybe even for the season. If he is behind Lasley, McHugh and Clay in the pecking order then get him somewhere we he will play competitive football week in, week out. We allowed Carswell, Thomas and McHugh to stagnate on our bench at a similar age and it seems to have been costly. Campbell looks like he has great potential and we should do all we can to make the most of it. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capt_oats Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 One of my thoughts coming away from the game last night was that we need to take this opportunity to send Campbell out on loan till January, maybe even for the season. If he is behind Lasley, McHugh and Clay in the pecking order then get him somewhere we he will play competitive football week in, week out. We allowed Carswell, Thomas and McHugh to stagnate on our bench at a similar age and it seems to have been costly. Campbell looks like he has great potential and we should do all we can to make the most of it. ^^^ 100% this. There are another couple in that group who would really benefit from development loans at the right clubs IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelvinBragg Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 One of my thoughts coming away from the game last night was that we need to take this opportunity to send Campbell out on loan till January, maybe even for the season. If he is behind Lasley, McHugh and Clay in the pecking order then get him somewhere we he will play competitive football week in, week out. We allowed Carswell, Thomas and McHugh to stagnate on our bench at a similar age and it seems to have been costly. Campbell looks like he has great potential and we should do all we can to make the most of it.It's a fair point. Cadden seems to have benefited from that. I seem to recall McGhee saying something along the lines of the aim was to have our young players ready for the first team at 18 or 19 rather than 20 or 21 so anything that helps should be looked at. What I would say is that Campbell has just turned 18. What level would we be loaning him out to where we could be sure he'd get first team games? There is no point in loaning him out if he isn't going to be playing most weeks wherever we send him and the same applies to anyone we send out on loan... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capt_oats Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 It's a fair point. Cadden seems to have benefited from that. I seem to recall McGhee saying something along the lines of the aim was to have our young players ready for the first team at 18 or 19 rather than 20 or 21 so anything that helps should be looked at. What I would say is that Campbell has just turned 18. What level would we be loaning him out to where we could be sure he'd get first team games? There is no point in loaning him out if he isn't going to be playing most weeks wherever we send him and the same applies to anyone we send out on loan... Both Mackin and Ferguson were dev loaned out to Airdrie for the 2nd half of last season. If wiki's appearance stats are accurate Mackin had 11 appearances, Ferguson 9. In his interview before the Edinburgh City game the other week Craigan indicated it'd be likely that a few of them would be loaned out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lobey_Dosser Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 Craigan mentioned post match that he hopes 3 or 4 can make the 1st team this season. Ross MacLean strikes me as the one with the style of play, intelligence and work ethic to slot right into McGhee's plans. I suspect we'd have seen more of him by now if it hadn't been for injuries. Who else could make the 1st team this season? Watt? He's clearly got ability but he looks like one that could do with addressing his lapses in concentration and playing against experienced strikers at League 1 level for a few months. I'm convinced Campbell is the star man. Fully expect him to be loaned out to a team that plays possession style football. Thinking back to the East Fife cup game, that would be an ideal move for him. Suspect Kevin McBride will have been impressed by a few last night and will likely make enquiries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ya Bezzer! Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 One of my thoughts coming away from the game last night was that we need to take this opportunity to send Campbell out on loan till January, maybe even for the season. If he is behind Lasley, McHugh and Clay in the pecking order then get him somewhere we he will play competitive football week in, week out. We allowed Carswell, Thomas and McHugh to stagnate on our bench at a similar age and it seems to have been costly. Campbell looks like he has great potential and we should do all we can to make the most of it. You can't just arbitrarily decide to loan a player out though. You need to find a club who are looking to bring someone in and where he is likely to get match time. There are a lot of promising young players and experienced old hands at that level already so you need to find the right place for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ya Bezzer! Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 My point is that we haven't had a keeper progress from the youth setup to the first team in twenty five years plus. I tried to think of one keeper since Woods and Howie that has come through and even featured regularly on the bench. Not one that I could think of. We've actually produced quite a few goalkeepers for other teams if not our selves. Max Currie, Jamie Ewings, Ross Stewart, Alan Martin....all playing in the league system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joeboy Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 You can't just arbitrarily decide to loan a player out though. You need to find a club who are looking to bring someone in and where he is likely to get match time. There are a lot of promising young players and experienced old hands at that level already so you need to find the right place for them. Obviously I know it's not as simple as that. I mean that we should send the feelers out and see who is interested. If I was a league one or league two gaffer, I'd be delighted to have him on loan, based on what I've seen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al B Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 Having a system of play that the kids and U20's play, regardless of how impressive or effective it is, is utterly pointless if the first team don't play that way. All that will happen is the 3/4/5 youngsters who go on to become first-team professionals with the club will be drip-fed into a side that doesn't do what they have spent the last 4 years learning. The only other way it would see long term benefit is if the bulk of the U20's became the bulk of the first team, and that's obviously never going to happen due to the financial limitations of how many we can offer contracts to. The style of play has to be consistent throughout the club for anything to be gained from it, starting with the first team and filtering down. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuwell Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 The style of play has to be consistent throughout the squads for anything to be gained from it, starting with the first team and filtering down. If we're going down that route then that's the passing game fucked. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catweazles ring piece Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 Having a system of play that the kids and U20's play, regardless of how impressive or effective it is, is utterly pointless if the first team don't play that way. All that will happen is the 3/4/5 youngsters who go on to become first-team professionals with the club will be drip-fed into a side that doesn't do what they have spent the last 4 years learning. The only other way it would see long term benefit is if the bulk of the U20's became the bulk of the first team, and that's obviously never going to happen due to the financial limitations of how many we can offer contracts to. The style of play has to be consistent throughout the club for anything to be gained from it, starting with the first team and filtering down. For me, the passing game of the u20's is the way to go. All European teams pyramid, styles and tactics toward top team action. I'd be disappointed if M.McG didn't actively encourage this style when players and tactics eventually gel. One thing for sure, present and possibly past coaches deserve mega plaudits for the style and swagger of the young lads. Fantastic technique and entertaining football. I just hope it's not booted out of them as they progress ( as referenced by Al B) A few should also look at Cadden and work on body strength in parallel with skill and touch. Even if they devote extra time in the gym and work on programs through the fitness coach, I'm sure this would enhance their development. Long term strategy, but worth it when you don't have squillions to spend. Interesting times with the youth! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMWellfan Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 Having a system of play that the kids and U20's play, regardless of how impressive or effective it is, is utterly pointless if the first team don't play that way. All that will happen is the 3/4/5 youngsters who go on to become first-team professionals with the club will be drip-fed into a side that doesn't do what they have spent the last 4 years learning. The only other way it would see long term benefit is if the bulk of the U20's became the bulk of the first team, and that's obviously never going to happen due to the financial limitations of how many we can offer contracts to. The style of play has to be consistent throughout the club for anything to be gained from it, starting with the first team and filtering down. And we had our chance to promote a promising group of under-20's this close season and McGhee bottled it by offering contracts to geriatrics. And you know what, some on this forum celebrated the geriatrics getting new contracts. How's that working out for you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superward Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 And we had our chance to promote a promising group of under-20's this close season and McGhee bottled it by offering contracts to geriatrics. And you know what, some on this forum celebrated the geriatrics getting new contracts. How's that working out for you? Just fine. We are only 3 games into the league season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Wellfan 2k7 Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 Just fine. We are only 3 games into the league season. Only two really... I still count that Celtic game as preseason ... We didn't really want to play it anyway.. All about fitness... Ye know... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMWellfan Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 Just fine. We are only 3 games into the league season. Noted. We'll revisit this later in the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weeyin Posted August 17, 2016 Report Share Posted August 17, 2016 Noted. We'll revisit this later in the season. What U20s do you think are ready for promotion that won't get played at some stage this season? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuwell Posted August 18, 2016 Report Share Posted August 18, 2016 If Celtic qualify for the CL and we get £250,000 at some point through the season, is it possible that the playing budget would be increased allowing MMcG to sign a further player or two or should it go on improving player facilities to make the club more attractive to sign for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lobey_Dosser Posted August 18, 2016 Report Share Posted August 18, 2016 If Celtic qualify for the CL and we get £250,000 at some point through the season, is it possible that the playing budget would be increased allowing MMcG to sign a further player or two or should it go on improving player facilities to make the club more attractive to sign for? Autumn 2017 before we'd receive the CL 'solidarity' payment according to Burrows on Twitter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al B Posted August 18, 2016 Report Share Posted August 18, 2016 And we had our chance to promote a promising group of under-20's this close season and McGhee bottled it by offering contracts to geriatrics. And you know what, some on this forum celebrated the geriatrics getting new contracts. How's that working out for you? Replying to a post you agree with and you still have to do it with a smartarse, confrontational tone. Unreal. No wonder everyone thinks you're a bellend. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrosshillWell Posted August 18, 2016 Report Share Posted August 18, 2016 Hammell, still to this day, is one of the best left backs in Scotland. I as much as anyone have concerns over his continued fitness, but as with Lasley, the managers over the last three seasons have struggled to find a younger replacement. ZFA and Straker? I'd imagine that signing both Hammell and Lasley on reduced terms is as much to develop their coaching ability as their influence on the park. I believe we need a left back, I don't think Chalmers is the solution, but I don't believe insulting and alienating the members of the forum is the catalyst for a structured debate on the subject. I'm sure Campbell will feature this season and I'm also sure that had we'll have a midfield three of McHugh, Clay and Cadden, when both Clay and Moult are back fit. The Celtic and St Johnstone games were concerning, but let us see who appears on Saturday. If we play with Samson at the back, McDonald stranded up front and Chalmers playing in some ludicrous position then I'll be asking a few more questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londonwell Posted August 18, 2016 Report Share Posted August 18, 2016 And we had our chance to promote a promising group of under-20's this close season and McGhee bottled it by offering contracts to geriatrics. And you know what, some on this forum celebrated the geriatrics getting new contracts. How's that working out for you? Stick to the taxi's mate. Football management isn't for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superward Posted August 18, 2016 Report Share Posted August 18, 2016 Noted. We'll revisit this later in the season. Nice one. Speak to you then. We will keep you up to date on the performances while you are on your holidays as assuming you can't see the games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMWellfan Posted August 18, 2016 Report Share Posted August 18, 2016 Nice one. Speak to you then. We will keep you up to date on the performances while you are on your holidays as assuming you can't see the games. That's right - that will be nice of you too. I'll be back in December, I'll just need to rely upon the highlights until then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superward Posted August 18, 2016 Report Share Posted August 18, 2016 That's right - that will be nice of you too. I'll be back in December, I'll just need to rely upon the highlights until then. Enjoy. We will give you the full picture since we all know watching highlights really isn't that good a measure of a how well players do for 90 minutes Have a good one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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