Celtic V Motherwell Sun 15 May 12:30

[CoF]

I won't let today's result diminish what has been a great turnaround from the team, however I do hope the sight of them shipping 7 goals getting played all over the world is a wake up call that these games still matter to the fans.

[Kmcalpin]

Soon as I saw the team selection......feared the worse......far to open

Absolutely. I had hoped we'd learned our lesson against St Johnstone, but obviously not. One rookie full back in Watt and one no full back on Johnson. Irrespective of how badly he played, Watt was hung out to dry by playing Ainsworth in front of him. Interesting too that we lost 4 goals after Watt was hooked but only 3 before - does that prove he should have been kept on? You're correct Wullie - we played far too open a line up and paid the price.

 

Keith Lasley's absence is a complete red herring. Just think for a minute - why wasn't he playing? Illness - no; injury - no. He was sent off at Pittodrie for a badly timed and clumsy tackle and has been given a 3 match suspension. He's made a few tackles like that this season. Irrespective of how good a player is he's no good to us sitting in the stand. When he's played, opposing teams still manage to gain easy access to our central defence and keeper. Now I'm not saying he's to blame for our defeat today but simply making the point that his absence (and Stevie Hammell's) weren't the reason for our hammering today. Josh Law wasn't playing either was his absence critical in the defeat?

 

Our heavy defeat was down to a combination of circumstances: absences, yes absences; Celtic playing well and fired up; our lads hitting the beach early; some players having an off day; and last but by no means least Mark McGhee's team selection and line up.

 

I hate losing 1-0 never mind 7-0 but I've witnessed worse in my time. We should however view the game in the context of the season overall. A 5th placed finish is a great achievement and that is down to Mark McGhee and his management team and the players. He'll have learnt a bit more about his players today and fair enough.

 

In terms of transfer dealings we badly need to replace Keith Lasley and bolster central midfield. We also need 2 new full backs. Over the course of the entire season, too many teams have exploited our weakness down the wings and in central midfield. We finished the season with the 4th worst goals against tally and that tells its own story.

 

However our 2015-16 season is now over and we finished in 5th spot, well above where I thought we would do; and most importantly, avoided playoffs. All this with a managerial change during the campaign. Not bad in my book.

 

Finally, I feel sorry for our fans who went to the game - they deserved much better.

[Big Wispy Flossy]

Absolutely. I had hoped we'd learned our lesson against St Johnstone, but obviously not. One rookie full back in Watt and one no full back on Johnson. Irrespective of how badly he played, Watt was hung out to dry by playing Ainsworth in front of him. Interesting too that we lost 4 goals after Watt was hooked but only 3 before - does that prove he should have been kept on? You're correct Wullie - we played far too open a line up and paid the price.

 

Keith Lasley's absence is a complete red herring. Just think for a minute - why wasn't he playing? Illness - no; injury - no. He was sent off at Pittodrie for a badly timed and clumsy tackle and has been given a 3 match suspension. He's made a few tackles like that this season. Irrespective of how good a player is he's no good to us sitting in the stand. When he's played, opposing teams still manage to gain easy access to our central defence and keeper. Now I'm not saying he's to blame for our defeat today but simply making the point that his absence (and Stevie Hammell's) weren't the reason for our hammering today. Josh Law wasn't playing either was his absence critical in the defeat?

 

Our heavy defeat was down to a combination of circumstances: absences, yes absences; Celtic playing well and fired up; our lads hitting the beach early; some players having an off day; and last but by no means least Mark McGhee's team selection and line up.

 

I hate losing 1-0 never mind 7-0 but I've witnessed worse in my time. We should however view the game in the context of the season overall. A 5th placed finish is a great achievement and that is down to Mark McGhee and his management team and the players. He'll have learnt a bit more about his players today and fair enough.

 

In terms of transfer dealings we badly need to replace Keith Lasley and bolster central midfield. We also need 2 new full backs. Over the course of the entire season, too many teams have exploited our weakness down the wings and in central midfield. We finished the season with the 4th worst goals against tally and that tells its own story.

 

However our 2015-16 season is now over and we finished in 5th spot, well above where I thought we would do; and most importantly, avoided playoffs. All this with a managerial change during the campaign. Not bad in my book.

I agree with most you say but got to disagree about watt. He had cadden in front of him virtually all of the first half so I don't think he was hung out to dry - he was all over the place

[kmmfc]

Can't understand playing players who won't be here next season today.

[dmsd]

Just shows we are not good enough ! We need 4 or 5 decent players even if we sign those out of contract

[something else]

Can't understand playing players who won't be here next season today.

Said exact same thing to ma mate when I seen the line up.

[The African]

Disappointing is an understatement. I suppose we can, to an extent, put it down to a number of factors, only some of which will have consequences for next season.

The facts that our season was over, we had very little to play for and we caught them on a good day and they are a better side than us, as the league table shows, can be seen as valid and forgotten about. This really wasn't a game we could hope to experiment in and, once again, McGhee has tried to be a little too clever and been found out. I would not be too hard on Luke Watt. A youngster given a chance in a game that passed more experienced players by is always going to look out of his depth. I see that some have questioned his attitude and said that it looked like he wasn't trying, but we have to remember that looks can be deceptive. Hopefully he can come back from this disappointment. Thankfully we did not risk any other young players and their possible development.

What I think this does show though, is that the issues that have dogged us over the past two seasons which were not sorted by McCall and Baraclough still remain and need to be addressed. Our key players are all a year older and we have no obvious succession policy for most of them. The work hasn't been done over the past few years so now the job is not only more urgent but also harder as it has to be achieved over a shorter time frame. This is all the more difficult as we are entering a period of tighter budget and necessary financial expediency. I hope McGhee is up for it. This is where a good manager earns his salary. Getting the players fit and organised will get us so far, but to improve, our squad needs more than a freshen up. Good luck Mark.

[grizzlyg]

To finish 5th is great considering where we were but today was an embarrassment. I have been set to get my first season ticket in 25 yrs but watching that would put you off. Before I get pelters calm down, I am getting season ticket and I pay monthly to well lotto and well society so don't need to justify myself. Roll on next season

[underboyleheating]

Good luck Mark.

I am expecting big changes. However, I am hopeful that he will be up for the job, although it won’t be easy. Yes, good luck Mark.

[mjw]

To finish 5th is great considering where we were but today was an embarrassment. I have been set to get my first season ticket in 25 yrs but watching that would put you off. Before I get pelters calm down, I am getting season ticket and I pay monthly to well lotto and well society so don't need to justify myself. Roll on next season

You don't need to justify yourself, but fuck it you just did anyway.

[GazzyB]

You don't need to justify yourself, but fuck it you just did anyway.

 

:lol:

[Wellfan1984]

Absolutely. I had hoped we'd learned our lesson against St Johnstone, but obviously not. One rookie full back in Watt and one no full back on Johnson. Irrespective of how badly he played, Watt was hung out to dry by playing Ainsworth in front of him. Interesting too that we lost 4 goals after Watt was hooked but only 3 before - does that prove he should have been kept on? You're correct Wullie - we played far too open a line up and paid the price.

 

Keith Lasley's absence is a complete red herring. Just think for a minute - why wasn't he playing? Illness - no; injury - no. He was sent off at Pittodrie for a badly timed and clumsy tackle and has been given a 3 match suspension. He's made a few tackles like that this season. Irrespective of how good a player is he's no good to us sitting in the stand. When he's played, opposing teams still manage to gain easy access to our central defence and keeper. Now I'm not saying he's to blame for our defeat today but simply making the point that his absence (and Stevie Hammell's) weren't the reason for our hammering today. Josh Law wasn't playing either was his absence critical in the defeat?

 

1. It was Cadden that was in front of Watt. Watt put himself out to dry due to poor positioning that wouldn't look out of place in an under 10's game and his inability to realise his team mates were wearing claret. If he's the answer not sure what the question is.

 

2. Yes, I believe both Law and Hammell were really missed today as was Lasley.

[Frazzie]

Out of interest, when was the last time we lost by 7? I remember 6 a few times but can't recall a 7 in my time.

[Andy_P]

I'm guessing a defeat by seven clear goals would be Celtic in season 82`83 at Fir Park.

[Kmcalpin]

Just watched the goals again. Yes, Celtic played well but they were the kind of goals we've been losing all season. Getting torn apart down the wings and the central midfield failing to shield the central defence. Probably a the result of poor tactics, lack of confidence and not working hard enough.

[Gaz]

I'm guessing a defeat by seven clear goals would be Celtic in season 82`83 at Fir Park.

 

Absolutely right. Scottish Cup quarter final at a packed Fir Park. I was one of the mascots that day. Note I didn't say "lucky mascot"

[ONeils40yarder]

I managed to forget that we were playing Celtic on Sunday and only realised when I got a text message from a 'friend' trying to wind me up as we went 3-0 down.

 

The reason I forgot is because, as well as it being an utterly meaningless game, the writing was on the wall. I havent seen any footage of the Ross County game but having sat through the utter turd that was served up at Fir Park v St Johnstone it was as clear as day that the players had chucked it.

 

Mark McGhee is taking a power of abuse for yesterdays debacle on Social media from folk that 'never even wanted the prick back in the 1st place', and while its his job to motivate players and select a team to compete, the buck lands with the PROFESSIONAL players that are earning relatively good salaries to perform on behalf of the Club.

 

You can say what you like about his selections, yes its strange to see Johnson at Left-back, playing Watt against Celtic when he hasnt kicked a ball for a while is debateable, throwing Gomis in when he wont be our player next season and has proved himself to be utterly cack so far etc etc. You can even say we should have flooded the midfield or had an extra defender, rather than have so many attack minded players in the team and that would be fair comment...BUT...I'd expect Mark McGhee to be able to pick any 11 of his squad of professional football players to play against Celtic and have that wee bit of pride and professionalism that would see us being able to compete rather than capitulate.

 

In short, and I've said this before, there is an element of players at Fir Park that are a disgrace. This group of players, seem to be able to turn it on when it suits them...essentially the same group of players that rolled over week, after week under Barraclough and so dramatically managed to turn it around under McGhee.

 

As for the ongoing man-love with Keith Lasley and less-so with Steven Hammell, you would have to be a blind man not to see that they are both struggling now at this level. Some of you have backed it up with stats to try and convince others that Lasley will indeed live (and play for Motherwell) forever. The fact that we missed these players yesterday says more about our signing policy and our back-up men than it does for our veteran 'stars'.

 

Over the piece, 5th in the league is a remarkable (yes remarkable, not good or great) achievement considering where we were and how we were playing at the start of the managers time at the Club, and while Mcghee has made some sound decisions, part of me wonders if the turnaround is more to do with the application of our players post-Baraclough than anything McGhee has done.

[The African]

Absolutely right. Scottish Cup quarter final at a packed Fir Park. I was one of the mascots that day. Note I didn't say "lucky mascot"

I think the Scottish Cup game was in 1984 and we managed to keep them down to six.

The seven nil at Fir Park was, I think, in 1982. Probably the first time we had played them since coming up after a spell in the old first division.

[ropy]

Joe Wark in a back three?

[Yabba's Turd]

Absolutely right. Scottish Cup quarter final at a packed Fir Park. I was one of the mascots that day. Note I didn't say "lucky mascot"

http://www.soccerbase.com/teams/head_to_head.sd?team_id=1734&team2_id=512

 

Season 82/83 we'd drawn 2-2 with Rangers at Fir PArk, then played Celtic and got pumped 7-0 under Jock Wallace the cup game was 6-0 under Bobby Watson.

[The African]

Joe Wark in a back three?

 

Pretty sure that experiment was the game against them at Celtic Park them immediately after the seven nil. We had injury problems and I think Andy Harrow may also have played at the back that day. We lost three nil, I think, but didn't take the pumping we were supposed to. To be fair, in the seven nil game, we were guilty of chasing the game in the second half when we were well behind and lost three or four goals to them on the break.

[wunderwell]

Ok tin hat on, I think Ben Hall is very poor and at this stage shouldn't be in our first team. If we are looking for raw ability in this position I think we should be playing Laing. It doesn't seem to be allowed though to say a young player isn't good enough but he isn't from what I've seen.

[MadeofSteel]

I personally don't find him that great either. Won't have to worry about that for much longer, few English teams sniffing around...

[Del_Superwell]

Kieran Kennedy is the best of our centre halfs in my view, Laing i dont rate at centre half but looked decent at right back for the few games we tried him out there before he got injured.

[something else]

I agree. Kennedy has to be given a run next season.