Give Youth A Chance

[capt_oats]

 

Who said you had to make a player go on loan to the conference?

 

You offer the player the chance, he either takes it or he doesn't.

 

There's a well worn path of Scottish players heading down south as young as sixteen, never mind nineteen.

 

Guys like Peter Crouch were on loan at Norwegian clubs at the age of sixteen.

 

And the club pays the living expenses in association with the host club.

 

Your notion that they need mollycoddled and home to Mummy every night is just pathetic.

 

These are young men desperate to make it in the game, potential millionaires.

 

You'll find that many of them have more bottle than you do.

Bloody hell. Where to start with that?

 

Ideally, yes it'd be just lovely to be able to send our development players out on loan to different leagues. However it's not a case of "offering" them the chance as you optimistically put it. The other side and their manager have to want them and be willing to play them whether they're in the English conference, Norway, Italy, France, Germany or China.

 

Genuine question; how many development level players have moved to England or further afield on loan from Scottish Premiership sides in say the last 5 years, and taking that further how many of them haven't been Celtic players?

 

#warbs was banging on in a similarly idealistic way as yourself about how his view was that the development level players should be challenging themselves down south IIRC. Where are his players out on loan this season? St Mirren, Raith Rovers and Livingston. In Celtic's case it's Dunfermline, Stenhousmuir, Peterhead, Morton, Dumbarton, Alloa and Hibs.

 

Recently from Celtic I count Henderson on loan to Rosenberg, O'Connell on loan to Oldham and Cork City, McGregor to Notts County and Tony Watt to Lierse.

 

Jamie Semple from our academy has, I believe, been over training with Benfica so it'd appear that if there is an opportunity there for a player to visit teams in different countries then we're not restrictive. In fact given his age I'm not sure there's much we could do either way and even that isn't the same as going on loan.

 

Chances are that if a development side player was actually at a level where he'd be viewed as a viable option to loan by an English Conference side or higher or even more optimistically a European side then he'd be playing in our first team.

[Kmcalpin]

Jamie Semple from our academy has, I believe, been over training with Benfica so it'd appear that if there is an opportunity there for a player to visit teams in different countries then we're not restrictive. In fact given his age I'm not sure there's much we could do either way and even that isn't the same as going on loan.

 

 

Good post as usual Sir. I tend to agree that we wouldn't have much, if indeed any say, about if or where young Semple went on a "visit" to learn about different teams. No doubt its giving Benfica an opportunity to assess whether he's worth keeping under surveillance on or not..

[Aidan bell]

I wonder if Jackie McNamara would be interested in taking some of our young players to York right now? Having said that he's taken Rooney & Whittle from Dunfermline plus Connolly from Dundee United and they don't appear to be doing much.

[Del_Superwell]

In terms of players going out on loan, Chris Cadden spent half a season with Albion Rovers helping them to win the league 2 title before breaking into our first team, so i'd say providing the young players have the right attitude and work rate to want to develop then they would be open to following in his footsteps by going on loan up here, making an impact and showing the manager they could be capable of doing a job for us.

[huggins]

I wonder if Jackie McNamara would be interested in taking some of our young players to York right now? Having said that he's taken Rooney & Whittle from Dunfermline plus Connolly from Dundee United and they don't appear to be doing much.

 

Good chance he'll be leaving York in the next few weeks...

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/37566392

[CMWellfan]

Bloody hell. Where to start with that?

 

Ideally, yes it'd be just lovely to be able to send our development players out on loan to different leagues. However it's not a case of "offering" them the chance as you optimistically put it. The other side and their manager have to want them and be willing to play them whether they're in the English conference, Norway, Italy, France, Germany or China.

 

Genuine question; how many development level players have moved to England or further afield on loan from Scottish Premiership sides in say the last 5 years, and taking that further how many of them haven't been Celtic players?

 

#warbs was banging on in a similarly idealistic way as yourself about how his view was that the development level players should be challenging themselves down south IIRC. Where are his players out on loan this season? St Mirren, Raith Rovers and Livingston. In Celtic's case it's Dunfermline, Stenhousmuir, Peterhead, Morton, Dumbarton, Alloa and Hibs.

 

Recently from Celtic I count Henderson on loan to Rosenberg, O'Connell on loan to Oldham and Cork City, McGregor to Notts County and Tony Watt to Lierse.

 

Jamie Semple from our academy has, I believe, been over training with Benfica so it'd appear that if there is an opportunity there for a player to visit teams in different countries then we're not restrictive. In fact given his age I'm not sure there's much we could do either way and even that isn't the same as going on loan.

 

Chances are that if a development side player was actually at a level where he'd be viewed as a viable option to loan by an English Conference side or higher or even more optimistically a European side then he'd be playing in our first team.

Thanks for listing several young Scots who have traveled for development loans.

 

Proves my point that not all need to be home to Mummy at night.

[steelboy]

Given that our first team is full of Conference players it seems far fetched that Conference teams are going to want players who can't even get 20 minutes off the bench for us.

[Desp]

Several? Capt_Oats named two young Scots who went to another country on a loan deal.

 

Both Celtic players. One was in Norway for three months, before spending a season in the second tier in Scotland. Has had barely a sniff of first team football at his parent club since. Callum McGregor's loan could be considered a success, given his first team appearances in the last two years.

 

Eoghan O'Connell is, unsurprsingly, Irish and you can count his first team appearances using your fingers.

 

I have absolutely no idea what your "point" is regarding being mollycoddled by Mummy, considering nobody referred to that. One poster said "At least loaning a player in this country he can for the most part get up the road after training and commute from home."

[Gadgey]

Honestly, I sit and read this and shake my head. There's absolutely no necessity for anyone to be insulting on this thread. What's the need to be questioning someone's bottle just because they may express a different view to yours???

 

Really, please stop it.

 

With regards youth development, I think the club are in a bit of a catch 22. We have obvious weaknesses in midfield yet the manager has decided not to go with youth in there. There will be reason for this and the only one I can think of is that he doesn't think that the young mildfielders he has to choose from are able to do the job he wants doing.

 

We have a smaller squad than the majority of our contemporaries and much of that squad is made up of the youth players already mentioned. I guess, there is a considerable risk in loaning them out as it would leave a weakened resilience if in the event of injuries and suspension.

 

For me, the question should be is it better keeping them for the bench (for the benefit of the team) or better loaning them out (for the benefit of the player)?

 

Loaning them to non league English football isn't an option otherwise it would've happened by now. The harsh reality is that it isn't a great deal worse than our standard and many of those clubs have more to spend than we do.

 

At least by loaning out to other Scottish clubs, the lads get to continue training with the Motherwell and management get to keep a close eye on their development.

[Onthefringes]

Good post as usual Sir. I tend to agree that we wouldn't have much, if indeed any say, about if or where young Semple went on a "visit" to learn about different teams. No doubt its giving Benfica an opportunity to assess whether he's worth keeping under surveillance on or not..

With more than one from that particular age group having experienced same - more a link up with the elite schooling at Braidhurst than the club as an ex-SFA employee is on the coaching staff at Benfica's academy.

[capt_oats]

With more than one from that particular age group having experienced same - more a link up with the elite schooling at Braidhurst than the club as an ex-SFA employee is on the coaching staff at Benfica's academy.

 

I thought that was the case but wasn't 100% sure.

[CMWellfan]

Honestly, I sit and read this and shake my head. There's absolutely no necessity for anyone to be insulting on this thread. What's the need to be questioning someone's bottle just because they may express a different view to yours???

 

Really, please stop it.

 

With regards youth development, I think the club are in a bit of a catch 22. We have obvious weaknesses in midfield yet the manager has decided not to go with youth in there. There will be reason for this and the only one I can think of is that he doesn't think that the young mildfielders he has to choose from are able to do the job he wants doing.

 

We have a smaller squad than the majority of our contemporaries and much of that squad is made up of the youth players already mentioned. I guess, there is a considerable risk in loaning them out as it would leave a weakened resilience if in the event of injuries and suspension.

 

For me, the question should be is it better keeping them for the bench (for the benefit of the team) or better loaning them out (for the benefit of the player)?

 

Loaning them to non league English football isn't an option otherwise it would've happened by now. The harsh reality is that it isn't a great deal worse than our standard and many of those clubs have more to spend than we do.

 

At least by loaning out to other Scottish clubs, the lads get to continue training with the Motherwell and management get to keep a close eye on their development.

Or non-development.

 

Whole lot of waffle.

 

Players moving hundreds of miles to aid development is normal.

[Desp]

What kind of clubs do you think would take up Motherwell's offer, should they take on board your idea of loaning out the majority of the U20 squad?

 

If it's to be to another country, to aid their development, who exactly would want an 18/19 year old, on loan from Motherwell, with very little, if any, first team experience at SPFL Premiership level?

[Gadgey]

Or non-development.

 

Whole lot of waffle.

 

Players moving hundreds of miles to aid development is normal.

Please enlighten me. Where is the waffle. I will bow to any argument you make that is backed by evidence and or logic

[Yabba's Turd]

 

 

 

You'll find that many of them have more bottle than you do.

Bottle? I was only working in the war zone 4 weeks after they signed the ceasefire in Yugoslavia , I'm sure I'd have managed to play fitba in some English backwater for a while.

[Bigeeze]

I wonder if Jackie McNamara would be interested in taking some of our young players to York right now? Having said that he's taken Rooney & Whittle from Dunfermline plus Connolly from Dundee United and they don't appear to be doing much.

His jaikit is on a shooglie peg just now so probably none

[superward]

Unfortunately CMWellfan...you started off with a decent enough point about youth going elsewhere and maybe during the summer etc if possible. But as usual when challenged your argument has became skewed, stating your own opinion as absolute fact and becoming personal for no reason.

 

Take a breath.

[CMWellfan]

Bottle? I was only working in the war zone 4 weeks after they signed the ceasefire in Yugoslavia , I'm sure I'd have managed to play fitba in some English backwater for a while.

 

ffs

 

I was with the British army in Germany at eighteen years of age. In my dreams would have I had the chance to have a professional football career, and if MFC told me I was being loaned to an English team to get first team experience, I'd have been off like a shot.

 

There 's way too much stupid talk on this thread. Players leaving home at sixteen to go down south has happened forever and a day.

 

My point is that our under 20's should consist of under 18's.

 

The remainder of the under 20's should either be in the first team squad or out on loan - and if that means on loan to the English conference then so be it.

[Pepper]

[stuwell]

If the club were to send a youth player anywhere on loan, I'm sure they would take into consideration how mature the guy was - some 16 year olds would be comfortable with it but others might not and I'm sure the coaches would know them well enough to know who to send and who to keep close to home.

[CMWellfan]

If the club were to send a youth player anywhere on loan, I'm sure they would take into consideration how mature the guy was - some 16 year olds would be comfortable with it but others might not and I'm sure the coaches would know them well enough to know who to send and who to keep close to home.

I doubt the coaches know, our coaching staff are inexperienced. That's what happens when you hire on the basis of jobs for the boys.

 

Experienced players/ex-players? Yes. That doesn't make them experienced coaches.

 

It's a moot point as I am not suggesting sending sixteen year olds out on loan. Rare are the players that are ready at that age.

[capt_oats]

My point is that our under 20's should consist of under 18's.

You realise of course that the average age of the current u20s squad is 18? And includes a 16 year old and 4 17 year olds...

[Spiderpig]

Experienced players/ex-players? Yes. That doesn't make them experienced

No the years of study and training to gain their Uefa coaching qualifications makes them experienced. but i suppose you being the expert on all things think thats not enough.

[Kmcalpin]

Honestly, I sit and read this and shake my head. There's absolutely no necessity for anyone to be insulting........What's the need to be questioning someone's bottle just because they may express a different view to yours???

 

Really, please stop it.

 

100% agree. We can debate, discuss and disagree but we're all Well fans and should show respect to one another on these boards.

[Joeboy]

What kind of clubs do you think would take up Motherwell's offer, should they take on board your idea of loaning out the majority of the U20 squad?

 

If it's to be to another country, to aid their development, who exactly would want an 18/19 year old, on loan from Motherwell, with very little, if any, first team experience at SPFL Premiership level?

 

Agreed. If Stuart Carswell and Craig Reid, with a decent amount of experience, are playing in the Icelandic second tier, I can't see 17 year old Motherwell kids being high on the list of many European clubs.