Scottish Premiership Game 26: St Johnstone (H) 06/02/18 19:45

[Guest]

McHugh gets stick on here but the amount of balls he contests is immense, that's why he is in the team.

Just to add to this, fully agree. He hasn't had the best of seasons but I really think he's come onto it since the break.

 

Might just be me being a shitebag as well, but the number of header he throws himself at, that are even about a 40/60, and wins, particularly after his injury, give me the absolute fear.

[Happy Dosser]

Not his biggest fan at all far from it but both tonight and Saturday hes put a good cross in the box which we shouldve scored from

Agreed. Petravicius is very young and is still learning the game but he's obviously there for his pace and I'm sure Robinson thought he would stretch a tiring defence. He will improve with more confidence.

 

Curtis Main is really impressive: a very hard worker who really puts himself about and knows where the goal is. I actually thought his "miss" was a great save by Mannus. Almost an identikit replacement for King Louis, so well done the scouts.

 

I hope Allan Campbell continues his forward-driving aggression: he changed the game in the second half. Pleasantly surprised by Rose tonight too: he seemed to be everywhere.

 

Finally, Dunne produced a couple of really good passes last night and he is fearless in the challenge as well as being really quick. That 40-60 ball he made into a 50-50 against Edwards or Osman (can't quite remember which) against Thistle was a blood-curdler. In general, our defence is mean and hard, miles away from the walking putty we had under McGhee.

[BobWilson (Anchorman)]

 

The amount of ground Rose covered in the second half last night was unbelievable. Pity he didn't score with that header late on, cos he deserved a goal last night.

Rose continues to improve and put in a great shift last night, especially after we took the lead. I think a wee goal or two would really lift the boys confidence in his own abilities. An easy first team pick for the gaffer.

 

And he's much betterer than the McHugh guy

[Joeboy]

I'd always rather win ugly, than drop points looking good, but winning ugly is certainly something Robinson is an advocate of. If I had to use any adjective for that performance, it would be "effective".

 

At half time I was lamenting the fact that I had just watched that dross when we had arguably three of our most technically adept players in Bigirimana, Tanner and Frear on the bench. Yet on the face of things, other than the odd bit of poor decision making from Cadden and Ciftci, everyone done what was asked of them in a victory which we looked quite comfortable in by the end.

 

It seemed almost that we deliberately played honkin stuff for the first hour, before the same set of players capably then started to get the ball on the deck and alas, the goals came. Campbell was fantastic all night and it looks like we have found a mutually good fit in Curtis Main. One negative for me was the level of abuse from the shalla end of the East Stand to Cadden when he decided to go alone instead of slipping Campbell in at 2-0 up. You could visibly see his hesitancy and if he is off the boil a bit, giving him the Fagan/Fitzpatrick/Townsley etc treatment won't help him get back on it.

 

I guess we have to accept that for this season, we aren't going to come away from games raving about the football we played, the points we pick up will be from outbattling teams, as is the style of the manager and his preferred players, but I suppose as Bobby Williamson once said, "if you want entertained, go to the cinema".

[Kmcalpin]

A merited and importnat win last night. The first half was a bit turgid but for once we matched St Johnstone and held our own in a physical battle. In the second half we moved up a gear or two and proved that we have it in us to play some decent football on the deck. The new guys too are starting to get to know their teammates and that will only improve with game time. Great to see Alan Campbell notch another goal and Curtis Main looks a very astute signing. He's as strong as an ox, hard working, can hold the ball up and has an eye for goal.

 

That was the poorest Saints side I've seen for a few years and only in terms of aggression did they match recent teams. Daily Record stats aside the are probably one of the dirtiest sides in the league. Late tackles, two footed tackles, leaving boots in...we saw it all last night. As others have commented Murray Davidson was in a class of his own. The referee was totally inconsistent and made numerous baffling decisions. Interesting to note that younger Saints fans are taking their current poor run very badly as they have been weaned on consistent top 6 success. Enough of them though.

 

We played well as a team and young Alan Campbell was my MOTM. He tackled, competed, ran with the ball, passed and scored. Of late I think he's been a wee bit off the boil but not last night. Andy Rose put in a great shift and popped up here there and everywhere. Curtis Main is a real find. The defence was very solid and I thought Dunne had a great game. In some respects he's very like John Philliben with pace. Softy was an uncompromising defender who couldn't pass to save himself. Kipper and Aldred looked the part.

 

Credit to the manageent team of Robbo and Keef.

[gullane]

A merited and importnat win last night. The first half was a bit turgid but for once we matched St Johnstone and held our own in a physical battle. In the second half we moved up a gear or two and proved that we have it in us to play some decent football on the deck. The new guys too are starting to get to know their teammates and that will only improve with game time. Great to see Alan Campbell notch another goal and Curtis Main looks a very astute signing. He's as strong as an ox, hard working, can hold the ball up and has an eye for goal.

 

That was the poorest Saints side I've seen for a few years and only in terms of aggression did they match recent teams. Daily Record stats aside the are probably one of the dirtiest sides in the league. Late tackles, two footed tackles, leaving boots in...we saw it all last night. As others have commented Murray Davidson was in a class of his own. The referee was totally inconsistent and made numerous baffling decisions. Interesting to note that younger Saints fans are taking their current poor run very badly as they have been weaned on consistent top 6 success. Enough of them though.

 

We played well as a team and young Alan Campbell was my MOTM. He tackled, competed, ran with the ball, passed and scored. Of late I think he's been a wee bit off the boil but not last night. Andy Rose put in a great shift and popped up here there and everywhere. Curtis Main is a real find. The defence was very solid and I thought Dunne had a great game. In some respects he's very like John Philliben with pace. Softy was an uncompromising defender who couldn't pass to save himself. Kipper and Aldred looked the part.

 

Credit to the manageent team of Robbo and Keef.

 

For those of you who weren't at the game, you will notice the amount of praise going to Rose, McHugh and Dunne. I have been one of the doubters for all three and have wished they could be dropped for either poor or anonymous performances. However last night all three put in a great shift and merit first pick for the cup tie at Dundee. I apologise to those who sit near me in The DC and heard my rants towards them, and negative comments posted here towards all three. The quality of their distribution is still an issue but their willingness to tackle and chase is to be admired.

 

Rather than repeat what has been said already, I will add that Ciftci looks like increasingly like making a positive contribution. He clearly possesses talent and offers some creativity that is different to anything else we have. He appears to lack fitness and confidence but is showing signs of improvement. Some things don't always come off for him and his style will likely make him prone to greediness. However, I think if we persevere with him, he could make a significant difference between us and the rest of the bottom seven.

[milo]

Ive watched the highlights several times today!

 

Main could easily have had a hatrick! Great exchange between him and Ciftci for a chance with Main running off the ball and pointing to where he wanted the ball played.

 

Pleased to hear Dunne, Rose and McHugh has good games as Ive been critical of them at times.

 

Not surprised to hear Murray Davidson was up to his old tricks, but him and his ilk will do it as long as theyll get away with it.

[Yorkyred]

Sadly work commitments meant I was unable to attend but even watching the highlights it looked a far better display, we really have hit it lucky with Main if he stays fit. Really pleased to see Rose back in, he is so underrated in my view. The stats since coming back from the break are very positive and hopefully we carry that on.

[Lukemfc1]

First half was absolutely murder last night, was pretty much the same as the last few games. I'm not convinced by this 'earn the right to play' mantra. I get what Robinson is saying but it is possible to put a few more passes together than we did in that first half.

Still not convinced by the wing back system. Chrissy Cadden seems to be struggling, and has been for some time now. We don't seem to have enough threat from the wing on either side. Perhaps the trade off here is we look very solid from it but our attacking options from midfield are tempered.

Fortunately I think Robinson must have went through them at half time as second half was a lot better. It wasn't a sparkling display but we took the game by the scruff of the neck and played some decent stuff at times. To be honest, I was surprised at how bad St Johnstone were, they looked a shade of their former selves. A few of their same old faces that they have relied on for years seem to be on the road out.

I think our winning mentality really shone through last night. We also had some quality displays from quite a few boys. Alan Campbell was back to it in the middle of the park. Rose done a lot of good work, and in the defence Aldred, Dunne and Kipre were again outstanding.

 

First to admit I wasn't overly excited with Curtis Main's resumé but he has certainly proven the doubters wrong. His strength and pace is going to be a handful for the majority of the clubs in the division.

 

Hopefully we can now put a bit of a run together. Top 6 is still going to be very difficult with the way Killie are playing but hopefully we can have a decent crack at it.

[weeyin]

Aye, I know I have been banging on about it recently, but I don't see why this "earning the right to play" means we can't pass the ball or keep possession.

 

Definite improvement, though, from December - so won't complain too much.

[Goggles & Flippers]

Considering some demanded improvement or Robinson's head was on the block, I hope they've put their knives away.

[Clackscat]

Considering some demanded improvement or Robinson's head was on the block, I hope they've put their knives away.

Even if they do, for some it will only be to sharpen them ready to bring them out again after a defeat......sadly

 

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[livivoice]

 

For those of you who weren't at the game, you will notice the amount of praise going to Rose, McHugh and Dunne. I have been one of the doubters for all three and have wished they could be dropped for either poor or anonymous performances. However last night all three put in a great shift and merit first pick for the cup tie at Dundee. I apologise to those who sit near me in The DC and heard my rants towards them, and negative comments posted here towards all three. The quality of their distribution is still an issue but their willingness to tackle and chase is to be admired.

 

Rather than repeat what has been said already, I will add that Ciftci looks like increasingly like making a positive contribution. He clearly possesses talent and offers some creativity that is different to anything else we have. He appears to lack fitness and confidence but is showing signs of improvement. Some things don't always come off for him and his style will likely make him prone to greediness. However, I think if we persevere with him, he could make a significant difference between us and the rest of the bottom seven.

Yup , I think it its imperative we persevere with Ciftci. Watched footage of his time with United and wow ! What a player. He showed all the qualities we look for in a striker; instinctiveness, intelligence, nose for a goal, unpredictability and an ability to score all types of goals. As this video is hardly ancient history I believe those talents can quickly re emerge with proper support.

 

As fans we must play our part and not become frustrated with him when things dont come off and even more so when he becomes too self indulgent. This becomes all the more important as I do think Ciftci`s nature suggests he needs the proverbial arm round his shoulder.

 

On a separate point Ciftci must show total discipline on Saturday as the Dundee fans almost without exception regard him as the devil incarnate!!

 

By the way Gullane just because you previously gave Mc Hugh, Rose and Dunne a hard time doesn't make you a bad person. Put away the hair shirt!!

[Burn_Broomfield]

Considering some demanded improvement or Robinson's head was on the block, I hope they've put their knives away.

 

 

Of course people demanded improvement, we were on a horrific run of results. Robinson was edging closer to sacking territory thanks to results and performances prior to the winter break , where he has identified weaknesses, signed players and we now seem to be getting back to where we were pre the Celtic triple header.

 

If he had lost the majority of these recent games I don't think he would still be Motherwell manager. 1 defeat in 6, being unfortunate to not beat Partick and lose to Hibs is a sure sign he's picked it up again.

[CoF]

Aye, I know I have been banging on about it recently, but I don't see why this "earning the right to play" means we can't pass the ball or keep possession.

 

Definite improvement, though, from December - so won't complain too much.

 

I've been trying to work out exactly what Robinson means by the phrase. He used it quite a few times the other night.

 

I think he means in the frantic opening parts of the game you've got employ certain tactics to get a physical and psychological foothold on the game. The game at that stage is too tight and opposition players have too much energy for us to even try pass it round them.

[weeyin]

I get the fact that games are tight in the first 30+ minutes, and that it's important to win your personal battles. We want our defenders to snuff out the opposition's strikers and our midfielders to stamp their authority on the game etc.

 

I'm just not sure why that means we can't pass the ball on the deck when we have possession. Robinson was bemoaning our poor ball retention on Tuesday - if we aren't playing football for the first 45 minutes, that's exactly the result you'd expect.

 

But, different managers, different approaches and all that. I just prefer the approach McGhee (the first time) and McCall took where we go at it hard for 60 or 70 minutes then shut it down if we need to.

[Yassin]

I thought we were fine first half and should have been 1 or 2 up at the break.

[real dosser]

I have to disagree Weeyin. I hate nothing more than hanging on for the final whistle to get over the line. It much prefer to be still in the game after 60 minutes and then pushing for a result. Obviously we need to be at least level at that point.LOL

[weeyin]

I have to disagree Weeyin. I hate nothing more than hanging on for the final whistle to get over the line. It much prefer to be still in the game after 60 minutes and then pushing for a result. Obviously we need to be at least level at that point.LOL

 

I'd rather we were 2 up and holding after 60 mins than 2 down and chasing, but that just me.

 

Ideally, we'd be 2 up and still pressing - but that's another story.

[ONeils40yarder]

It appears to be the absolute opposite strategy of Mark McGhee in his 1st spell....how many times during that period did we completely run over the top of the opposition in the 1st half of games, before tiring but by that point the other team had the stuffing knocked out of them 9 times out of 10?

 

I don't really get the Robinson strategy to be honest, we've been found to be chasing far too many matches this season

[santheman]

Different type of football now.

Teams are bigger, stronger, fitter and pack the midfield denying other teams space.

Just the way football is going these days, more about physicality than ability plus the fear of the dreaded drop and the financial implications that brings.

[Kmcalpin]

Different type of football now.

Teams are bigger, stronger, fitter and pack the midfield denying other teams space.

Just the way football is going these days, more about physicality than ability plus the fear of the dreaded drop and the financial implications that brings.

Absolutely. Even the top sides have become far more physical and athletic although they have talent as well.

[capt_oats]

I get the fact that games are tight in the first 30+ minutes, and that it's important to win your personal battles. We want our defenders to snuff out the opposition's strikers and our midfielders to stamp their authority on the game etc.

 

I'm just not sure why that means we can't pass the ball on the deck when we have possession. Robinson was bemoaning our poor ball retention on Tuesday - if we aren't playing football for the first 45 minutes, that's exactly the result you'd expect.

 

But, different managers, different approaches and all that. I just prefer the approach McGhee (the first time) and McCall took where we go at it hard for 60 or 70 minutes then shut it down if we need to.

 

I've not really posted on here much since October last year but I thought I'd chip in here. I 100% agree on the part in bold.

 

There's no real reason why we can't play with "intensity", "desire" etc and still keep hold of the ball and pass it. However the fact that Robinson is highlighting that he feels we need to be better on the ball and improve suggests he's aware of this too. By the same token as everyone's aware we went through December with half a team out injured and 1 win in 12 up to the winter break, we were still in the relegation/play-off conversation last season until the 2nd last game of the season. I can forgive the manager for opting to prioritise results over aesthetically pleasing performances and as such I guess we are where we are.

 

Similarly it's probably worth remembering that this is, to all intents and purposes, Robinson's first proper management job (bar 6 months at an absolute basket case in Oldham where he had 3 weeks of pre-season). It's probably reasonable to say, in my opinion anyway, that he's still learning. It's not that much of a stretch to imagine that there will be games where he'll get things wrong tactically and have to change them. It seems clear to me that his priority this season has been to make us robust and take it from there.

 

Neil McCann has been an advocate of his Dundee side playing "attractive football" with "style": they're currently 2 points off the play-off spot and are 2 points worse off after 25 games than they were last season under Hartley. That may change in upcoming games now that they've shelled out on bringing Steven Caulker in I suppose.

 

Fwiw, we're +8 points on where we were after the same number of games last season having conceded 17 goals fewer. To take comparisons a bit further we've a better GA record (by 3 goals) after 26 games than McCall's 13/14 season though we're 9 goals down on the goals for column in that season. Who knows, had Moult been fit then our goals for column may look a better but then again if your auntie had baws...etc.

 

What Robinson has shown he can do is drill a team and make them hard to beat and competitive. Last season when he inherited the shambles McGhee had left we had a goal difference of -23. In the 12 games under Robinson with the same side we had a goal difference of 0.

 

The 2-0 against St Johnstone on Tuesday was our 12th clean sheet, in all competitions. In context, the last season we finished 2nd under McCall we managed 11 (in all competitions). Of our 12 league losses 8 have been by a single goal. Of the 4 that were more than a single goal we were down to 8 men in one (St Johnstone), dead on our feet in another (Celtic at Parkhead) and well, the less said about the losses to Rangers and Accies the better tbh.

 

I seem to remember back in the days of Baraclough and latterly McGhee people were pining for us to be more like St Johnstone and a Tommy Wright side ie: difficult to beat. Well, here we are. "Eye bleeding", "attritional" call it what you want this is pretty much where St Johnstone were when fans were saying we should be more like them. The difference is of course that there are 5 city sides in the league with vastly increased budgets and resources to recruit.

 

 

I'd rather we were 2 up and holding after 60 mins than 2 down and chasing, but that just me.

 

Ideally, we'd be 2 up and still pressing - but that's another story.

 

Let's be honest I'm sure Robinson would prefer to be 2 up after 60 mins as well.

 

Who knows, perhaps if he had a budget based on top 6, cup runs and player sales then Mr. Robinson may be able to emulate McCall's heyday. Then again we saw what happened to McCall when that budget was reduced so maybe there's something to be said for horses for courses.

[Dezz]

Well thought-out and sensible post and I agree with pretty much all of it. You should get back to posting here more often.

[milo]

Excellent post.

 

Someone please post that GIF of the theatre all standing up and applauding!