The Small-Medium Rebuild 2018'19

[tottenmfc]

If people are going to go into meltdown every time their team sells / loses one of their better players they should probably avoid supporting Motherwell (or any Scottish team for that matter).

[Andy_P]

2 hours ago, Kmac said:

I'm not suggesting for 1 second we pay silly money for players. What I want is for us to be in a position whereby we can reasonably expect to compete each season in the league and improve as a side. If our model is to continually  sell our top players and replace with a standard  not anywhere near close to that of the player which just left us, all we are doing is going back to square one each time, whilst others around us build on successes and grow squads capable of competing regularly with the top sides in our league. 

I think the key word in there is continually. 

Your aspirations don't seem unreasonable at all but put in the context of a club that still owes money to two former owners then until we have them paid off and become debt free, or at least its at a level that's easily manageable, then  think I think the existing model remains. Once we reach that point perhaps we may see the model change slightly and see some loosening of the purse strings to attract more "complete" players. 

[Guest]

Mental how folk act like this is the first time this has happened, every time it happens.

[yosemite sam]

At least we didn't sell him to a rival club, and we knew he would go at some point. So a good bit of business all round.

[weeyin]

Extending his contract when we did was also good business. 

[Gadgey]

I hadn’t read this thread or seen the news of Cedric leaving until having a shufty on here. I’m glad there’s some common sense prevailing as 3 or so pages ago there was some proper slavering getting done.

Yes, losing Kipre at this time is a great loss to the team. Yes, he will be difficult to replace but the club recognised that when they started signing him up on better deals. I and anyone else who wasn’t a half wit knew then that Cedric would be gone sooner rather than later.

I can only assume that Kmac is young enough to not remember the Boyle “we are going to be Scotlands third force” era?

i also assume that those calling for an expansion on player quality are unaware of the financial restrictions imposed upon a fan owned club of our size? Tried and tested costs money we don’t have. Money we can’t generate without trading players at a profit.

On the topic of profit. Cedric has been one the best bits of business I have known Motherwell to have. We’ve done everything we promised him and our player/agent marketing machine gets a fresh story sell.

However, all this “he’s gonnae be worth £9m this time next hear” is fanciful to say the least. For example, Charlton sold Ezri Konsa to Brentford for £3m this summer. He’s a home grown centre back with footballing ability and pace to burn.  He was a member of the England U19&20 wc winning squads and played circa 30 games last season at CB, RB and CDM in league 1 never once looking  out of place.

The point I’m making is that pound for pound, he’s a better player than Cedric Kipre on all counts at this time and is an Englishman playing in the English leagues. Cedric will do well but will have very tough competition in the division he’s going to.

[CoF]

3 hours ago, El Grew said:

I know if big money offers come in we are always going to cash in and that players, if ambitious will move on.  However selling one of our better players before our first league game really is shite.  It doesn't give the manager much chance.  Makes you wonder why guys like Robinson stay in Scottish football but then I suppose its a job.

Ach nah, certainly isn't a Scottish football thing - it's probably only the top 10% of clubs in the world who have genuine control over their transfers. It's a hierarchy, - even some EPL clubs will be at risk of losing their best players right at the end of the window. Likewise, we'll occasionally make last minute moves for players at clubs smaller than our own. It's all relative. 

[CoF]

2 minutes ago, Gadgey said:

Cedric will do well but will have very tough competition in the division he’s going to.

... especially if he gives a Stranraer-esque performance on his debut tomorrow. 

[texanwellfan]

18 minutes ago, yosemite sam said:

At least we didn't sell him to a rival club, and we knew he would go at some point. So a good bit of business all round.

For me that's the key. Sell them to a team outwith the SPL.  We need money to stay afloat so we have to take care of that first but as has been said, it's a balancing act between that and maintaining our place in the premier league. Again first goal is to avoid relegation. I don't think that's lack of ambition its juat setting a progressive goal. Next would be avoid being a dog fight for relegation. Next aim for top 6. Having said all that it probably all boils down to taking one game at a time and doing what you can each game to get points. Since Robinson arrived we haven't came in any worse than second in a game :-)

[middleeastdave]

I have no qualms about selling Cedric, apart from the timing we couldn't have the worst week to sell him with all the injuries and suspensions, unfortunately we did not have the choice of timing in the fear of losing out on the money, personally looking at him in the games he played in the Betfred cup, he appeared either not interested or was gradually trying to get match fit as he unaccustomedly was definitely making basic mistakes. I could easily be wrong but for him to match last seasons form might have been difficult.

i just hope that we don't rush into buying any player as a replacement, but the rate we are getting the injuries, we might have to go down that route.

N.B. The MFC website were also not long in removing his profile.

 

[wellwell91]

4 hours ago, Kmac said:

Case and point, Hibs. 

They got to the final, won the cup, built on the success and took momentum into a league campaign, spiralling again into a European campaign and an ever improving squad. 

True but they have 14k season tickets holders 

Our hard core support is 3k - 3.5k

Come into the real world of who and what we can compete against 

Yip we could go down the John Boyle route ……… look where that got us 

[Clackscat]

I hadn’t read this thread or seen the news of Cedric leaving until having a shufty on here. I’m glad there’s some common sense prevailing as 3 or so pages ago there was some proper slavering getting done.
Yes, losing Kipre at this time is a great loss to the team. Yes, he will be difficult to replace but the club recognised that when they started signing him up on better deals. I and anyone else who wasn’t a half wit knew then that Cedric would be gone sooner rather than later.
I can only assume that Kmac is young enough to not remember the Boyle “we are going to be Scotlands third force” era?
i also assume that those calling for an expansion on player quality are unaware of the financial restrictions imposed upon a fan owned club of our size? Tried and tested costs money we don’t have. Money we can’t generate without trading players at a profit.
On the topic of profit. Cedric has been one the best bits of business I have known Motherwell to have. We’ve done everything we promised him and our player/agent marketing machine gets a fresh story sell.
However, all this “he’s gonnae be worth £9m this time next hear” is fanciful to say the least. For example, Charlton sold Ezri Konsa to Brentford for £3m this summer. He’s a home grown centre back with footballing ability and pace to burn.  He was a member of the England U19&20 wc winning squads and played circa 30 games last season at CB, RB and CDM in league 1 never once looking  out of place.
The point I’m making is that pound for pound, he’s a better player than Cedric Kipre on all counts at this time and is an Englishman playing in the English leagues. Cedric will do well but will have very tough competition in the division he’s going to.

Brilliant post absolutely spot on

Sent from my SM-A320FL using Tapatalk

[weeyin]

If we had Hibs league record over the last decade we might be out of business by now. 

No way we can compete financially with a club of their size.

[weeyin]

From the Evening Times.

Robinson quoted as saying plans to bring in Kipré's replacement are well advanced - “We have been working on a potential replacement and hope to have something completed on that front as soon as possible.”

[The African]

If the replacement is anything like recent signings, prepare to be underwhelmed.

[weeyin]

10 minutes ago, The African said:

If the replacement is anything like recent signings, prepare to be underwhelmed.

Again, the lack of patience.

I don't remember people being overwhelmed with Kipré, Dunne or even Moult when they played their first few games for us in pre-season.

The number one priority this window was to give the squad more depth. Given that our lack of suitable replacements last December probably cost us top 6, and the lack of replacements to freshen out squad during cup campaigns likely cost us a league spot or two, depth seems like a good idea.

With Rodriguez, Taylor-Sinclair and Johnson still to hit full fitness, I think a wee bit of "wait and see" is in order.

 

[Kmac]

I don’t even know where to begin Guys...

truth be told, I’m quite appaled by the utter appathy/ reservation amongst our support.

despite being hounded on these boards for the last few hours, I have the best intentions of the club at heart. 

I’m a significant  monthly contributor to the well society and ‘was’ a season ticket holder for almost 20 years yet according to the majority, I’m talking utter nonsense with  No sense of the club.

I’ve never once advocated us paying too high wages (I realize where we are in terms of stature and finances), yet what I’ve advoated is a lack of acceptance in reverting to ‘type’.

why the fuck should we settle for being a wee club with a wee mentality? 

Yes, be realistic, but also think big guys.

lets have an ambition of competing in the top 4/5/6 consistlently,

btw, to the poster above, im long in the tooth enough to remember Boyle)...

selling top talent  and beginning from scratch isn’t a model in any business, let alone football.

We all contribute in our own way to the club and and fair to express our opinions however absuse on models for the club is  ridiculous and shouldn’t be tolerated.

yes, we can get heated in the vision for what we all contribute to, but the tone/stance taken is indicative of a “top wee, top poor, too stupid” mentality and will get us nowehere other than a couple of seasons in the championship...   

 

 

 

[Del_Superwell]

4 minutes ago, Kmac said:

I don’t even know where to begin Guys...

truth be told, I’m quite appaled by the utter appathy/ reservation amongst our support.

despite being hounded on these boards for the last few hours, I have the best intentions of the club at heart. 

I’m a significant  monthly contributor to the well society and ‘was’ a season ticket holder for almost 20 years yet according to the majority, I’m talking utter nonsense with  No sense of the club.

I’ve never once advocated us paying too high wages (I realize where we are in terms of stature and finances), yet what I’ve advoated is a lack of acceptance in reverting to ‘type’.

why the fuck should we settle for being a wee club with a wee mentality? 

Yes, be realistic, but also think big guys.

lets have an ambition of competing in the top 4/5/6 cbtw, to the poster above, im long in the tooth enough to remember Boyle) 

 

 

 

I agree about the whole ambition side of things but it seems the priority year in year out for the board under the current format we operate at now is to make sure we survive in the top flight, albeit if we can push for top 6 then great, but the main priority every season is and will be survival and I don't see that changing any time soon.

[beastfromtheeast(stand)]

When Kipre came in he was the second choice centre half (on trial) behind the boy who went to a 3rd division french team, he has turned out to be a star in the team that made two cup finals for the first time in our history.

Every one at Motherwell football club shall be wishing him the best for his future endeavors.

Kipre Kipre 

[The African]

13 minutes ago, Kmac said:

I don’t even know where to begin Guys...

truth be told, I’m quite appaled by the utter appathy/ reservation amongst our support.

despite being hounded on these boards for the last few hours, I have the best intentions of the club at heart. 

I’m a significant  monthly contributor to the well society and ‘was’ a season ticket holder for almost 20 years yet according to the majority, I’m talking utter nonsense with  No sense of the club.

I’ve never once advocated us paying too high wages (I realize where we are in terms of stature and finances), yet what I’ve advoated is a lack of acceptance in reverting to ‘type’.

why the fuck should we settle for being a wee club with a wee mentality? 

Yes, be realistic, but also think big guys.

lets have an ambition of competing in the top 4/5/6 consistlently,

btw, to the poster above, im long in the tooth enough to remember Boyle)...

selling top talent  and beginning from scratch isn’t a model in any business, let alone football.

We all contribute in our own way to the club and and fair to express our opinions however absuse on models for the club is  ridiculous and shouldn’t be tolerated.

yes, we can get heated in the vision for what we all contribute to, but the tone/stance taken is indicative of a “top wee, top poor, too stupid” mentality and will get us nowehere other than a couple of seasons in the championship...   

 

 

 

Agree with a fair bit of what you say here.

 

My one concern is that you feel hounded. This is the Internet, not real life. Any **** with a keyboard can add content and it is all just bs or insightfully brilliant at one and the same time my own input included. Do not let it get to you.

[weeyin]

We are trying to run at break-even while paying off a chunk of debt and with a fairly modest revenue.

If we want to get "better than what we have" it's going to be by taking a gamble - unless anyone knows of a player better than Campbell, Dunne, Kipre´ or Cadden that we can sign cheap.

[The African]

One question. Does our model have a provision for the season after it fails in it’s core purpose, and we find ourselves in the Championship?

[Kmac]

5 minutes ago, The African said:

Agree with a fair bit of what you say here.

 

My one concern is that you feel hounded. This is the Internet, not real life. Any **** with a keyboard can add content and it is all just bs or insightfully brilliant at one and the same time my own input included. Do not let it get to you.

Don’t worry, I don’t feel hounded (I know the deal)

 

I’m just totally perplexed by a large cross-section of our support who are happy to support goings on yet will be the first to jump on these /other boards / stands further down the line to criticize the club, manager or structure come whatever month of the season, without pre-emptivly seeking a solution. 

 

[weeyin]

 

6 minutes ago, The African said:

One question. Does our model have a provision for the season after it fails in it’s core purpose, and we find ourselves in the Championship?

 

It does, actually - according to the Board.

It doesn't, however, have a contingency for failing to pay our debts and lose money by overpaying salaries and win bonuses (like we did the season we were finishing best of the rest).

We could follow the Dundee Utd model people kept suggesting we adopt - that's working out well. Or maybe just get a rich investor like Ross County, and hope they keep pumping in money - that worked out well for us with Boyle.

Or we could spend within our means while we pay off our debt and see where that takes us over the next couple of seasons.

And again, I'd still be interested to hear who all these players are that are an upgrade on what we have and would play for the wages we can afford. 

[Londonwell]

5 minutes ago, Kmac said:

Don’t worry, I don’t feel hounded (I know the deal)

 

I’m just totally perplexed by a large cross-section of our support who are happy to support goings on yet will be the first to jump on these /other boards / stands further down the line to criticize the club, manager or structure come whatever month of the season, without pre-emptivly seeking a solution. 

 

Genuinely have no idea what you’re talking about.