Robinson... How Do We Think He's Doing ?

[Stu]

4 minutes ago, milo said:

I’m really pleased our form since the break as been decent as despite the mitigating circumstances I think Robinson was under a bit of pressure after December.

Aye, from you!

[joewarkfanclub]

More than happy with how he has approached the job and how we are performing results wise. I would like us to be more attractive to watch at times, but, like others have said, its a good base to build from and Im sure Robbo is well aware of our limitations and will address them as soon as he can. 

 

Not sure if we can make top 6 now but I'll take another trip to Hampden though!

[sinjy]

Of course he is doing alright. After all he won the last game we played!

[fizoxy]

The only game that matters is the next one, so the jury is still out 

[Kmcalpin]

14 hours ago, weeyin said:

That's how Tommy McLean approached the job too. Started off by tightening up the defence. It wasn't until the likes of Bobby Russell arrived a few years later (and Davie Cooper after him), we became more of an attacking threat.

Absolutely.  There's too much negativity going around just now about the team's playing style.  In our situation a manager's first priority should be to stabilise the team and sort out the defence to reduce the goals aginst column.   Thats what Robbo has done.  Once thats been achieved then the next stage is to concentrate on improving the attack.  You're right, some of wee Tommy's early teams were "dire" to watch - soaking up pressure, not conceding too many, and then breaking away to score the odd goal.  Jim MacLean adopted the exact same approach at Tannadice and was lauded for his "attractive" footballing style.  

I've only ever deserted our team twice, albeit temporarily,  once during the dire Alex Mcleish era; and once in the mid 80s when I went to Tannadice to watch Dundee United and Hibs in preference to our own game.  I'd been brainwashed by the media into thinking that Jim MacLean's team was the finest footballing team Scotland had ever produced.  I got carried away and just had to see this game for myself.  Hibs pounded them for 89 minutes and penned them back in their own box but couldn't score.  United broke away twice and scored twice to win 2-0.  The Arabs went crazy as did the media over this footballing "masterclass".  It just left me cold.  I decided there and then that there was nothing wrong with following our own club.

Much more recently our 1-0 defeat to Kilmarnock seemed to go down very well with the Ayrshire fans despite their style resembling two parked doubler decker buses.  I didn't hear many moans and complaints at the game from their fans or read scathing comments afterwards.  Maybe some of our fans have unrealistic expectations?

Right now I'm perfectly happy with us winning 1-0 by playing defensively, playing the long ball or whatever.  Yes, playing flowing silky soccer is nice but that comes later.

All that said, it seems to be in vogue for certain fans to criticise fellow fans who wanted Stephen Robinson sacked a few months ago.    All I would say is live and let live. These boards and football in general, are all about opinions and no-one should be sneered at for holding a different view.

Our team is doing quite well just now and despite internal differences our fanbase should stick together.   There's room for all shades of opinion so long as we show mutual respect.

 

[Happy Dosser]

"Ssome of wee Tommy's early teams were "dire" to watch - soaking up pressure, not conceding too many, and then breaking away to score the odd goal.  Jim MacLean adopted the exact same approach at Tannadice and was lauded for his "attractive" footballing style. "

Very true, Kmcalpin. I remember in the early days of Tommy's tenure all we had up front was a very young Andy Walker and  old war-horse Andy Harrow.  John Reilly  was then  a panic signing from The Arabs whose career was virtually ended soon after by a knee injury, so zero attacking options after that.  There was one game at FP when Charlie Nicholas played for Aberdeen in which we actually scored early and spent about the next 70 minutes defending desperately to win, if my memory serves me correctly: nerve-racking  stuff..

Our team has a strong spine now and I am sure Robbo will planning Stage Two of The Project.

[weeyin]

It's a bit of a stretch to compare Jim's team with Tommy's early team. 

We were parking the bus, had little creativity, struggling down the bottom of the league and avoided relegation due to league reconstruction. 

Dundee Utd. played a very effective form of counter attacking football that relied on the likes of Bannon and Milne with their speed. Tactics that saw them winning a host of European ties against top flight opposition.  

They were easily one of the top teams in the UK at the time, and a UEFA cup final and run to the European Cup semis (with a narrow defeat) showed they were a force in Europe too. 

 

 

[Lobey_Dosser]

By my reckoning, we went into this season having lost 10/10 cup games against top flight opposition since the final in 2011.

To win 6 this season is incredible. Huge credit to Robinson for turning the mentality of the club around. 

[joewarkfanclub]

I think he just went from "no bad" to "pretty good" 

[grizzlyg]

Amazes me that at end of 2017 folk wanted him sacked if we didn't beat Accies in cup and Ross co in league.....

 

 

[Spiderpig]

He is doing just fine if you ask me, a cup final already and another semi final to look forward to, most people would have taken that in August as a successful season.  Think back to the shite we had to put up with under Barraclough and mcGhee and then judge how well Robinson has done.

[Clackscat]

He is doing just fine if you ask me, a cup final already and another semi final to look forward to, most people would have taken that in August as a successful season.  Think back to the shite we had to put up with under Barraclough and mcGhee and the judge how well Robinson has done.

Agreed and consider also what tough draws we have had in both competitions

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[Toxteth O'Grady]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/43184797

[postiejim]

Two games intae the season ......it’s the Motherwell way.

[Yodo]

Overstayed his welcome time to go before he gives us a mountain to climb 29pts from 90 over the last 30 games says it all bye bye 

[Mintymac]

that wasn’t a good watch today . Robbo think you might be getting found out . Hopefully not but that was brutal to watch today . Over to you Robbo . The jury is out 

[Shaka]

1 hour ago, postiejim said:

Two games intae the season ......it’s the Motherwell way.

Two? Do League Cup games not count like? We have played 6 games and been utterly horseshit in every one!

Im not saying sack him right now, but unless he picks up a Minimum of a point v Hearts & Rangers plus a win v Livvy in the cup I believe his jacket should be on a very shoogly peg.

Just worried we are gonna go with cheap option Lasley to get us out of the mess Robbo is leaving us in

[Del_Superwell]

12 minutes ago, Shaka said:

Two? Do League Cup games not count like? We have played 6 games and been utterly horseshit in every one!

Im not saying sack him right now, but unless he picks up a Minimum of a point v Hearts & Rangers plus a win v Livvy in the cup I believe his jacket should be on a very shoogly peg.

Just worried we are gonna go with cheap option Lasley to get us out of the mess Robbo is leaving us in

Lasley with Craigan to start with would probably be the temporary management team if we were to sack Robbo however im hopeful we can start stringing a few results together starting next week at Livi.

[The African]

Robinson deserves at least a little time to try and sort things out. The success of last season surely buys him that? Let's see where we are after the first round of fixtures. Anyone coming in will have to work with what we have, so changing before the end of the transfer window " to give the new manager a chance of building their own squad" is not an option. We have no cash and who is going to take our cast offs?

The uncomfortable truth is that the two players who made our squad a little bit better than the rest, Moult and Kipre, have left, and, not surprisingly, they have been difficult to replace. Throw in a few injuries, Dunne, Bowman, Hartley, Tanner, and we are down amongst the dregs of the division, already fighting for survival.

[GazzyB]

Definitely don't think we should sack him but he's got to rip it up and start again, starting with the long ball guff we've been subject to.

[ECOSSE1991]

After only 15 months as manager, a near complete rebuild of the playing staff last summer which resulted in 2 cup finals, granted league performances have left a lot to be desired but for people to want Stephen Robinson sacked is just indicative of modern football supporters.  I wasn't Tommy McLean's biggest fan but he would have been kicked out after a month if some of our current fans had seen the dross that he served up, yet he lasted 10 years. We aren't, to quote 'The African', "down amongst the dregs of the division, already fighting for survival",  yes we've played poorly in 2 league and 4 Betfred games this season combined with a shocking league run since last December but fans need to just calm down and stop calling for the managers head. If you're a young Motherwell fan who has experienced top 3 league positions and European participation then this bad run might have you asking for changes but if like me you've been aboard the claret & amber roller coaster for decades this is nothing new.

Check our history, this is just Motherwell, yes it hurts but it's just Motherwell and it's not going to be any different unless a billionaire wishes to throw away some of his money in our direction. We are usually the highest finishing league position team of all the clubs outwith a city based club, think about that.  Celtic, Rangers, Aberdeen, Hearts, Hibs, even St Johnstone at a push and in days past Dundee United are all city based with the potential support that can bring, we are a small town based club with 4,000 die-hard fans.

We all want to see our team win. For me winning in any style is more important than playing nice entertaining football but losing football, "hoofball" as some have called our recent style is just a long pass game which I've no problem with and yes it needs to have an end product which at this moment it's not. But we have to be realistic with our expectations of a Motherwell manager who has very limited money and as result a limited ability squad to select from.

How many would swap last seasons cup runs for any recent top 6 finishes achieved by any of our previous 3-4 managers? European qualification is great but with our poor record in Europe it can cost the club much needed money, a top 6 finish is good too and brings in extra revenue but if I was offered Europe and top 6 or a repeat of the victories over 7 Premiership teams to reach 2 cup finals like we did last season I know what I'd chose. It may be small minded but the cup wins over Aberdeen, Hearts and particularly Rangers helped heal the painful memories of many sore defeats by these clubs in the years I've followed Motherwell.

Every player and manager deserves criticism at some point but we must support whoever wears claret & amber or manages those that do until a clear and obvious time for change presents itself and I may be wrong but I don't think we've reached that stage yet.

Apologies for the length of my ramble but just relax folks and enjoy the ride, it's just Motherwell.

COYW.

[Al B]

If he stops saying "we go again", he'd go up massively in my estimation. Its the most annoying thing in the English language, let alone football.

[Happy Dosser]

25 minutes ago, ECOSSE1991 said:

After only 15 months as manager, a near complete rebuild of the playing staff last summer which resulted in 2 cup finals, granted league performances have left a lot to be desired but for people to want Stephen Robinson sacked is just indicative of modern football supporters.  I wasn't Tommy McLean's biggest fan but he would have been kicked out after a month if some of our current fans had seen the dross that he served up, yet he lasted 10 years. We aren't, to quote 'The African', "down amongst the dregs of the division, already fighting for survival",  yes we've played poorly in 2 league and 4 Betfred games this season combined with a shocking league run since last December but fans need to just calm down and stop calling for the managers head. If you're a young Motherwell fan who has experienced top 3 league positions and European participation then this bad run might have you asking for changes but if like me you've been aboard the claret & amber roller coaster for decades this is nothing new.

Check our history, this is just Motherwell, yes it hurts but it's just Motherwell and it's not going to be any different unless a billionaire wishes to throw away some of his money in our direction. We are usually the highest finishing league position team of all the clubs outwith a city based club, think about that.  Celtic, Rangers, Aberdeen, Hearts, Hibs, even St Johnstone at a push and in days past Dundee United are all city based with the potential support that can bring, we are a small town based club with 4,000 die-hard fans.

We all want to see our team win. For me winning in any style is more important than playing nice entertaining football but losing football, "hoofball" as some have called our recent style is just a long pass game which I've no problem with and yes it needs to have an end product which at this moment it's not. But we have to be realistic with our expectations of a Motherwell manager who has very limited money and as result a limited ability squad to select from.

How many would swap last seasons cup runs for any recent top 6 finishes achieved by any of our previous 3-4 managers? European qualification is great but with our poor record in Europe it can cost the club much needed money, a top 6 finish is good too and brings in extra revenue but if I was offered Europe and top 6 or a repeat of the victories over 7 Premiership teams to reach 2 cup finals like we did last season I know what I'd chose. It may be small minded but the cup wins over Aberdeen, Hearts and particularly Rangers helped heal the painful memories of many sore defeats by these clubs in the years I've followed Motherwell.

Every player and manager deserves criticism at some point but we must support whoever wears claret & amber or manages those that do until a clear and obvious time for change presents itself and I may be wrong but I don't think we've reached that stage yet.

Apologies for the length of my ramble but just relax folks and enjoy the ride, it's just Motherwell.

COYW.

Your comments and Andy P's on another thread are well considered.  I don't like our style at the moment and Robinson has a decision to make. Up to now he obviously thinks on our budget that kick and rush is the percentage answer. He doesn't fully trust Bigi and Gorrin seems to fall into this category too at this stage.

I too remember McLean having to rely on Andy Harrow/John Reilly and a young Andy Walker chasing lost causes and slim pickings. I also remember most of the Ancell Babes who were great to watch and won diddly squat. I think we got to a cup SF in 65 and that was about it.

Robinson sees all the players in training and presumably knows their attitudes and abilities. We have little to spend now and the window is closing.

I suspect the board will back his judgment for the first quarter before making a final decision.

The question is: can the manager change and does he think the team can play in a passing style? Thistle got relegated playing that way and not scoring goals and Dundee came perilously close to that fate too.

I think this has the potential to be a long, hard season but I doubt Livingston or St Mirren will be setting the heather on fire and we have  DFC and Panathonaccies to consider. The Tractor Boys seem weak at the mo too.

Sadly we have only 3500-4000 fans and  a budget to match and it has almost always been thus, so get behind the team, Poindexters or make a conscious decision to wander round Asda with the missus on a Saturday afternoon.

 

 

[Ya Bezzer!]

I'm sure it's no secret that I'm not Robinson's biggest fan.  I think his footballing philosophy is well below the level that should be aimed at a Premiership team.  I mean it's to all extents and purposes English non league anti-football.  It belongs to a different age and level of football.  Absolute basics like ball retention and off the ball movement seem to have been virtually abandoned.

However calling for the managers head after two league matches is a bit reactionary especially when our last match last season was the Scottish Cup Final.

That said I've always felt that Robinson was a bit lucky to achieve what he did last term.  There was the odd excellent performance - notably the Aberdeen match in the League Cup - but they were few and far between - even during our cup runs.  We will play Aberdeen 50 or 100 times before they are as bad as they were in that semi final.  And wasn't our top goal scorer during the Scottish cup run Own Goal?

Our run of form after the League Cup final, where let's remember Robinson dropped our best midfielder and not for the first time, was not only deplorable but absolutely soul sapping to watch.  Despite attending 34 matches last season I went literally six months without seeing us win a league game.  Now I missed two midweek fixtures that were both won but still I think it says something when a regular attendee has to go from November to April to see a league match won.  For most of the second half of the season we were bottom two in terms of form and we became almost entirely dependent for set pieces to score goals.  Our goal ratio over a sustained period is now less than a goal a game.

Unfortunately Robinson has not addressed long standing problems, doesn't seem to give a damn about youth development, and has shown no inkling of changing this prehistoric tactical approach.  So while I think he should be given more time this season I'm not confident at all that he'll use it to his advantage.  We desperately need fresh ideas and frankly I don't think Robinson has them but that remains to be seen and I genuinely hope he surprises me.

But honestly, I don't think a minor improvement in form, which may happen,  is enough.  When the club is asking more and more from fans in term of financial support we should at least be able to come to Fir Park and not be subjected to eye rape for months on end.  

If it's a choice between watching a better style of football and finishing 10th or watching the tripe we've endured most of last season and the beginning of this season and finishing 9th or 8th I know what I'd pick, that's assuming the tripe does better than 10th.... 

Basically Robinson has to adapt and rebrand his football.

 

[Haggischomper]

If I'm tuning him out with this pish, then surely the players are too? It's utter guff.

If he stops saying "we go again", he'd go up massively in my estimation. Its the most annoying thing in the English language, let alone football.

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