Robinson... How Do We Think He's Doing ?

[numpty]

4 minutes ago, Yodo said:

Wouldn't let him bring in a cat for the office

I wouldn't let anyone do that, to be fair.

[Yorkyred]

2 minutes ago, Yodo said:

Wouldn't let him bring in a cat for the office ,all we need is him gone .Love your confidence in Robinson beat by Killie and lose to Accies so who gets the blame for that ?

Oh i’ve never said he is perfect, the same way no manager is perfect. I just believe the fact we are struggling is not just down to management, other factors also play into it. Injuries to just about every key player in the squad ? the budget ? International call ups for Cadden and Campbell ? He certainly is part of the reason we are struggling, can’t deny that for a minute but i’ve seen  enough over the years to know the grass is not always greener and the vast majority of clubs that swap managers too often fail. Listen managers are judged on results and if we lose enough he will be sacked. I would still give him until the summer and then make a judgement before releasing the playing budget. I personally still think we won’t be relegated this season under Robinson and you do. But you stated we would be relegated under Robinson last season and frankly you were way off the mark.

[Yodo]

5 minutes ago, Yorkyred said:

Oh i’ve never said he is perfect, the same way no manager is perfect. I just believe the fact we are struggling is not just down to management, other factors also play into it. Injuries to just about every key player in the squad ? the budget ? International call ups for Cadden and Campbell ? He certainly is part of the reason we are struggling, can’t deny that for a minute but i’ve seen  enough over the years to know the grass is not always greener and the vast majority of clubs that swap managers too often fail. Listen managers are judged on results and if we lose enough he will be sacked. I would still give him until the summer and then make a judgement before releasing the playing budget. I personally still think we won’t be relegated this season under Robinson and you do. But you stated we would be relegated under Robinson last season and frankly you were way off the mark.

You not think he hasn't won enough games at Fir Park over last season and a half ,maybe Beezer could post the stats again just in case you haven't seen .

[Yorkyred]

11 minutes ago, Yodo said:

You not think he hasn't won enough games at Fir Park over last season and a half ,maybe Beezer could post the stats again just in case you haven't seen .

That depends on the remit he has from the board.  If his stats are well below their acceptable level he would be gone.

[star sail]

People have very short memories of Motherwell teams of the past. Anybody thinking Saturdays performance was the worst Motherwell performance ever , has not been a Motherwell fan for long. I have watched many very poor Motherwell displays  under pretty much every manager we have ever had. 

Since McLean's time, McLeish, Kampman, Davis, Butcher, Malpas, Gannon, McGhee, Brown,  McCall, Baraclough, (who have I missed), I have watched some turgid dross. Some of the players these managers have signed have been as poor as any we have now (the two Irish boys Keegan and who was the other one, McLeish bringing in Andy Roddie and my personal favourite Estaban Casagolda).  The list goes on. 

We have had our moments under some of these managers too. McLeish's first six months, McGhee's first season, the second place under Stuart McCall being amongst the highlights. However the succcess was temporary with all these managers. McLeish managed to spoil one of the best Motherwell teams in my lifetime. McGhee's second season was painful to watch and McCall benefited from being manager at a time when the standard of the SPL was at an all time low. His teams blew up after 75 minutes because they were not fit enough. Could you imagine Robinson committing that crime?

However if you really want to remember the dark days, thing back to the Malpas era. If ever there was a man that was able to suck the life out of a club, Malpas was that man.

Weeyin did a very good analysis of McLean's time a few months back. His time at the club was far from rosy and it was only latterly, after he had been given the time to build it, that the Cup winning team came into being.

I remember being up at Dalziel Park many years ago and I happened to catch a Billy Davis training session. It was embarrassingly poor. The players could hardly do 5 press ups between them and most of the session was spent lying on the ground pretending to stretch. Watch a Stephen Robinson training session by comparison. There is no comparison. The level of athleticism and professionalism is night and day.

I find the clamber to sack managers at the best of times distasteful but at Christmas time in particular it is worth while remembering that we are talking about an honest professionals livelihood. Robinson has a very difficult job as ever Motherwell manager before him has proved. 

We have no God given right to beat the likes of St Mirren, Accies, Dundee etc.  People wanting to take on that attitude would be better served following the Old Firm. 

I wish Stevie Robinson all the best and hope that things fall into place soon. 

Merry Christmas.

[postiejim]

4 hours ago, star sail said:

People have very short memories of Motherwell teams of the past. Anybody thinking Saturdays performance was the worst Motherwell performance ever , has not been a Motherwell fan for long. I have watched many very poor Motherwell displays  under pretty much every manager we have ever had. 

Since McLean's time, McLeish, Kampman, Davis, Butcher, Malpas, Gannon, McGhee, Brown,  McCall, Baraclough, (who have I missed), I have watched some turgid dross. Some of the players these managers have signed have been as poor as any we have now (the two Irish boys Keegan and who was the other one, McLeish bringing in Andy Roddie and my personal favourite Estaban Casagolda).  The list goes on. 

We have had our moments under some of these managers too. McLeish's first six months, McGhee's first season, the second place under Stuart McCall being amongst the highlights. However the succcess was temporary with all these managers. McLeish managed to spoil one of the best Motherwell teams in my lifetime. McGhee's second season was painful to watch and McCall benefited from being manager at a time when the standard of the SPL was at an all time low. His teams blew up after 75 minutes because they were not fit enough. Could you imagine Robinson committing that crime?

However if you really want to remember the dark days, thing back to the Malpas era. If ever there was a man that was able to suck the life out of a club, Malpas was that man.

Weeyin did a very good analysis of McLean's time a few months back. His time at the club was far from rosy and it was only latterly, after he had been given the time to build it, that the Cup winning team came into being.

I remember being up at Dalziel Park many years ago and I happened to catch a Billy Davis training session. It was embarrassingly poor. The players could hardly do 5 press ups between them and most of the session was spent lying on the ground pretending to stretch. Watch a Stephen Robinson training session by comparison. There is no comparison. The level of athleticism and professionalism is night and day.

I find the clamber to sack managers at the best of times distasteful but at Christmas time in particular it is worth while remembering that we are talking about an honest professionals livelihood. Robinson has a very difficult job as ever Motherwell manager before him has proved. 

We have no God given right to beat the likes of St Mirren, Accies, Dundee etc.  People wanting to take on that attitude would be better served following the Old Firm. 

I wish Stevie Robinson all the best and hope that things fall into place soon. 

Merry Christmas.

Don’t agree with a lot of what you say  ,but I respect your opinion ,and its a good post.

[Motherwellfc1991]

So Robbo puts on a good training session at dalziel and Burrows gets fans free pies after they get knocked out their hands in the warm up so they deserve to keep their jobs!! 

Lets forget the facts that after these great training sessions we play route one football and most of our squad can’t pass the ball 10 yards in front of their team mates and less than 10% of our players can beat their man in a one on one . Also forget the fact we are shite to watch , results are shite and entertainment value is zero .  Combine that with the standard of player we have signed and the performances we have served up in the league this season and last . 

Robbo and Burrows are steering a sinking ship and the old pals act board need to act quickly. Problem is there’s far too much conflict of interest between the society board and the club board which keeps getting swept under the carpet- appointments by appointment by mates under a supposedly fan owned regime . 

We stick with Robbo and there will be more than him looking for a new job - his mistakes are putting many  people who work for the club livelihoods at stake . 

Merry xmas and I look forward to my pie from burrows - that will make all the difference After another defeat . 

[Yorkyred]

14 minutes ago, Motherwellfc1991 said:

So Robbo puts on a good training session at dalziel and Burrows gets fans free pies after they get knocked out their hands in the warm up so they deserve to keep their jobs!! 

Lets forget the facts that after these great training sessions we play route one football and most of our squad can’t pass the ball 10 yards in front of their team mates and less than 10% of our players can beat their man in a one on one . Also forget the fact we are shite to watch , results are shite and entertainment value is zero .  Combine that with the standard of player we have signed and the performances we have served up in the league this season and last . 

Robbo and Burrows are steering a sinking ship and the old pals act board need to act quickly. Problem is there’s far too much conflict of interest between the society board and the club board which keeps getting swept under the carpet- appointments by appointment by mates under a supposedly fan owned regime . 

We stick with Robbo and there will be more than him looking for a new job - his mistakes are putting many  people who work for the club livelihoods at stake . 

Merry xmas and I look forward to my pie from burrows - that will make all the difference After another defeat . 

You would need to get hit in the face from a high velocity football first, should that happen you can be assured that our chief exec who actually seems to care about the punters coming through the gates will sort you out. Or maybe he and Lasley who also has a love for the club and has himself given many years to it should be, what is the phrase used “ Hunted out”.

[fizoxy]

I guess it was only a matter of time before the burrows chat started. I think the fact that he is a fan, and that he came from/started these here boards has a few folks thinking that they might be equally qualified. He has also chosen to put himself out there on social media, which many of us appreciate. Otherwise most folk probably wouldn’t even know who the CEO was.

The facts are that he worked his way up through the ranks, and has been highly regarded by his peers for some time and multiple execs, owners, managers, board(s) have been happy with his ascent through the club structure. I don’t know what he did professionally before he joined the club, and neither does most folk on here, but it doesn’t matter.

As for his current performance, we have made significant improvements to the pitch, facilities, and “matchday experience”, season tickets are up, revenue is up, we’re knocking off sizeable chunks of the club debt, the commercial arm of the club has seen huge improvements, our media team is excellent, and we succeeded in being selected for project brave (let’s not kid ourselves on, this place would have been at him with pitch forks if we hadn’t qualified for that). All this without a rich owner. You may not want to give him a knighthood, but to suggest he should be fired is ridiculous.

He recruited the manager (I’m assuming some of the board and les were involved too) and robinson has been responsible for two cup finals. I’m kind of sick of people dismissing that fact, we don’t get many finals and both were great days with great build up. No one complained about our football in those cup runs. Who was the last manager to do that? He also gets the plaudits for signing kipre (if he gets the stick for the shite ones too). So regardless of how Robinson is doing now, if you think the chief exec should go because he signed Robinson, you’re an idiot. The alternative is hardly setting the heather alight in his new job either.

We have shown that as a club we have prioritized stability and paying down debt, and won’t make knee jerk decisions. Unfortunately that may be to the short term detriment on the playing side, but it is the right thing to do, that’s how we all budget in real life and the club should be no different.

We don’t have individual board members paying players wages like the Dempster / McCall regime had. We’re fan owned whether you like it or not, and whether the club likes it or not, as the fact is that no one has wanted to buy the club since Boyle put it up for sale all those years ago.

I don’t think anyone likes our current style of football, I personally hate it , and there is fair debate over whether a new manager could do a better job, but let’s take a breath - this is far from a crisis.


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[David]

Top post Fizoxy, although you'll no doubt be accused by some as just being "Burrow's pal" or some other nonsense.

Personally, I quite like the fact that we can rest easy knowing that those in charge aren't going to do anything stupid, such as sack the manager in January when we're still clear of the bottom two. If we ever find ourselves going on the kind of run (which would also require one of the bottom two to go on a successful run) which sees us drop down that far then questions can and should be asked at that point, but not before.

Again, we can look at things in the summer and there may very well be a change of management at that point, but doing so beforehand in the current circumstances would be madness.

[Shaka]

On 12/24/2018 at 5:35 PM, fizoxy said:

I guess it was only a matter of time before the burrows chat started. I think the fact that he is a fan, and that he came from/started these here boards has a few folks thinking that they might be equally qualified. He has also chosen to put himself out there on social media, which many of us appreciate. Otherwise most folk probably wouldn’t even know who the CEO was.

The facts are that he worked his way up through the ranks, and has been highly regarded by his peers for some time and multiple execs, owners, managers, board(s) have been happy with his ascent through the club structure. I don’t know what he did professionally before he joined the club, and neither does most folk on here, but it doesn’t matter.

As for his current performance, we have made significant improvements to the pitch, facilities, and “matchday experience”, season tickets are up, revenue is up, we’re knocking off sizeable chunks of the club debt, the commercial arm of the club has seen huge improvements, our media team is excellent, and we succeeded in being selected for project brave (let’s not kid ourselves on, this place would have been at him with pitch forks if we hadn’t qualified for that). All this without a rich owner. You may not want to give him a knighthood, but to suggest he should be fired is ridiculous.

He recruited the manager (I’m assuming some of the board and les were involved too) and robinson has been responsible for two cup finals. I’m kind of sick of people dismissing that fact, we don’t get many finals and both were great days with great build up. No one complained about our football in those cup runs. Who was the last manager to do that? He also gets the plaudits for signing kipre (if he gets the stick for the shite ones too). So regardless of how Robinson is doing now, if you think the chief exec should go because he signed Robinson, you’re an idiot. The alternative is hardly setting the heather alight in his new job either.

We have shown that as a club we have prioritized stability and paying down debt, and won’t make knee jerk decisions. Unfortunately that may be to the short term detriment on the playing side, but it is the right thing to do, that’s how we all budget in real life and the club should be no different.

We don’t have individual board members paying players wages like the Dempster / McCall regime had. We’re fan owned whether you like it or not, and whether the club likes it or not, as the fact is that no one has wanted to buy the club since Boyle put it up for sale all those years ago.

I don’t think anyone likes our current style of football, I personally hate it , and there is fair debate over whether a new manager could do a better job, but let’s take a breath - this is far from a crisis.


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I feel Burrows stick is justified, in part! His control of the Business side has seen a more polished, professional and most importantly profitable Club emerge.

However, those achievements I feel are tempered by his failings on the Football side. 3 managers now, 2 who have been old pals act choices and all 3 have been utter shit. The Cup Finals were great commercially but meant nothing in a football sence because we failed to turn up in both and were easily brushed aside. Robinson's signing policy in the Summer was complete madness, his league form for almost 14 months now has been nothing short of abysmal and our "brand" of football is seeing one of our best prospects in years being forced out the door while our two young Internationals seem to be regressing under him. We need someone strong to hold this Clown to task, not the pal who hired him on the cheap. And when he finally gets blootered into space we need a proper manager search, not another old pals act with Lasley (even Stevie Wonder could see Las is our manager in waiting)

I mentioned earlier that the situation our club is in would be Ideal for a Director of Football to come in and run the Football side. That would leave Burrows to concentrate on all the positive stuff he is doing. Unfortunately were skint and probably cant afford that option so the buck stops with Burrows. 

[Welldaft Mk1]

This thread is full of people that are glass half empty and glass half full personalities. I suppose that is no surprise as it probably represents life in general and most fans of football clubs. 

So you get an overly negative post and someone from the glass half full side comes into defend Robinson and Burrows and vice versa. 

I am a realist. I look at the situation and think should we be in this position and where should we be based on the money and resources we have at our disposal. 

There is no doubt that the football being played at the moment is not pretty to watch. There is no doubt that some of the players are not playing to their abilities and some of the summer signings have not come good (yet) as the Manager would have hoped. There is no doubt that the Manager tactics are a little agricultural and some formations and substitutes have proved to be mistakes. 

But the reality is that we are almost exactly where we ought to be in the league based on our budget. So however you look at it he is NOT failing in that respect.

To dismiss as many do the cup results is just bizarre and to any rationale person fundamentally unfair on Robinson. Only twice in our 130 yr history have we reached 2 cup finals and that is not worthy of praise or recognition. In the finals we played a team with 20+ times our budget and were not humiliated in either. We had great semi finals, again beating teams with much larger resources and playing squads. Even this season we get to a quarter final. I remember many Well teams not getting through the 1st round of cup fixtures v lesser opposition. To dismiss that imho shows that your views are glass half empty in the extreme and that quite frankly regardless how we perform you will never be happy....

Short of getting Steve Clarke I am not sure what replacing Robbo would achieve. We could have a better brand of football but lose even more games. I personally hope he can keep us clear of the 2 relegation places and maybe another run in the cup if we are lucky with the draw. If he does that he deserves to stay on as Manager. If he does not and we lose to Ross C and slide back into 11th or 12th then I am sure the club will act and I would agree with that. 

 

 

[Kmcalpin]

2 hours ago, Shaka said:

our "brand" of football is seeing one of our best prospects in years being forced out the door

A bit strong.  No-one is forcing Turnbull out of the door except perhaps his agent.  If he leaves shortly it'll be because of the cash on offer end of. 

[Onthefringes]

10 minutes ago, Kmcalpin said:

A bit strong.  No-one is forcing Turnbull out of the door except perhaps his agent.  If he leaves shortly it'll be because of the cash on offer end of. 

Whilst understanding nobody is being forced out the door - Your cash ideal is incredibly naive.

[Shaka]

1 hour ago, Kmcalpin said:

A bit strong.  No-one is forcing Turnbull out of the door except perhaps his agent.  If he leaves shortly it'll be because of the cash on offer end of. 

I dont believe it is. Turnbull is the most Technically proficient player at the club at the moment. For a 19 year old with limited starts that tells a story about the dearth of talent in our squad. 

Put yourself in his shoes,  Cadden has been regressing under Robbo, it looks like Campbell is fucked at the moment as well. Turnbull will be looking at this, then see himself playing in the middle of the park either watching 100mph 60 yard hoofs past him aimed at Curtis Mains face, or watch teammates unable to read his passes or even competently trap a ball. What exactly is he going to learn here? 

Therefor I believe Robbo and his style of anti football is in a way forcing Turnbull out the door

[David]

7 minutes ago, Shaka said:

I dont believe it is. Turnbull is the most Technically proficient player at the club at the moment. For a 19 year old with limited starts that tells a story about the dearth of talent in our squad. 

Put yourself in his shoes,  Cadden has been regressing under Robbo, it looks like Campbell is fucked at the moment as well. Turnbull will be looking at this, then see himself playing in the middle of the park either watching 100mph 60 yard hoofs past him aimed at Curtis Mains face, or watch teammates unable to read his passes or even competently trap a ball. What exactly is he going to learn here? 

Therefor I believe Robbo and his style of anti football is in a way forcing Turnbull out the door

It could also be said that Robinson showing faith in him and putting him in the team is what has led to the rumoured interest from the likes of Southampton in the first place, couldn't it? 

Make no mistake about it, if Turnbull decides to move on to bigger things it'll be due to a combination of factors, none of which include him being "forced out the door" or being unhappy playing under Robinson.

If anything he will owe Robinson and the rest of the management team at the club a debt of gratitude. 

[Yorkyred]

1 hour ago, Onthefringes said:

Whilst understanding nobody is being forced out the door - Your cash ideal is incredibly naive.

There is no doubt the huge increase in wages would be one of the things that would influence a move, it would for all of us. But it’s a huge opportunity to play in one of the most high profile leagues in the world so a good few factors to take into account.

[weeyin]

2 hours ago, Yorkyred said:

There is no doubt the huge increase in wages would be one of the things that would influence a move, it would for all of us. But it’s a huge opportunity to play in one of the most high profile leagues in the world so a good few factors to take into account.

That's probably what Ben Hall thought too and his career in England so far is 5 games on loan for League 2 Notts County. 

I can see the temptation, of course, but timing is everything at that age. 

[smiddy]

well robbo, how the feck do you sort this dug shite out ? cause this is how you make your wages

[Yoshi-1991]

Too late to chuck him before the window?

[milo]

There are probably stronger teams in the championship than the one that started for us today.

The players have massively let Robinson down but I’d still bin him after the summer recruitment approach and I certainly wouldn’t trust him with any funds in January.

Anything less than a win next week should see him go and hell mend the club if they stick with him. 

 

[postiejim]

Nae danger Robbo will be sacked . 

[smiddy]

yes but if we bin him,we pay him, if he could give us a break n just walk away ( heez left us with his shite ) but then who gets the gig ? anyway that's not the discussion because heez still here so where do we go ? I hope someone better then me can sort this dug shite out, ps don't want to hear the all the sob storys after todays game, cause this has been dug shite all season, have I told you how dug shite we have been ??????????

[postiejim]

21 minutes ago, milo said:

There are probably stronger teams in the championship than the one that started for us today.

The players have massively let Robinson down but I’d still bin him after the summer recruitment approach and I certainly wouldn’t trust him with any funds in January.

Anything less than a win next week should see him go and hell mend the club if they stick with him. 

 

Don’t think we can blame  all our bad signings on Robbo ,he’s been told where to look and what tae look for, especially non league players who we hope to “improve “and then sell on ,although it can bring  short term benefits (cash) long term it’s a bad business plan.  Players that we’ve targeted and signed early in the transfer window like Sinclair and  Gorrin IMO can be blamed on Robbo.

[Yodo]

8 minutes ago, postiejim said:

Don’t think we can blame  all our bad signings on Robbo ,he’s been told where to look and what tae look for, especially non league players who we hope to “improve “and then sell on ,although it can bring  short term benefits (cash) long term it’s a bad business plan.  Players that we’ve targeted and signed early in the transfer window like Sinclair and  Gorrin IMO can be blamed on Robbo.

He's the manager he says who stays and who goes and he signs the players wouldn't know a player if he stood in front of him .Agree wae Smiddy nae excuses for today it's been a sore watch all season .As I've said before the squad we have is lacking in ability some of them are total donkeys and that I'm afraid is down to the manager . Do us all a favour Robinson just go tonight and we might get a reaction from the players on Saturday at Accies