Robinson... How Do We Think He's Doing ?

[milo]

I really like the cut of Robinson’s jib and it does the club no good to be sacking managers every other season.

However....,his summer transfer dealings have been astonishingly bad, the whole approach of strengthening “12-18” whilst ignoring glaring deficiencies in the first 11 in itself, coupled with a disappointing start to the season has put him under pressure even at this stage. I certainly wouldn’t trust him with any more funds in January!

Unless we pick up an extremely modest 4 points from the next 3 games then there could be a decision to make.  

Sitting on only 4 or 5 points after 9 games doesn’t bear thinking about!!

[middleeastdave]

I have to confess I was an admirer of SR and still think he can do a job, he refuses to make excuses of losing players through injury at the moment, but I have to say this seasons signings have been awful maybe apart from Danny Johnson, In my opinion he certainly hasn't strengenthed the team this season in fact it has been weakened I think he must be the only manager in Scotland thinks that Sammon has potential. I also worry about the lack of use of fringe players namely McGuire and Turnball at the moment they cannot be any worse than the so called first team players.

I still haven't worked out if Hearts were that good or we were that bad, I suspect the latter.

On the positive front once we get some players back from injury I would think we will start climbing the league table, although not the top six, we are certainly not any worse than say Livingston and see where they are!!

[Great Balls of Shire]

1 hour ago, Kmac said:

His style of ‘football’ is atrocious to watch and I’m sure was part of the reason why, despite two cup runs, we never managed to capatalise by really building any significant growth to our support despite the finals of last season.

Unlike when we finished 2 nd a few years ago and the support swelled under McCall....

..let's face it Motherwell managers have a pretty short shelf life with some  "supporters " .....Robbo did a great job last year with 2nd lowest budget in the league, let's give the guy some backing.....I still reckon we will be pushing for top 6 when the dust settles.

[dunkhayton]

6 minutes ago, Great Balls of Shire said:

.....Robbo did a great job last year with 2nd lowest budget in the league, let's give the guy some backing.....

Our league form last year from November on was relegation form. If it wasn't for a decent start and a dismal county/thistle pairing, we'd have been in real trouble.

We need to be honest and say that despite cup finals, we were not a good side last year, and summer recruitment has made us worse. Let's not even start on tactics. There is next to no football in this side - just poor quality journeymen.

 

 

[steelboy]

2 hours ago, Andy_P said:

It might be worth recollecting what Robinson's remit has been since he became Motherwell manager.

Well we should be getting rid of whoever made the remit as well because pissing money away on journeymen we don't need,  hardly ever winning and awful football is a recipe to be the next Dundee United or even Falkirk.

People need to get their heads round the fact that last season's Scottish Cup run was based on incredible luck. The OG against Acccies, goalie howler and OG at Dens, two goalie mistakes against Hearts, gifts from the keeper and Aranason at Hampden. 

[TwistAndShout]

29 minutes ago, steelboy said:

Well we should be getting rid of whoever made the remit as well because pissing money away on journeymen we don't need,  hardly ever winning and awful football is a recipe to be the next Dundee United or even Falkirk.

People need to get their heads round the fact that last season's Scottish Cup run was based on incredible luck. The OG against Acccies, goalie howler and OG at Dens, two goalie mistakes against Hearts, gifts from the keeper and Aranason at Hampden. 

You need your hole. What a miserable fucker you are.

[Burn_Broomfield]

18 hours ago, Wellfan1984 said:

People who don't like or want rid wanted the likes of Owen Coyle or Alan Stubbs and think Yogi Hughes played nice football at Falkirk...  

Quite happy to not be in that section of fans tbh.  

A sweeping generalisation there.  People are more than entitled to their views in regards to our manager and most don't want any of the above as an alternative.

I'd probably guess most would be looking towards Craigan and Lasley as the men in charge firstly then to look outside the box if they don't want the gig.  

We've recruited incredibly poorly on the back of a financially beneficial season where we stayed in the league despite some absolutely horrendous runs of form and results.  We should have been on the front foot trying to build on that good fortune as opposed to "just staying in the league" again.  If those in charge at all levels set us up as a team to avoid relegation, packed full of journeymen and English lower league dross, season after season; we will inevitably be relegated in the not too distant future and will find it extremely difficult to bounce back quickly.  As a footballing side we are somehow regressing and it is glaringly obvious to most the many deficiencies our team has.  It's a big few months for Robbo with a run of very winnable fixtures from now up until the winter break.  If things haven't improved by then, there will certainly be a call to make by the board whether he stays on and if he and his scouts are allowed to sign anymore players.

I do genuinely hope he turns it around because I like him a lot, but the statistics, the results and the product on show are conspiring against him.

 

[Al B]

The thing I don't like is the rhetoric that we are being punished for individual mistakes and then losing by the odd goal, seems to be implying that we make one mistake, lose a goal from it and lose the game. That bad luck is playing it's part and it will turn.

It's absolutely ignoring the fact that what's actually happening is we're making 10/15 mistakes in dangerous areas every single game, and losing a goal from at least one of them is inevitable.

[Andy_P]

1 hour ago, Burn_Broomfield said:

We've recruited incredibly poorly on the back of a financially beneficial season where we stayed in the league despite some absolutely horrendous runs of form and results.  We should have been on the front foot trying to build on that good fortune as opposed to "just staying in the league" again.  If those in charge at all levels set us up as a team to avoid relegation, packed full of journeymen and English lower league dross, season after season; we will inevitably be relegated in the not too distant future and will find it extremely difficult to bounce back quickly. 

Currently I don't see us challenging for the top half but I'd still like to think that we have enough about to be free of relegation worries when the business end of the season comes around. But  the point you make about going forward is a good one.

Now other than remarks I've seen attributed to Robinson I have no idea what our budget actually is but is it generally reckoned  that we are coming in with the second or third lowest budget in the division.  If that continues to be the case, we do maintain the sale of an asset each season, then we do run the risk of the post-administration years where things regressed to that point under Malpas where if the season was week longer we'd probably have gone done. 

 It takes us back to what I remember being an excellent discussion last season where  (Ya Bezzer springs to mind) made the suggestion was made that the focus had shifted too much from the team to concerning ourselves with the financials. Perhaps there is a case?

Personally for now I think we are managing things fairly well between eradicating the historical debt, given that with each month that passes the period of those favourable terms becomes more limited,  and ensuring we remain competitive on the park.  I tend to think that taking a longer term view that a couple of years with more modest investment in the playing side in the short term is going to be worth it if you're able to secure the future of the club and will therefore be better placed to increase your investment in the team for a more sustained period further down the line.

The difficulty of course comes when you hit that sticky bit as we kind of have now. Do you hold your nerve and stay on course, release funds for a refresh of the team in January or as some evidently wish, look at a change in the dugout?  A test of nerves for sure that one!

 

[Yassin]

4 hours ago, steelboy said:

Well we should be getting rid of whoever made the remit as well because pissing money away on journeymen we don't need,  hardly ever winning and awful football is a recipe to be the next Dundee United or even Falkirk.

People need to get their heads round the fact that last season's Scottish Cup run was based on incredible luck. The OG against Acccies, goalie howler and OG at Dens, two goalie mistakes against Hearts, gifts from the keeper and Aranason at Hampden. 

We scored 9 and conceded 1 (a penalty) on our way to the final. That's entirely down to Robinson.

[Welldaft Mk1]

4 hours ago, dunkhayton said:

Our league form last year from November on was relegation form. If it wasn't for a decent start and a dismal county/thistle pairing, we'd have been in real trouble.

We need to be honest and say that despite cup finals, we were not a good side last year, and summer recruitment has made us worse. Let's not even start on tactics. There is next to no football in this side - just poor quality journeymen.

 

 

You cannot assess a season without including cup games. Not in my opinion anyway. 

Motherwell fans have always liked cup games and our crowds are demonstrably bigger as last night proved. 1200+ for midweek game away to side top of the league. 

I think it is disingenuous to dismiss cup games when reviewing Robinson’s tenure. Inc last night I read we have only lost something like 3 cup games in nearly 20 games. Granted it includes league cup group stages, but even taking knock out games into account you could probably go back 5+ seasons to match last season and this. 

For all that I agree our league form has been poor. But again our budget is probably above only Hamilton and the 2 promoted teams. As to the players we have signed. Maybe our wage budget dictates we sign Danny Johnson (not a slight on him) rather than say Naismith, Greg Stewart and even Tony Watt. So unproven or journeyman players rather than proven players. 

Robinson is certainly not immune to criticism and I do feel we have been quite poor of late. We cannot seem to avoid conceding goals and usually self inflicted as farcical as Bigi last night. No excuse for that balls up. I still think we will not be in the relegation mix but nor will we be near top 6. So if finishing in the league in a position around where your budget sits is a sackable offence then we would be sacking Managers every season. 

Robbo will leave at some point and probably because we are in the mire, but I am hoping it is not for a while and not this season at least. The Board will rightly back him for the foreseeable future. Look at McCann still in a job after losing 6 straight games and not getting out the league cup group stage.  

I still rate him as a very good Manager given the resources he has to work with. 

 

 

[steelboy]

13 minutes ago, Welldaft Mk1 said:

For all that I agree our league form has been poor. But again our budget is probably above only Hamilton and the 2 promoted teams. As to the players we have signed. Maybe our wage budget dictates we sign Danny Johnson (not a slight on him) rather than say Naismith, Greg Stewart and even Tony Watt. So unproven or journeyman players rather than proven players. 

If money is that tight then we shouldn't be extending Shay Gordon or George Newell. That is just pissing money away.

[Yodo]

Robinson quoted in the papers as saying "we have punched above our weight getting to where we got to " So punching above our weight is beating Edinburgh City ,Queen of the South scraping by Clyde and losing to Stranraer and then winning at Livingston if that's punching above our weight then we really are in shite street 

[TwistAndShout]

Robinson should be developing the youth.

Robinson is pissing money away offering contracts to youth players.

Make up your fucking mind!

[steelboy]

10 minutes ago, TwistAndShout said:

Robinson should be developing the youth.

Robinson is pissing money away offering contracts to youth players.

Make up your fucking mind!

Newell and Gordon will never be good enough for our first team. He signed Newell because he's mates with his Dad and the club didn't even announce his contract extension which tells you everything. Robinson knew Gordon from NI youth squads and inexplicably put him in the team ahead of Ainsworth when we were in a relegation battle and somehow Gordon got extended last season despite falling behind the younger Turnbull and Brown.

I think most people would rather we put that money into a quality striker.

 

[Great Balls of Shire]

8 hours ago, dunkhayton said:

Our league form last year from November on was relegation form. If it wasn't for a decent start and a dismal county/thistle pairing, we'd have been in real trouble.

We need to be honest and say that despite cup finals, we were not a good side last year, and summer recruitment has made us worse. Let's not even start on tactics. There is next to no football in this side - just poor quality journeymen.

 

 

Don't think anyone last year said we were a good side, just good at what we did, hence2 finals

[Shaka]

Its quite simple for me. Robinson has 6 games to save his job. Anything less than a minimum of 10 points from our next 6 games and he should be sacked. And I dont trust him to spend more of our money in January!

The facts are that his record in the transfer market is horrific, and we are now pishing money down the drain paying wages for guys like Grimshaw, Sammon & Gorrin that we simply dont need. Our squad is bloated and very unbalanced. Also, another fact is that our league form in the last 11 months has been horrendous. Our brand of "football" makes your eyes bleed, were throwing points away every week and the only thing that kept us up last season was Louis Moult & Ross County (being awful), both of whom are now gone!

[star sail]

10 hours ago, steelboy said:

 

People need to get their heads round the fact that last season's Scottish Cup run was based on incredible luck. The OG against Acccies, goalie howler and OG at Dens, two goalie mistakes against Hearts, gifts from the keeper and Aranason at Hampden. 

I am trying to get my head around the fact that we got lucky against Accies, Dundee, Hearts and Aberdeen (x2).  I think Rangers were in there as well on the way to a league cup final. That certainly is a lot of luck over 540 minutes of football. Unfortunately I just can't get my head around it, which makes me think that maybe it was not so lucky after all. 

[jim64]

The most questionable aspect has been the recruitment apart from Johnson,Taylor Sinclair cover for dunne ! Sanchez gorrin!! Sammon other players like frear and main who appears a different player are not helping at all.We could all see the team was crying out for some width and pace can’t surely just have been me and now we’ve returned to hoofball.At present the rollercoaster seems on a downward spiral but at least we’re not as bad as Dundee (yet )

[mfc]

Robinson done really well last summer when he had a big rebuilding job on his hands,bringing in the likes of carson,kipre and dunne but the approach to this season was baffling,for a manager too just focus on strengthening his bench is crazy and he failed to even do that,we are no better off for having gorrin,sammon and taylor-sinclair in our squad.

[ropy]

I hope he stays for 10 years and builds 3 teams in that time and at the end brings a trophy home.

[Shaka]

10 hours ago, ropy said:

I hope he stays for 10 years and builds 3 teams in that time and at the end brings a trophy home.

I hope You get help for that Crack addiction lol

[Shaka]

The thing for Robinson is we must judge him on his league form, as thats his bread & butter. 

We seem to be able to raise our game for a one off occasion, add that to all the luck we got in the cups last year (several own goals and goals where keepers literally threw the ball in their own net) and we can be a good cup team, but lets keep in mind we made 2 finals last year and they essentially meant nothing as we got pumped in both! 

Remove the cups and we are a horrendously bad team under Robinson, just like Oldham were when he was manager. Can he turn that around? Im not so sure

[gee]

What surprises me most is Lasley’s involvement.

He captained successful Motherwell squads that were small and tight with one or two players of real quality that would make things happen. 

Given the opportunity with not really any deadwood in the squad but room for additions, after the cup final I fully expected a return to this. That excitement has gone now. 

Dundee suddenly change their manager, go on a run and it’s a big call to trust Robinson to do what’s required in a tough, tight January market to keep us safe. 

 

[Lobey_Dosser]

1 hour ago, gee said:

What surprises me most is Lasley’s involvement.

He captained successful Motherwell squads that were small and tight with one or two players of real quality that would make things happen. 

Given the opportunity with not really any deadwood in the squad but room for additions, after the cup final I fully expected a return to this. That excitement has gone now. 

Dundee suddenly change their manager, go on a run and it’s a big call to trust Robinson to do what’s required in a tough, tight January market to keep us safe. 

 

Lasley may have a say in the odd signing but he isn’t in a position to influence the transfer policy. When the club appointed Robinson and then extended his contract, they knew what they were investing in. 

Robinson is a manager who signs players with ‘character’ that are willing to work their balls off every day in training. For such a philosophy to prosper, Robinson believes in creating a competitive environment via a big squad. This has clearly worked to an extent delivering some memorable nights that were unimaginable under the McGhee malaise. Unfortunately however, many supporters find the quantity over quality approach a real turn off, particularly when it prevents a decent crop of young prospects getting anywhere near the first team. 

In some respects, Robinson’s personal traits are a fantastic fit for any provincial club but his transfer strategy doesnt fit so well, particularly for a club that is serious about attracting and retaining young talent.