Robinson... How Do We Think He's Doing ?

[mfc88]

Last week I said I'd give him another 2-3 games to convince me, but after that I change my mind. Time to go.

The system isn't working, we didn't sign the players to make it work in the summer, and just about every player is devoid of confidence. 

Thanks for last season.

[Yodo]

On 10/15/2018 at 8:20 PM, Clackscat said:

He has proved himself to operate at the level we all thought.

Sent from my SM-A320FL using Tapatalk
 

Aye two leagues above you 

[Big Wispy Flossy]

His time is up

[underboyleheating]

A change is gonna come, for if it doesn’t our proud premiership tenure will come to an end next May. 

[wellup83]

Thanks for last season Robbo but enough is enough. 

[Yassin]

2 minutes ago, underboyleheating said:

A change is gonna come, for if it doesn’t our proud premiership tenure will come to an end next May. 

You literally say this every season.

[DEWELL]

It is a sad state of affairs. I like Robinson but his time is up. He just can't get the best out of our players and the crowds are down. The fans even the happy clappers must realise that we need a change.

[underboyleheating]

2 minutes ago, Yassin said:

You literally say this every season.

I don’t think I do, however, feel free to find quotes. I will have a go at managers when it’s not working and praise them when it is. However, it’s currently not working and I don’t believe Robinson is the answer.

Do you believe Robinson is the answer to keeping us up for another season? 

[Mintymac]

That was atrocious today . Think Robinson’s ran out of ideas . Was looking for improvement this season but we’ve gone backwards . He doesn’t seem to know how to change and we only play one way . And to compound matters other teams have sussed us out . Think the end is near for Robbo . Would loved him to succeed but it ain’t happening . Never heard so much rumblings since the Malpas day’s . Today was a truly awful watch 

[Ya Bezzer!]

We have a very tough fixture list coming up after the next two against Dundee and St. Mirren.

As is well known I'm not particularly a fan of Robinson but I don't see what kind of improvement is likely from firing him given the upcoming matches.

There is no point changing the manager over the next couple of months.

Right now the change needs to come from the manager and his philosophy rather than a change of manager.

If nothing improves when we get into December then will be the time to make the change and give the incoming manager a better chance to pick up points and bring in new faces.

Bringing in a new manager to face off against Celtic twice, Aberdeen, Rangers, Hearts etc is basically chopping off the new guys legs straight from the start.

I'm afraid you wanted Robinson and now you need to take your medicine.

[Bart Verheul]

2 minutes ago, Ya Bezzer! said:

We have a very tough fixture list coming up after the next two against Dundee and St. Mirren.

As is well known I'm not particularly a fan of Robinson but I don't see what kind of improvement is likely from firing him given the upcoming matches.

There is no point changing the manager over the next couple of months.

Right now the change needs to come from the manager and his philosophy rather than a change of manager.

If nothing improves when we get into December then will be the time to make the change and give the incoming manager a better chance to pick up points and bring in new faces.

Bringing in a new manager to face off against Celtic twice, Aberdeen, Rangers, Hearts etc is basically chopping off the new guys legs straight from the start.

I'm afraid you wanted Robinson and now you need to take your medicine.

Agree with you about the fixtures being a hard start for a new guy but there's also the argument that whoever comes in could have these games as a kind of free shot and allow us the chance to modify the style of play in order for us to be readier for the so called easier games.

We may even nick the odd brucie bonus point or two along the way, but lets be honest we'll probably get pumped every week!

[steelboy]

If we sack him now they can put Lasley in and give him a points target from the next 5 games. If he gets 10+ points give him the job. If he takes less than 4 from the next two games start interviewing.

[mfc]

We were one dimensional last season but we got away with it for the most part as we were a team with a lot of new signings and everything was fresh and up until he left moult could produce a bit of magic out of nothing.this season we have been well and trully sussed by every opposition,we have next too no options from the bench,due too our shamblolic recruitment policy over the summer.we badly needed some new signings that could go straight into the first and freshen things up and help too push us on and build on what was a really good season last season.we got too 2 cup finals and sold kipre for a big sum and also keep the vast majority of last season squad but we have seriously gone backwards in such a short space of time.our home form is a real concern,one point from accies,livingston and st johnstone is simply not good enough and I wouldn't bank on us picking up many points away from home this season.for me nothing will change under robinson,he's a one trick pony, that is sticking by tactics that are failing more by each passing game,the players have been piss poor and need too take there share of the blame but right now the only obvious solution too get us out of the mess were in,is too change the manager.

[Gadgey]

On 10/19/2018 at 10:43 AM, Ya Bezzer! said:

Objectively, I don't think Robinson should be fired now or in the next two matches.

However the problem with Robinson is he has shown absolutely no scope for change, no plan B, no notion of any kind of joined up long term planning and no interest in modern or entertaining football.  It's all been percentage football and that is a problem when your win percentage is hovering just about 20%.

Robinson has to show that going forward we are going to improve and get easier on the eye and if I'm honest I don't think he has it in him and that puts into question just how much longer you stick with him. 

It's not all about the past, a big part of it is the future.  Where is Robinson taking us?  Of course, no one can predict the future but you have to look at trends, form, recurring patterns to try and judge that as best as possible.

The prospect of the rest of this season and potentially a season after that watching the same kind of football that we've watched pretty much for a whole calendar year is pretty depressing, regardless of whether we get relegated or not.

It’s not very often that I agree with Ya Bezzer but I’m now in full agreement that Robinson has been sussed by his contemporaries and by his intransigence, he has run his own course. The only discussion at board level should now be who is the best person we can afford to come and get us out of this mess,  when is the best time to make the change and how much can we afford to give him to spend in January.

As much as I like Las, he is not the answer and anyone who suggests he is, is allowing nostalgia to fuel naivety.

Any comparisons to McLean and whether Robbo would play Cooper are invalid as quite simply, we would never be able to attract or afford players like Cooper, Russell or even Craig Paterson for that matter in the current market.

All is not lost but I fear that with the current playing staff dynamic, there’s a danger it could be.

[Kmcalpin]

16 hours ago, DEWELL said:

It is a sad state of affairs. I like Robinson but his time is up. He just can't get the best out of our players and the crowds are down. The fans even the happy clappers must realise that we need a change.

Thats it for me too.  Stephen Robinson is a decent guy but I'm afraid he's run his course.  We don't have the most talented squad in the world but he plainly isn't even getting the best out of them.  Anyone at yesterday's game will have seen that they're totally devoid of confidence and more hard work won't change that.  He has stuck stubbornly with a 3-5-2 system that doesn't suit the players and which rival managers have sussed out.  Irrespective of how attractive the system might be it just isn't effective and thats the bottom line.  Now fans are starting to vote with their feet and thats never a good sign.  Try as I might I just can't see how he's going to lift the team and make the changes required. 

[grizzlyg]

3500 well fans there yesterday tells you that they are getting fed up. Robinson's interview post match just tells me he has ran out of ideas. Last season was great with the 2 finals but we haven't built on that.  Anything less than 4pts from next 2 games and its time for a change. Who we go for I have no idea. Why not ask Lambert?....he would want a bigger job but if he turned us round then big teams would call plus it would mean we would be in healthier state. Killie done that with Clarke.

[Big Stall]

14 hours ago, Gadgey said:

 

As much as I like Las, he is not the answer and anyone who suggests he is, is allowing nostalgia to fuel naivety.

 

How does anyone know if Las would ve great or shambolic?

It would certainly be a gamble giving him it.

[Yorkyred]

1 hour ago, Big Stall said:

How does anyone know if Las would ve great or shambolic?

It would certainly be a gamble giving him it.

A gamble yes, but anyone is a gamble. As before no one on here is actually able to name a stand out candidate as next manager other than those that have already failed at other clubs. 

[Gadgey]

1 hour ago, Big Stall said:

How does anyone know if Las would ve great or shambolic?

It would certainly be a gamble giving him it.

To be fair, no one outside of the club does but as you say, to appoint a club legend with no managerial  experience from within would be a gamble and given our present circumstances, a naive gamble at that.

[star sail]

19 hours ago, Gadgey said:

It’s not very often that I agree with Ya Bezzer but I’m now in full agreement that Robinson has been sussed by his contemporaries and by his intransigence, he has run his own course. The only discussion at board level should now be who is the best person we can afford to come and get us out of this mess,  when is the best time to make the change and how much can we afford to give him to spend in January.

As much as I like Las, he is not the answer and anyone who suggests he is, is allowing nostalgia to fuel naivety.

Any comparisons to McLean and whether Robbo would play Cooper are invalid as quite simply, we would never be able to attract or afford players like Cooper, Russell or even Craig Paterson for that matter in the current market.

All is not lost but I fear that with the current playing staff dynamic, there’s a danger it could be.

I don't often agree with Ya Bezzer either but I always like reading what he has to say and to be fair to him he has been flagging up the poor league performance for some time now. I was actually coming on tonight to make the point you have made about Cooper, Russell etc (you could add Tommy Coyne to that list). I think the days of attracting big names in the twilight of their careers is all but over. 

I fall into to the happy clapper camp when it comes to retaining football managers. I think the term happy clapper is misused however in the sense that the happy clappers I believe are actually the realists who know how difficult the job of a football manger is and don't go pretending that there is a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow with the next new man that roles into town.  A turn around time of about 2 years at Motherwell for a manager over the last decade shows how tough the gig is. 

For me the manager has to be given the support of the board and the fans. He has brought a professionalism to the club that has at times been missing in recent years. Those in the know say that he has taken the quality of the training sessions to a new level and it is clear that the players are fit and motivated even if things are not clicking at the moment. I think we must be careful not to confuse a lack of confidence with a lack of effort. 

Robinson's biggest crime has been the inability to replace Kipre and Moult but let's face it that was always going to be a very tough task. You can see the thinking behind bringing Johnson to the club. It has not worked out (yet) but that is the risk that every football manager takes.  

I enjoyed reading Weeyin's comments about McLean's time because it highlighted very well the lean times under McLean. Sadly I think the days of giving managers the time McLean had are long gone but it would be nice to think that Motherwell could still retain some of the spirit of the Chapman days.

For every good spell with a manager I could highlight poor spells that people tend to forget about.  McGhee's first six months at Motherwell brought some of the best football I have ever seen at Firpark. His second season (not his second spell) was poor and there was many a game of hoof ball and head tennis in that season. 

I think Robinson can ride this out and I would like to see him be given the chance. 

 

[mfc88]

1 hour ago, star sail said:

Robinson's biggest crime has been the inability to replace Kipre and Moult but let's face it that was always going to be a very tough task.

 

I see where you're coming from with a lot of your post, except have to disagree with this bit. The loss of kipre and Moult was no doubt massive, but we should have been able to deal with it a whole lot better than this.

For me his failing has been the failure to sign players to fit the system he's trying to play. As much as i hate the 352, if we are playing it, do it right! And if it's not working, a plan B.

I feel that he was so focussed on plan A working that we don't have the flexibility to implement a plan B.

Our squad is bloated with central players. We've 7 or 8 centre mids around the 1st eleven, while only 2 naturally left sided players, ATS and frear, who Robbo clearly doesn't fancy. As a result we're forced to play one of our only 2 naturally right sided players (tait and cadds) on the left. 

As much as I want plan B to be reverting to a 442 or 451 for the next game(s), I've been trying to plot out a team, but despite the plethora of midfielders and generally bloated squad, I can't get a left side I'd be confident with. (Dunne wasted at LB, IMO)

Carson

Tait aldred/hartley Dunne ATS/livingstone?

Cadds Turnbull Campbell rose frear

Main

By the sounds of things Livingstone looks the part, but I've not seen him enough myself. Would love if he was the answer but slightly discouraging that he's not been on the bench much tbh.

[MelvinBragg]

I think replacing Kipré with someone with similar quality would be difficult but a criticism would be that he's not replaced him with the same type of player. Aldred would have been an ideal replacement for Hartley but doesn't have the pace or stature of Kipré. 

Moult was always going to be difficult to replace. But we seem to have signed too many strikers who are very similar in style with the exception of Johnson who is unproven...

[Yabba's Turd]

Don't let last season's 2 cup finals cloud your judgement, last season was piss poor, we've been piss poor for a while. Whichever way you try and line our present squad up there are holes, we need to find the best fit and fast.

[Kmcalpin]

8 hours ago, MelvinBragg said:

I think replacing Kipré with someone with similar quality would be difficult but a criticism would be that he's not replaced him with the same type of player. Aldred would have been an ideal replacement for Hartley but doesn't have the pace or stature of Kipré. 

Moult was always going to be difficult to replace. But we seem to have signed too many strikers who are very similar in style with the exception of Johnson who is unproven...

Thats exactly it for me Greg.  I like Aldred but he's too similar to Hartley. We needed a towering centre back who could "body" attackers but did not sign one despite having months to plan for Kipre's inevitable departure.  And yes, you can get them on a budget (maybe not to Kiptre's standard though).  

As for our strikers, they are too similar with the exception of Johnson and Sammon.  Johnson must be our top scorer despite limited gametime and Sammon just hasn't worked out. 

I could understand these signings to some extent if we had had to sign them in a panic but Robbo had months to plan his recruitment and still got it badly wrong. 

[dinnae-punt-it]

2 hours ago, Kmcalpin said:

Thats exactly it for me Greg.  I like Aldred but he's too similar to Hartley. We needed a towering centre back who could "body" attackers but did not sign one despite having months to plan for Kipre's inevitable departure.  And yes, you can get them on a budget (maybe not to Kiptre's standard though).  

As for our strikers, they are too similar with the exception of Johnson and Sammon.  Johnson must be our top scorer despite limited gametime and Sammon just hasn't worked out. 

I could understand these signings to some extent if we had had to sign them in a panic but Robbo had months to plan his recruitment and still got it badly wrong. 

I agree to a point, but we are Motherwell; there is a big chance we didn’t get any of our first choice signing targets. We should have still done better, but it’s a delicate balance that can easily tip the wrong way with a few mistakes.