2019-20 Rebuild

[Joeboy]

I actually think our squad is a bit on the heavy side, numbers wise.

I'm not convinced that the O'Hara or Mugabi signings were particularly necessary. I'd like to have seen us have a bit of faith in Maguire, Devine and Semple to cover those positions through injury.

As much as I'm saying this having not seen them much, I'd be surprised if Ilic, Sloth or Mazinga make much of an impact. Ilic and Mazinga I reckon will see out their one year deals then float off into obscurity. Sloth is a weird one as he has a decent pedigree and a two year deal, but I think the fact we've signed O'Hara says it all.

I don't know whether a target for a top number 9 fell through, but it seems we have several of similar levels of ability. I am going to guess that Robinson had a few "top" strikers in mind that didn't come off or that he feared another McCormack by putting all of his eggs in one basket.

With any big rebuilding job we've had in the short to medium term past, there has never been a 100% success rate and I guess that will only be the case. I think our squad, perhaps without a proper quality, proven goalscorer, is well covered for most eventualities, even if carrying a wee bit of deadwood.

[sbcmfc]

1 hour ago, Joeboy said:

I actually think our squad is a bit on the heavy side, numbers wise.

I'm not convinced that the O'Hara or Mugabi signings were particularly necessary. I'd like to have seen us have a bit of faith in Maguire, Devine and Semple to cover those positions through injury.

I would agree with that. We do seem to have a lot of midfielders that we don’t really need.

[weeyin]

If we get through the winter and still think we have too many players, then fair enough. It wasn't that long ago we lost out on a top 6 place largely due to our inability to field 11 first team players in December.

If we get to February and it still feels like we have too many, it's not the worst problem in the world.

[wellwell91]

As much as I like Grimshaw he is at best a squad player never a right back in a million years

Yip we all get excited at his headless chicken runs forward but can anyone tell me of one that’s had an end product 

Tait is the best right back that we have at the club but I fear like Cadden were messing him about with continually playing him out of position to the detriment of the player 

[sbcmfc]

7 minutes ago, wellwell91 said:

As much as I like Grimshaw he is at best a squad player never a right back in a million years

Yip we all get excited at his headless chicken runs forward but can anyone tell me of one that’s had an end product 

Tait is the best right back that we have at the club but I fear like Cadden were messing him about with continually playing him out of position to the detriment of the player 

Carroll’s red card at the weekend likely means the return of Tait at LB.

Id like to see him get a run at RB, but it would be at the expense of Grimshaw who has been playing reasonably well there.

[2/6 tae get in]

35 minutes ago, wellwell91 said:

As much as I like Grimshaw he is at best a squad player never a right back in a million years

Yip we all get excited at his headless chicken runs forward but can anyone tell me of one that’s had an end product 

Tait is the best right back that we have at the club but I fear like Cadden were messing him about with continually playing him out of position to the detriment of the player 

Agree very much with this post. Tait should be a starter every week at right back. Don't know what the managers problem with him is (something behind the scenes perhaps. We will lose him at the first opportunity if we don't watch.

[dennyc]

Grimshaw might not be the best right back in the world but he has performed miles better than Tait this season. Robinson was forced to drop Tait after a string of sub standard run outs and his , admittedly short, appearance on Saturday did nothing to suggest he yet warrants a place back in the team. I  do agree Tait may well have been affected by being played out of position, usually because Robinson does not appear to trust Livingstone to cover for Carroll.

Early days, but we again appear to have made a couple of signings that appear questionable on evidence so far.....Ilic   (clearly now well behind Seedorf and Hylton and uninspiring when he has appeared), Sloth (what the hell is going on there?),  Too early to tell regarding O'Hara, Mazinga and Mugabi. Meantime youngsters such as Semple, Livingstone and MaGuire are struggling for the game time that their preseason performances merited. I would not be surprised if Ilic was released in January contract permitting. He is in danger of becoming the new Petravicious.

I also think there have been successes. particularly Polworth and Gallagher,  and Scott has come on leaps and bounds since moving further wide. Seedorf, Hylton and Carroll are perhaps performing better than we could have expected given their history and the level they previously played. Long and Cole have showed promise but need to start contributing goals. 

My main frustration is that the full back situations have still not been fully addressed. As Carroll's two red cards have brought into focus. Tait was poor for much of last season and left back has been an issue for two years. But instead we appear to have concentrated on loading up in midfield. Hopefully that does not mean Robinson has discounted David Turnbull........whose reintroduction would provide us with a fantastic set up in midfield. Turnbull and Polworth for creativity, and Campbell and Donnelly/McGuire for aggression and work rate. In front of those four I think whoever plays will score goals.

I think squad wise we are better placed than we were last season although a large part of that is due to the youngsters brought into the squad.  We certainly have the talent to play attractive football. But there are frustrations and doubts over a few. Like a few others, I guess my take on our best eleven at present changes every time I watch a game.  Perhaps six or seven definite starters? 

 

 

 

[fizoxy]

Tait missed a game due to illness, then we won 3 games in a row, and we (rightly) kept the same line up because of that. It will be interesting to see if we change anything after the loss.

Grimshaw is pretty poor in the final third, whereas Tait puts in a decent cross. Neither are that good defensively. Carroll has been pretty solid, but is guaranteed at least a yellow every game, so that needs to be fixed. Can see Tait back in at left back (Robinson was raving about grimshaw on saturday)

I’m not going to judge the players that haven’t got in the team yet, because I can’t pick anyone out of the last four games that I would have replaced beforehand. It’s hard to make an argument for anyone to drop out for either sloth or Manzinga, so they’re going to have to wait their turn, it’s a long season. Scott has adjusted well to playing wide, and as such is keeping hylton and ilic out.

[weeyin]

Tait's biggest weakness is his lack of pace. In the past, his other talents have compensated for that.

When he plays like he did against Hearts in the cup game, his lack of pace just amplifies his mistakes. (Unlike, say Dunne, who has the pace that can get him out of trouble when he screws up).

I don't know if he was injured or sick for that Hearts game, but it was one of the poorest performances I have seen from him. The fact that we won the next 3 on the bounce when he was dropped meant there was less chance of him making a come back.

 

[steelboy]

Donnelly can drop out any time for Sloth. He has sold too many goals already.

[MelvinBragg]

My take on the new signings. 

I'll hold my hands up and say that in the last few games Seedorf has somewhat changed my mind. First few games, I really couldn't see anything there. Inconsistent end product and tendency to make the wrong decision is still there but it is improving. He has time on his side. 

Hylton, first few times I saw him, thought he reminded me of Marvin Johnson. Tricky, could buy a foul and seemed to have more end product than Seedorf. I reckon he'll contribute but now not so sure of him. 

Carroll, we were all told would be rubbish. He looks solid enough to me, with decent delivery. Picking up a few cards though. Seem to remember Charles Dunne doing likewise when he arrived. He managed to remove that from his game so hopefully Carroll can do the same. Certainly our best left back since than Hammell although I admit that's a low bar to clear..

Polworth, I like. The midfield combination we have at the minute seems to be working for the most part. 

Cole and Long. Cole is a bit more physical,  and seems to me best suited to a lone striker role. Long will run the channels all day but with two wingers, we probably need someone who will stay a bit more central. 

Gallagher looks the best business we've done this summer. Strangely I think his age works in our favour. If he were 22 or 23, I reckon there would be a stampede of clubs to take him off our hands. His being that bit older might increase our chances of keeping him. Maybe..

Ilic, looks technically gifted but casual and slow to me. Maybe a mistake..

Sloth, O'Hara, Manzinga and Mugabi, time will only tell. Sloth, I'd be concerned by the fact that he's been with us since early in the summer. The others at least can argue that they need time to settle in. 

What I would also add is that the performances of Scott and Donnelly are almost like having two new signings. Both would be among the first names on the team sheet right now...

[Kmcalpin]

2 hours ago, dennyc said:

My main frustration is that the full back situations have still not been fully addressed. As Carroll's two red cards have brought into focus.

Agreed.  Am I not right in saying though that Ilic's "best" position is left back?

Quite a few fringe players like Ilic, Mazinga, Mugabe and Sloth were given a run out the reserves today. 

[fizoxy]

Illic was signed as a winger and is listed as such on our website. It was mentioned that he’d played left back before.

[Andy_P]

7 hours ago, wellwell91 said:

As much as I like Grimshaw he is at best a squad player never a right back in a million years

Yip we all get excited at his headless chicken runs forward but can anyone tell me of one that’s had an end product 

Tait is the best right back that we have at the club but I fear like Cadden were messing him about with continually playing him out of position to the detriment of the player 

Does his assist for the third goal in the Hibs game count?

I agree that Tait is the best right-back at the club but he has yet to actually show that this season. I've seen catalogue photo shoots and loads of photos of what he's up to in the gym. I haven't seen very much of the form we know he's capable of however, whilst Grimshaw has done little to deserve being dropped since he got in against Accies.

St Johnstone might have been an option for Robinson to "freshen things up" on the back of the County defeat and bring back Tait but Carroll has kinda knocked that one in the head for at least the next game so he can look forward to more "messing him about" on Saturday no doubt.

[couttsy]

11 hours ago, Andy_P said:

Does his assist for the third goal in the Hibs game count?

I agree that Tait is the best right-back at the club but he has yet to actually show that this season. I've seen catalogue photo shoots and loads of photos of what he's up to in the gym. I haven't seen very much of the form we know he's capable of however, whilst Grimshaw has done little to deserve being dropped since he got in against Accies.

St Johnstone might have been an option for Robinson to "freshen things up" on the back of the County defeat and bring back Tait but Carroll has kinda knocked that one in the head for at least the next game so he can look forward to more "messing him about" on Saturday no doubt.

Feel a bit sorry for Tait, not been at his best this season, however he’s been (too) regularly played out of position over recent months due to our complete failure to sign a competent left back. Now we have a competent LB he’s found himself dropped from the RB position to accommodate Grimshaw, who as some have pointed out is a squad player at best. When Carroll returns I have no doubt that Tait should return to first choice RB and hope Robinson agrees. 

[Kmcalpin]

There's no doubt that the full backs have, for a number of reasons, been problem positions for us.  Without upsetting the right hand side, we have no clear replacement for Carroll, when he is unavailable.  In turn this overall issue is causing problems for Gillespie and his central defenders.  We need to get it sorted asap but its not clear what the solution is. I'd be loathe to move Gallagher out of the middle.       

[wellsince75]

1 hour ago, couttsy said:

Feel a bit sorry for Tait, not been at his best this season, however he’s been (too) regularly played out of position over recent months due to our complete failure to sign a competent left back. Now we have a competent LB he’s found himself dropped from the RB position to accommodate Grimshaw, who as some have pointed out is a squad player at best. When Carroll returns I have no doubt that Tait should return to first choice RB and hope Robinson agrees. 

I'm a fan of Tait's workmate and moving forward he adds a lot to the team.

I don't believe he's a good right back. He regularly got roasted and thats when we decided to put Cadden into the position and move Tait to the left.

This for me is the heart of the issue. He's not good enough defensively to be the wing back. That said he works his nuts off and is ok going forward. He's better in front of the right/left back but this honestly feels like making the team formation fit to enable him to play.  

Long term grimmy isn't the answer either - why we don't just invest in a decent right back is lost on me. 

[steelboy]

2 hours ago, wellsince75 said:

I don't believe he's a good right back. He regularly got roasted and thats when we decided to put Cadden into the position and move Tait to the left.


We put Tait to left back because we didn't have a left back.

He was playing well at right back at the time.

[weeyin]

On 7/11/2019 at 1:16 PM, weeyin said:

Given our dearth of left backs in recent years, I'd be delighted if we had 3 to chose from. In reality, we'll have to make do with two and one will always be injured. 

I wasn't joking when I posted that in the summer.

 

[wellsince75]

1 hour ago, steelboy said:

We put Tait to left back because we didn't have a left back.

He was playing well at right back at the time.

From the games I watched he continually got caught out and several teams had him on toast, there were a few games we had to change formation during the game and drop Cadden into rightback . 

I just don't see Tait being the answer . 

[gaz7]

dont agree with this slaughtering of grimshaw. His so called headless chicken runs up the park are exactly that they get us up the park! his run other week v hibs set up hyltons goal and im sure he started the move on sat to pass to cole who then turned and created campbells goal. When players arent playing they somehow become better in some peoples eyes as they cant be judged. Tait is a better crosser of the ball than grimmy but not a better runner with the ball or as aggressive without it. I for one am more than happy with grimshaw at right back. !st goal on saturday was caused by our cdm (donnelly) being nowhere and gardyne able to run from halfwayline unapposed to our 18 yard box. If you are a cdm positional play is everything and he wasnt there. Saturday was a blip imo and reminded me of the times when we somehow managed to beat or draw with celtic from what i feel would be.. their perspective in that we were in control of the game but then some things went against us that will not happen every game i.e sending off which was debateable, bad substititions at wrong stage, good goal disallowed, penalty claim not given etc . Plus as a lot mention whenever we start believing we are favourites it in my experiences of being a well fan for 30 odd years usually goes wrong.

[superward]

 I'm a huge fan of Tait but unfortunately his pace is getting him in to trouble more often than not nowadays. Its shaded ever so slightly again over the summer. 

Not much in between Tait and Grimshaw now IMO. Both different skill sets.  Tait a better technical footballer but nowhere near as direct/fast/dynamic as Grimshaw. 

[steelboy]

The reason Grimshaw runs with the ball is because he can't pass, cross or shoot.

[superward]

Combine Tait and Grimshaw and we have an A1 right back! 

Until we can do that its going to  be a choice between technique and lack of pace vs. pace and lack of technique.

Personally I dont think Tait's technique covers up the weakness his pace now brings. Conversely Grimshaw's pace doesn't cover up what we lose in his lack of technique.

Hopefully Tait is just struggling with something hampering his pace as hes still only 29 and I'd like to see him playing for us for a couple years yet.

[sbcmfc]

3 hours ago, superward said:

Combine Tait and Grimshaw and we have an A1 right back.

I have wet dreams about the Hylton Seedorf hybrid.