Andy_P Posted May 6, 2020 Report Share Posted May 6, 2020 19 minutes ago, David said: I wouldn't imagine that you're alone in this situation. The biggest threat to our society at present isn't the actual virus itself. And the virus spreading isn't the biggest threat to Scottish football. We're supposedly heading towards 1930's great depression levels of unemployment, and the lockdown is totally fucking up the economy. And I know, every time the economy is mentioned there's always some twat who pipes up "Is the economy more important than saving lives?!?! What if it were YOU or your LOVED ONES?!? Eh? Eh?" Well, the economy tanking will likely destroy more lives over the next twenty years than the virus will. The truth is, football is fucked as it is. If we're looking for the levels of safety that medical types are wanting before we let punters into stadiums then we'd be as well calling it a day and shutting the club down for the next few years, because we're not getting to that point any time soon. Some twat? To be clear you are comfortable labelling everyone from the First Minister of Scotland to the rank and file members of the general public who have said similar through genuine immediate concerns about their loved ones as twats? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted May 6, 2020 Report Share Posted May 6, 2020 17 minutes ago, Andy_P said: Some twat? To be clear you are comfortable labelling everyone from the First Minister of Scotland to the rank and file members of the general public who have said similar through genuine immediate concerns about their loved ones as twats? The ones who use such talk as a reason for deflecting chat away from the very real issues we are going to face due to the economy tanking? Yes. If you consider an appropriate response to someone discussing the effects this situation is having on the economy, people's livelihoods, jobs, and future prospects of the nation to be "Is the economy more important than saving lives?!?!" then sadly, I do. Those with any sense would know that this isn't an either/or situation. It's not a choice between shutting ourselves away to save lives or trying to salvage the economy. There's a fine line between dealing with both, and that's where we need to be. Anyone who's familiar with the great depression and the absolute destruction it caused to people for years should be just as concerned with the economy as they are with the virus. Both go hand in hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy_P Posted May 6, 2020 Report Share Posted May 6, 2020 5 minutes ago, David said: The ones who use such talk as a reason for deflecting chat away from the very real issues we are going to face due to the economy tanking? Yes. If you consider an appropriate response to someone discussing the effects this situation is having on the economy, people's livelihoods, jobs, and future prospects of the nation to be "Is the economy more important than saving lives?!?!" then sadly, I do. Those with any sense would know that this isn't an either/or situation. It's not a choice between shutting ourselves away to save lives or trying to salvage the economy. There's a fine line between dealing with both, and that's where we need to be. Anyone who's familiar with the great depression and the absolute destruction it caused to people for years should be just as concerned with the economy as they are with the virus. Both go hand in hand. Can you be specific on who you consider is using such chat to deflect away from the issues? Who are "the ones" you refer to? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted May 6, 2020 Report Share Posted May 6, 2020 Just now, Andy_P said: Can you be specific on who you consider is using such chat to deflect away from the issues? Who are "the ones" you refer to? They can be found everywhere at the moment. Social media, primarily. They're usually found with little banners on their profile pictures, and using NHS hashtags. To be clear, I'm not downplaying the effects of the virus, or saying we shouldn't be concerned about our loved ones. Again, this is what I'm talking about when I mean the "either/or" approach. Unless you're using a banner, hashtags, and focusing on one aspect of the discussion you're seen as opposing this part of it. It's like the other day on here, I dared to mention the Swedish approach. No one knows if that kind of tactic will work long-term, but it's another way of going about things. Another option. No sooner had I mentioned it than someone replied with some pish talking about injecting bleach. It was assumed that by not taking the "stay indoors, save lives" approach that I was vehemently against it. I'm not, I'm just looking at other options and ways other nations are dealing with the situation. We need to look at all facets of the situation. Like it or not, the economy matters. The effects of a depression of this magnitude is well documented from the 30's. At some point the furlough money is going to run out. We can't keep paying out that kind of dough while there isn't enough businesses paying taxes to support it. It's not going to work. So we need to move on from only looking at one aspect of the situation and start taking into account that measures need to be taken, in the safest way possible, to get things moving again. No approach is ever going to be completely safe. We'll never get to that stage. It's the same with football. If we're looking for a safety level akin to that which was enjoyed before this all happened then we'd be as well packing it in, and shutting clubs down entirely for a few years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy_P Posted May 6, 2020 Report Share Posted May 6, 2020 5 hours ago, David said: They can be found everywhere at the moment. Social media, primarily. They're usually found with little banners on their profile pictures, and using NHS hashtags. To be clear, I'm not downplaying the effects of the virus, or saying we shouldn't be concerned about our loved ones. Again, this is what I'm talking about when I mean the "either/or" approach. Unless you're using a banner, hashtags, and focusing on one aspect of the discussion you're seen as opposing this part of it. It's like the other day on here, I dared to mention the Swedish approach. No one knows if that kind of tactic will work long-term, but it's another way of going about things. Another option. No sooner had I mentioned it than someone replied with some pish talking about injecting bleach. It was assumed that by not taking the "stay indoors, save lives" approach that I was vehemently against it. I'm not, I'm just looking at other options and ways other nations are dealing with the situation. We need to look at all facets of the situation. Like it or not, the economy matters. The effects of a depression of this magnitude is well documented from the 30's. At some point the furlough money is going to run out. We can't keep paying out that kind of dough while there isn't enough businesses paying taxes to support it. It's not going to work. So we need to move on from only looking at one aspect of the situation and start taking into account that measures need to be taken, in the safest way possible, to get things moving again. No approach is ever going to be completely safe. We'll never get to that stage. It's the same with football. If we're looking for a safety level akin to that which was enjoyed before this all happened then we'd be as well packing it in, and shutting clubs down entirely for a few years. Thanks for the clarification. I have to admit if there are those deflecting I'm not picking up on it. They do say your social media accounts become something of an echo chamber so it is entirely possible that view just isn't one reflected in the accounts I follow and the views expressed. I see plenty of people making reasoned arguments that we make moves to restart sooner, plenty of people making reasoned arguments that move to restart later. I don't see anyone trying to hid from the issue however. From my own perspective I don't think it unreasonable to consider how we move on, short, medium and long term in all facets of life economy included. An appreciation is required that such considerations are however going to come at different times for different people. That's going to vary markedly from someone in Government tasked with kick-starting "normality" to someone quite content to be picking up 80% of their salary sitting in the sun; from someone who has lost their job as a consequence of the financial issues to someone who is providing care at first hand. I will have a preference on what route to the "new normal" I think is best of course but I don't have any issue with anyone expressing various approaches even if I don't agree with them, your own view included. What I did however take issue with your initial remark that folk are twats for suggesting that saving lives is more important than the economy. Frankly that came across as callous and cretinous and in my view added nothing to your argument. You've provided clarification but I would suggest it was a poor choice of phrase and your point could have been made equally well without it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kmcalpin Posted May 6, 2020 Report Share Posted May 6, 2020 2 hours ago, steelboy said: There have been less than 700 Covid deaths of u45s in the UK (and only 2 u16s). Given the size of the u45 population the risk is effectively zero for those without underlying conditions. These are tiny numbers despite millions of people still being at work and no strict lockdown. It is very low admittedly but its not effectively zero as you put it, and certainly not for those fatally affected. However although many of those under 45 may not be fatally affected by the virus they can be carriers and that must not be ignored. In this case I'm quite happy to leave such decisions to informed politicians, advised by scientists and medical experts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stv Posted May 6, 2020 Report Share Posted May 6, 2020 4 hours ago, Kmcalpin said: 4 hours ago, Kmcalpin said: It is very low admittedly but its not effectively zero as you put it, and certainly not for those fatally affected. However although many of those under 45 may not be fatally affected by the virus they can be carriers and that must not be ignored. In this case I'm quite happy to leave such decisions to informed politicians, advised by scientists and medical experts. Leave it to the informed and the experts on this forum , cmon be realtstic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toxteth O'Grady Posted May 25, 2020 Report Share Posted May 25, 2020 https://www.motherwellfc.co.uk/2020/05/25/our-season-ticket-pledge-to-you/ OUR SEASON TICKET PLEDGE TO YOU 14:03 Our season ticket pledge to you We’re pledging that everyone who buys a season ticket for 2020/21 will get the full value of their purchase. Almost 1,800 of you have already got your tickets for the campaign, far surpassing sales figures at this stage in normal years. We understand that there is still no clarity over when football will resume for us, nor any prediction over when supporters will be able to attend matches again. With that in mind, we will guarantee everyone who purchases, or has already purchased, a season ticket for 2020/21 will get the chance to attend 19 home league matches, whenever that is possible. If that is not possible in 2020/21, we will offer you the chance to claim the credit value of the missing games back. This can either be used against the value of your season ticket for 2021/22, or if you don’t renew next year, you can claim the equivalent number of match tickets for games in 2021/22. If matches are initially played behind closed doors, we pledge that you will not be adversely impacted. For example, if five matches are played behind closed doors in 2020/21, you can choose to either have the value of those matches deducted from your season ticket cost for 2021/22, or we will give you the equivalent amount of match tickets for games in that season. Everyone who buys a new season ticket will also be given free entry to our first UEFA Europa League match. Our Early Bird discount period on 2020/21 season tickets is available until 31 May. Don’t miss out. To buy, please use our online purchasing service at tickets.motherwellfc.co.uk if you can. You can also call us between 10am and 3pm, Monday to Friday, on 01698 333333. “Fans have responded brilliantly to buy season tickets so far, despite there being uncertainty over when Fir Park will be open again to watch football,” chief executive Alan Burrows said. “Although that situation hasn’t changed, we hope that this guarantee will encourage other supporters to now commit to buying for 2020/21, and help the club prepare for what lies ahead. “If you can afford to do so, please buy your season ticket now.” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ropy Posted May 25, 2020 Report Share Posted May 25, 2020 Just realised that we won’t be going to Stranraer etc in the BetFred (if it is played), sort of disappointed, it will need to be Albania rather than Albion Rovers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weeyin Posted May 25, 2020 Report Share Posted May 25, 2020 1 minute ago, ropy said: Just realised that we won’t be going to Stranraer etc in the BetFred (if it is played), sort of disappointed, it will need to be Albania rather than Albion Rovers. Knowing our luck they will make the qualifiers regional and consist of a game against The New Saints. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ropy Posted May 25, 2020 Report Share Posted May 25, 2020 That would do if we are allowed to go 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wellowell Posted May 25, 2020 Report Share Posted May 25, 2020 Would prefer that not sure about going on a plane for the next few months Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weeyin Posted May 25, 2020 Report Share Posted May 25, 2020 1 hour ago, wellowell said: Would prefer that not sure about going on a plane for the next few months Apart from the mandatory 14 day self-quarantine for crossing the border, it sounds grand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewarkfanclub Posted May 25, 2020 Report Share Posted May 25, 2020 Well done to the club again for responding to the concerns raised by fans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stv Posted May 25, 2020 Report Share Posted May 25, 2020 Do we get a credit for the games missed on last seasons tickets ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelvinBragg Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 Good gesture by the club but not an offer I'll be taking up. I bought a season ticket for two reasons. I could afford to and I wanted to try and help make sure that there is a club to go back to when we are allowed back to watch football... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ropy Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 9 hours ago, stv said: Do we get a credit for the games missed on last seasons tickets ? If you want money back for this season you should contact the club directly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkyred Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 1 hour ago, MelvinBragg said: Good gesture by the club but not an offer I'll be taking up. I bought a season ticket for two reasons. I could afford to and I wanted to try and help make sure that there is a club to go back to when we are allowed back to watch football... Agreed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumpy Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 10 hours ago, MelvinBragg said: Good gesture by the club but not an offer I'll be taking up. I bought a season ticket for two reasons. I could afford to and I wanted to try and help make sure that there is a club to go back to when we are allowed back to watch football... 8 hours ago, Yorkyred said: Agreed Me three Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stv Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 11 hours ago, ropy said: If you want money back for this season you should contact the club directly Iv had a season ticket for 35 years. Was just askin if anyone knew. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superward Posted May 27, 2020 Report Share Posted May 27, 2020 20 hours ago, grumpy said: Me three Fours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weeyin Posted May 27, 2020 Report Share Posted May 27, 2020 18 hours ago, stv said: Iv had a season ticket for 35 years. Was just askin if anyone knew. I can only speak for myself, but I had no idea you'd had a season ticket for 35 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Great Balls of Shire Posted May 27, 2020 Report Share Posted May 27, 2020 On 5/6/2020 at 11:50 AM, David said: They can be found everywhere at the moment. Social media, primarily. They're usually found with little banners on their profile pictures, and using NHS hashtags. To be clear, I'm not downplaying the effects of the virus, or saying we shouldn't be concerned about our loved ones. Again, this is what I'm talking about when I mean the "either/or" approach. Unless you're using a banner, hashtags, and focusing on one aspect of the discussion you're seen as opposing this part of it. It's like the other day on here, I dared to mention the Swedish approach. No one knows if that kind of tactic will work long-term, but it's another way of going about things. Another option. No sooner had I mentioned it than someone replied with some pish talking about injecting bleach. It was assumed that by not taking the "stay indoors, save lives" approach that I was vehemently against it. I'm not, I'm just looking at other options and ways other nations are dealing with the situation. We need to look at all facets of the situation. Like it or not, the economy matters. The effects of a depression of this magnitude is well documented from the 30's. At some point the furlough money is going to run out. We can't keep paying out that kind of dough while there isn't enough businesses paying taxes to support it. It's not going to work. So we need to move on from only looking at one aspect of the situation and start taking into account that measures need to be taken, in the safest way possible, to get things moving again. No approach is ever going to be completely safe. We'll never get to that stage. It's the same with football. If we're looking for a safety level akin to that which was enjoyed before this all happened then we'd be as well packing it in, and shutting clubs down entirely for a few years. Wouldn’t want to be in any of the leaders shoes at the minute but The Scot Gov and the UK gov, in particular won’t be the gold standard in terms of dealing with a pandemic. There is going to be major collateral damage from this, some of it may have already surfaced but when people are being laid off , left right and centre , after employers have to pay half the furlough , it will begin to bite. The lockdown approach can’t continue indefinitely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ropy Posted May 27, 2020 Report Share Posted May 27, 2020 4 hours ago, weeyin said: I can only speak for myself, but I had no idea you'd had a season ticket for 35 years. It will be out of date now 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted May 28, 2020 Report Share Posted May 28, 2020 On 5/27/2020 at 3:54 PM, Great Balls of Shire said: Wouldn’t want to be in any of the leaders shoes at the minute but The Scot Gov and the UK gov, in particular won’t be the gold standard in terms of dealing with a pandemic. There is going to be major collateral damage from this, some of it may have already surfaced but when people are being laid off , left right and centre , after employers have to pay half the furlough , it will begin to bite. The lockdown approach can’t continue indefinitely. That's my fears as well. I'm seeing plenty of people on social media enjoying being told to stay home and sunbathe in the garden, but the last time I checked a tan don't pay the mortgage. There's tough times ahead for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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