Motherwell v Dundee 28/08/21

[Toxteth O'Grady]

Here's a moan.

I could have sworn that as part of the stadium improvements last season, we were told that the kiosks were being upgraded so they would accept card payments. 

I deliberately didn't take any cash today because I assumed I could use my card. But on a roasting hot day, when my son could really have done with a soft drink, we discovered that the Hunter Stand kiosks were cash only.

I don't remember this being mentioned in the match previews on the official website.

[wellup83]

1 hour ago, Yodo said:

Home win so box ticked good three points but the performance was shocking . No creativity coming from the midfield the three that started were miles of the pace must do better 

Is it all the performance of the 3 mids or is there an element of them being outnumbered and overrun? Could a  3 5 2 not be the answer? 

[Spiderpig]

21 minutes ago, Well-Made said:

 

Suppose we did the important stuff but boy, did we give Dundee to much space and time on the ball. Adam then McGowan looked almost Messi-esque. Sooner we get back to closing down from the from front the better. We cannot give teams that much space on the ball, especially when we seem to find them with more of our passes than our own players.

Thanks God we have Liam Kelly at one end and Tony Watt at the other.

 

 

 

 

 

Yes Dundee had a fair bit of possession but they done nothing constructive with it everything went sideways, when Adams went off they had no idea what to do with the ball, and as for Kelly, he never had one non comfortable save to make all game.  

To be honest the game was poor only 1 decent chance for each team, we took ours and then defended well to see the game out, but in all honesty Dundee never really seriously threatened.

[Spiderpig]

1 minute ago, Toxteth O'Grady said:

Here's a moan.

I could have sworn that as part of the stadium improvements last season, we were told that the kiosks were being upgraded so they would accept card payments. 

I deliberately didn't take any cash today because I assumed I could use my card. But on a roasting hot day, when my son could really have done with a soft drink, we discovered that the Hunter Stand kiosks were cash only.

I don't remember this being mentioned in the match previews on the official website.

No diet coke on offer in the POD, none in the entire stadium apparently, so full fat  or nothing, 2 mins before half time and they were running short on pies as well so improvements are still required.

I used cash so not sure if they were taking card payments,  but I never saw anyone using a card so I suspect  it was cash only.

[C&A not the shop]

We were never really under the cosh but I was very nervy every time they had the ball in our half. 

Lamie had a couple of mistakes but apart from that he was solid and Grimshaw gave plenty of energy and drive.  For two players that were given a hard time by a lot on here they were among our better players the day.

 

[texanwellfan]

The short glimpse of Goss, looks like he might be handy signing. Would like to see Van Veen start next game. Decent start to the season points wise but still not convinced by us playing 4-3-3. Would be nice to see us play some football…… and keep picking up points as well

[Ya Bezzer!]

40 minutes ago, C&A not the shop said:

We were never really under the cosh but I was very nervy every time they had the ball in our half. 

Lamie had a couple of mistakes but apart from that he was solid and Grimshaw gave plenty of energy and drive.  For two players that were given a hard time by a lot on here they were among our better players the day.

 

Grimshaw gave the ball away time, after time after time.  

To be fair so did O'Hara but that's no star on Grimshaw's report.

We have a team that is almost completely bereft of any technical ability.  I'm not going to judge some of the newer player right now but on todays performance it was pretty much Kelly, Watt and 9 fit lads.  None of them were footballers.  

[Yorkyred]

A pretty poor game in truth with plenty of misplaced passes and not a great amount of composure, Adams going off a major blow for Dundee. For all their possession other than a couple of attempts including hitting the bar a felt a draw would probably have been a fair result. I think as others have said we really need to now be thinking of a consistent   formation moving forwards, I don’t think it worked today with Bevis out wide right and the three up front having little cohesion, still a lot of work to do in midfield. Of the new guys I’m not convinced by Woolery who does not look to excel in any particular area, Van Veen certainly has qualities if he stays fit, Amaluzor put himself about but I would have preferred Roberts if available. Slattery will be fine moving forward and I feel the same way about Ojala who is strong but needs time to settle down. Of last seasons team Watt was outstanding, a level above most other players on the pitch and Kelly again very solid. Credit to Lamie who was again one of our best players on the day, very solid. Grimmy  was Grimmy, plenty of effort but his distribution was all over the place and Carroll again showed his plus and minus strengths, powerful and quick moving forward but defensively weak at time with poor awareness and yet again a poorly time tackle ( I was too far away to see if it was a red or not). Still players to come in and a work in progress, I’m still fairly optimistic for the season.

[andalg]

I thought we won today and were sitting fourth in the table above Celtic and Rangers ?  Must have been another Motherwell as it appears this one isn't very good 

[Walker86]

More welcome points on the board. Not a great performance by any means but encouraging that we can grind out results whilst new players are bedding in and some returning from injury etc.  

I thought Ojala, Lamie (bar one error with Cummings) Slattery and Watt all had good games. O'Hara was very rusty. Moving forward I don't see Woolery or Justin as starters more impact players as we have to start with Van Veen and Watt.....a good combination of skill and hold up play. Van Veen is up to all kinds of shithousery which we have lacked in the team for too long!

Lots that can improve but a decent start.

[mfc]

It was far from pretty but we're grinding out results and that's the main thing.itll be interesting how we line up at the back when the norwegian boy arrives but we really need another option up front,woolery,Justin and shields look like there going to need time to adjust,van veen has shown in glimpses what he can offer but needs to be starting games.if we can bring in a half decent attacker and build on the opening games then we will be just fine.

[stv]

Great start to season, couldnt expect much better with a new team. But by feck some folk are never happy .  Play great n loose , play shite n win , iether way some folk are never happy. I would rather watch a winning team.

[KirkySuperSub]

Agree that "Alexanderball" certainly doesn't appear to be the most exciting I've seen in my time watching 'Well, but going back to where we were when he came in, we were on a one way ticket to the Championship, for God knows how long.

He steered us in the right direction away from that, and so far, he has, by hook or by crook, utterly shit-fested 7 points from 12.

Is he the long-term, frankly I doubt it, but so far, we're in a better place than we were this time last year.

Christ knows the position we would be in had Robbo still been here...but I'm confident we wouldn't even be debating the merits of a wanky three points gained against Dundee, given we would've passed them by on the way down / up.

[davkel]

Serious question....does anyone know what style of play we are trying to implement ?? ...  

My mate was watching us for Ross County today and we had a long conversation about what we are trying to do and we can’t work it out..

The defenders we have cannot play out from the back and resort to punts up the park

The midfield today were totally missing ...strange to come on here and see people saying that Slattery was good and O’Hara had a good game ..really !!... both were a mile off the pace...in fact the guy sitting next to me said he thought Slattery must have had a good night out last night ..he was that poor.

The front 3 are so isolated week in week out ....nobody links anything from midfield to front ...

One other point we talked about was how bad we were at the basics ...first touch was a joke from quite a few and how many players looked at least a yard off the pace compared to the Dundee guys..

But .....after saying all that , we won 1-0 ....work that one out ....it’s a funny old game !!!!

 

 

[weeyin]

5 minutes ago, davkel said:

Serious question....does anyone know what style of play we are trying to implement ?? ...

I think GA has an idea, but with so many new players, injuries, illnesses, unfit personnel it's been difficult to put it in action. I doubt today's starting lineup is his first choice.

The positive is that we've been picking up points while we try and put it together. Arguably, our best performance was the game we lost. Fitba' eh?

[KirkySuperSub]

Must have something about him if Gary Neville regrets getting shot of him...wonder of GA would've lasted longer at Valencia...?!

[wellsince75]

47 minutes ago, davkel said:

Serious question....does anyone know what style of play we are trying to implement ?? ...  

GA got us out of relegation and learned to grind out results - so we have resilience.

I don't mind winning ugly but I don't find our play entertaining,  it's not clear what style of play we're going for - other than the determined view that a 433 is the formation we should play.

To be honest I really dislike our approach, pre season we looked poor against teams from 2 leagues lower than us. We can't pass , we have 40% possessions to piss poor teams like Dundee, Livingston.  

If we continue to give up  possession, allow teams to have so many shots on goal we'll lose more than we'll win. Suspect we'll be somewhere between 7-10th in the league unless GA builds upon what we have and start playing some football. 

The frustrating thing is we could well be pushing for top 6 if we changed formation and drop this 3 interchangeable players up front.  We have no decent wide men . 
 

PS - this isn't moaning about how we're winning. I'm delighted with the points we have but we need to build and move beyond the current approach. 

[MFCL84]

2 hours ago, Ya Bezzer! said:

We have a team that is almost completely bereft of any technical ability.  I'm not going to judge some of the newer player right now but on todays performance it was pretty much Kelly, Watt and 9 fit lads.  None of them were footballers.  

I have to agree. We seem unable to see make a pass, unable to make space, unable to move , unable to play as a team.

However, how much of the problems stem from a rigid 4-3-3? We consistently allowed Dundee to play through and between our lines; we were seemingly over-run in midfield.

[Ya Bezzer!]

18 minutes ago, KirkySuperSub said:

Agree that "Alexanderball" certainly doesn't appear to be the most exciting I've seen in my time watching 'Well, but going back to where we were when he came in, we were on a one way ticket to the Championship, for God knows how long.

He steered us in the right direction away from that, and so far, he has, by hook or by crook, utterly shit-fested 7 points from 12.

Is he the long-term, frankly I doubt it, but so far, we're in a better place than we were this time last year.

Christ knows the position we would be in had Robbo still been here...but I'm confident we wouldn't even be debating the merits of a wanky three points gained against Dundee, given we would've passed them by on the way down / up.

I defended Alexander last season because he inherited a shambles and he had one job to do and that was keep us up.

He's had a transfer window now though and I have to say I wasn't really impressed with the new guys he's brought in.

I do think you need to let a team bed in though so come November/December that'll be when you really come to a conclusion but honestly I didn't see a lot of ability out there.  

You'd hope we'd be better with van Veen and Goss as starters but let's be honest we are scoring off set plays and that's about the sum of it.

 

 

[Kmcalpin]

1 hour ago, weeyin said:

I think GA has an idea, but with so many new players, injuries, illnesses, unfit personnel it's been difficult to put it in action. I doubt today's starting lineup is his first choice.

The positive is that we've been picking up points while we try and put it together.

Thats it for me.

At the moment, we don't have a complete squad to choose from, with probably another bodies to come in before Tuesday night.  Our 2 right backs are injured and other players like Van Veen, Shields, Donnelly, O'Hara and Grimshaw are still recovering or night fully fit. New players are still settling in and yet to gel.

We ground out the win today. Not great football to entertain us but we did show some really nice attacking moves in flashes.  I thought that Kelly, Lamie, Ojala, Slattery and Watt were our best players. Goss although not matchfit looks to be useful. We haven't yet got the midfield balance right but I'd say that Grimshaw and O'Hara don't look comfortable in the same midfield. The strikers didn't gel, and although Watt played very well, he's not an out and out striker, but had to play in that role because of circumstances. 

As to the game itself, Dundee must consider themselves unlucky not to take a point but although they had loads of possession they were toothless up front and lacked creativity, especially after Adam retired. The game hinged on a handful of incidents - when Dundee hit the bar; Adam's injury - they weren't the same after he went off; Watt's goal; and Carroll's red card.  For the first 20 minutes or so Dundee dominated and whether it was down to our midfielders playing poorly or being outnumbered I don't know. They clearly saw Mugabi as being our weak link as they tried to pressurise him early doors. We saw the game out well although I don't like to see us defend so narrowly.

I thought that Willie Collum was very inconsistent and let Dundee players off for a series of bookable offences and it was always odds on he'd cards one of our lads first. When Van Veen's name went into the book you just knew that more would follow. I haven't seen Carroll's challenge yet but will do so later. Certainly Collum acted straight away without even taking time to think so you'd hope he had a close up and clear view of the incident. 

Great to be back at Fir Park today catching up with old friends and meeting new ones like Yorkyred.      

[MFCL84]

At the time I didn't think that Carroll's challenge was anything but a good tackle, however having seen it on TV earlier, I think that the ref actually got it right. A yellow may have done, but in today's football where tackles seem to be outlawed, but shirt tugging and wrestling in the box are accepted, it is no surprise that it was red.

[real dosser]

Dave

Collum gave the red decision straight away but I don't think he should have. I was sitting directly behind Collum in line with the tackle and there are at least 3 players between him and the tackle. There is no way he had a clear enough view to give a red card from his position. Did the linesman put his flag up?? I don't think he did and he was looking directly at the tackle with nobody blocking his view. 

As per usual it was the Collum show. He even warned Kelly for time wasting with 5 minutes of the first half to go.  He is an absolute bombscare of a referee. 

[Kat]

22 minutes ago, real dosser said:

As per usual it was the Collum show. He even warned Kelly for time wasting with 5 minutes of the first half to go.  He is an absolute bombscare of a referee. 

I had mentioned that earlier in the thread, I think it was McGowan that booted the ball away when we had a free kick just outside our box and Collum was getting on Kelly's back for not getting on with the game when he just witnessed what happened. 

Having seen the reply on Sportscene earlier you do see Carroll connect with the Dundee boys shin after clearing the ball but you have to watch it in super slow mo to catch it, I think Collum just showed a red for what he perceived was a reckless lunge. 

Whether he was right or wrong in this instance it has to be said he is such a poor referee, you could pluck loads of incidents out of the match today but there were three or four times we broke forward only for Watt and Amaluzor to be cynically fouled that would merit a yellow card every day of the week. 

Despite the performance it was great getting the three points, we have some unbeaten run against Dundee in League games, and in recent times we have managed to beat them on a few occasions with ten men. 

[SteelmaninOZ]

And the gaffer said 

 

[mfc]

Having seen the tackle back,there's one of the camera angles that it does look to be a poor challenge by carroll but there's no way collum could have seen it as there was atleast three players between him and the incident,I was in the hunter and pretty much in line with the linesman who never put his flag up and it's not like the dundee players were going mad at the tackle so fuck knows what collum made his decision on.hes a shocker of a referee that does seem to like being the centre of attention in every game he's involved in.