2022/23 ins & outs discussion

[joewarkfanclub]

1 hour ago, Onthefringes said:

Well aware of current run of form. However our average players are being deployed is for another debate.

Rumours abound? Not one has been credible and certainly not substantive. Players being omitted and voicing displeasure is phenomena? Criticising Alexander would see offenders banished - how do all these players make matchday squads? I’d discount a few theories on here for sure.

Wait till Kelly goes in the summer, incandescent with rage will be the order of the day on here.

Im never sure whether your replies are based on reliable information or hypotheticals.

FWIW, I was genuinely surprised that we were able to get Kelly on a permanent contract at all. So I would surmise there must have been some wheeling and dealing done to secure his signature.

I personally wouldnt have any ill feeling towards Kelly or the club if he moves on, particularly if we were to secure a fee for doing so. However, given my previous comment it wouldnt surprise me if there is a deal where a significant part of the fee goes to him as the sweetener for his original signature.

I will be very disappointed to see him go, but it will happen at some point. Its just the way it is for clubs like ours.

[I'll*no*be*back]

22 minutes ago, joewarkfanclub said:

Im never sure whether your replies are based on reliable information or hypotheticals.

FWIW, I was genuinely surprised that we were able to get Kelly on a permanent contract at all. So I would surmise there must have been some wheeling and dealing done to secure his signature.

I personally wouldnt have any ill feeling towards Kelly or the club if he moves on, particularly if we were to secure a fee for doing so. However, given my previous comment it wouldnt surprise me if there is a deal where a significant part of the fee goes to him as the sweetener for his original signature.

I will be very disappointed to see him go, but it will happen at some point. Its just the way it is for clubs like ours.

Wouldnt want to lose Kelly but he goes into his last year next summer if a big offer comes in we need to take it. 

[Yorkyred]

2 hours ago, joewarkfanclub said:

We play in a league full of average players. 

Right now our average players havent won in 11 games, including home games v Ross County and Dundee.

Our problem isnt our average players. Its how they are being deployed. 

The fact that rumours abound about some of our better average players being benched for speaking truth to the manager would indicate there is indeed a problem.

Of course you may know more, would be generally interested to hear your thoughts.

I’m not convinced rumours really indicate there is a problem. People making things up is really just people making things up. Now if we had credible evidence there was a problem between the manager and a group of players that would be a different matter.

[mfc]

9 minutes ago, Yorkyred said:

I’m not convinced rumours really indicate there is a problem. People making things up is really just people making things up. Now if we had credible evidence there was a problem between the manager and a group of players that would be a different matter.

I agree with that.its probably the same at any club,after a few bad results the rumours start that theres problems behind the scenes and the manager has lost the dressing room etc.weve had it with managers in the past and the only one I can think of was jim gannon.there doesn't seem to be a great feeling around the club the now but when is there when the results have been as bad as we have been getting lately.

[Spiderpig]

Possible interest from Portsmouth for Calum Slattery , is he out of contract at the end of the season?

https://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/football/portsmouth-fc/the-11-scottish-premiership-rising-stars-portsmouth-could-target-in-the-summer-including-motherwell-livingston-hearts-and-st-johnstone-aces-3622438

[joewarkfanclub]

4 hours ago, Yorkyred said:

I’m not convinced rumours really indicate there is a problem. People making things up is really just people making things up. Now if we had credible evidence there was a problem between the manager and a group of players that would be a different matter.

They may not indicate anything. But the inexplicable benching of our most competent midfielder and other extremely strange team selections dont do anything to dampen the fire. 

The veil of secrecy that GA also throws around the injury status of players is also very frustrating. I get that he doesnt want to hand opponents an advantage, but if fans dont understand whats going on with the squad its not surprising they jump to their own conclusions.

Part of the frustration is, that as a fan owned club, we have been used to unfettered access to information on players and all matters associated with the club, that this new approach feels foreign to us.

[Kmcalpin]

1 hour ago, Spiderpig said:

Possible interest from Portsmouth for Calum Slattery , is he out of contract at the end of the season?

https://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/football/portsmouth-fc/the-11-scottish-premiership-rising-stars-portsmouth-could-target-in-the-summer-including-motherwell-livingston-hearts-and-st-johnstone-aces-3622438

He's on a 3 year deal Allan.

[fizoxy]

Possible interest from Portsmouth for Calum Slattery , is he out of contract at the end of the season?
https://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/football/portsmouth-fc/the-11-scottish-premiership-rising-stars-portsmouth-could-target-in-the-summer-including-motherwell-livingston-hearts-and-st-johnstone-aces-3622438

That's some list. Did they nick GAs tombola for it? Looks like they just picked a random player from each non-OF team. Amazing that they decided on Iacovitti from County.

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[Kmac]

12 hours ago, I'll*no*be*back said:

Wouldnt want to lose Kelly but he goes into his last year next summer if a big offer comes in we need to take it. 

Why do we need to take it? We've just posted record profits

[Onthefringes]

7 hours ago, joewarkfanclub said:

They may not indicate anything. But the inexplicable benching of our most competent midfielder and other extremely strange team selections dont do anything to dampen the fire. 

The veil of secrecy that GA also throws around the injury status of players is also very frustrating. I get that he doesnt want to hand opponents an advantage, but if fans dont understand whats going on with the squad its not surprising they jump to their own conclusions.

Part of the frustration is, that as a fan owned club, we have been used to unfettered access to information on players and all matters associated with the club, that this new approach feels foreign to us.

Inexplicable benching was discussed publicly by the manager, it was protecting the player himself on demands of 90 minutes week by week physically and mentally amid a rising disciplinary points total. All said & done, it’s a step up from development football in England. Reluctantly have to take that at face value. Do I agree? Like many, I don’t. Telling a 23 year old he can’t be playing each week in Scotland given his background & previous appearances doesn’t sit right - add in the performances of others selected ahead of him & it’s clear this particular train of thought should have stopped weeks ago. I was more concerned he stated another player was first pick when fit.

Veil of secrecy? Think you answered your own frustrations. As for fans understanding, if some of the takes on here are anything to go by, Alexander discussing in a one to one still wouldn’t register.

This unfettered access? It’s the reason why information has become scarce. I’ve seen some stuff trotted out with reference to ‘fan owned club’ in a quest for titbits lately - it’s high time some realise subs upwards if £5 a month don’t mean you have open access to how the club operates. I’d wager those at other clubs around us Hearts & St Mirren for example, don’t even get a similar insight to their clubs.

[Onthefringes]

22 minutes ago, Kmac said:

Why do we need to take it? We've just posted record profits

Right to ask the question, but, business model and longevity of the club will decree. The optimum to sell may well be this summer?

Good keepers are plentiful South of the border - it’s how we never realised financial potential on Randolph, Gillespie & Carson. Good recruitment would soften any blow and not foist a Craig Samson upon us.

[Kmac]

40 minutes ago, Onthefringes said:

Right to ask the question, but, business model and longevity of the club will decree. The optimum to sell may well be this summer?

Good keepers are plentiful South of the border - it’s how we never realised financial potential on Randolph, Gillespie & Carson. Good recruitment would soften any blow and not foist a Craig Samson upon us.

But again, why would we sell? He's undoubtedly the most talented player in the squad - his passing actually puts some of our outfield players to shame. Business model or not, having 11 players on par with Nathan Mcginley next season gives me the fear and the boke in equal measures. 

[Onthefringes]

19 minutes ago, Kmac said:

But again, why would we sell? He's undoubtedly the most talented player in the squad - his passing actually puts some of our outfield players to shame. Business model or not, having 11 players on par with Nathan Mcginley next season gives me the fear and the boke in equal measures. 

But again, the optimum time to sell may be this summer. If some think he wasn’t brought to the club to sell on they’re not reading the room. Sweating the assets is what we do.

11 players on a par with Nathan McGinley will give everybody the fear - that’s another debate.

[I'll*no*be*back]

8 hours ago, Kmac said:

Why do we need to take it? We've just posted record profits

The club doesn't run on fresh air.  The record profits pay for the biggest squad we've had in years. We have paid transfer fees and the money we generate out with transfers does not cover the day to day running of the club. By 2023 comes there will be a big dent in those profits. 

[David]

On 3/23/2022 at 2:20 PM, dennyc said:

Hands up. I was delighted and excited when Alexander got the job ahead of the likes of Wright and Hughes. I was wrong. 

Really? You think you were wrong to want Alexander over Wright, who was sacked after less than a year with Kilmarnock, who he had taken to 5th in the Championship? Or over John Hughes who's currently manager of 9th in the Championship Dunfermline?

On 3/23/2022 at 7:22 PM, I'll*no*be*back said:

Wouldnt want to lose Kelly but he goes into his last year next summer if a big offer comes in we need to take it. 

I think it depends on where the big offer comes from. He was sitting on what was most likely a nice contract down south at QPR which was set to run until June 2023 but chose to leave that behind and return to Scotland with us. 

I have a feeling he may not be overly keen to return down south perhaps? It would be interesting to see how that plays out, but I wouldn't be surprised in the slightest if he signs an extension with us. He seems to be enjoying his football here.

[steelman1991]

He seems to be enjoying his football here.

FFS he must be the only one enjoying this shitfest


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[dennyc]

Apologies, bad wording on my part. To clarify,  I did not want Wright or Hughes to be appointed in preference to Alexander (or at all) and as such was delighted and exited by his appointment instead of either of those two. My excitement and delight re Alexander was what I intended to say was misplaced, given the shambles and and eye bleediing football I am being subjected to each week. Not to mention the excruciating pre and post match waffle that comes out of his mouth. 

At the time there were two others  I would have preferred to be serious contenders but sadly one now has moved up in the world and is well set. The other may not be available for a variety of reasons. Other options are available though.  I do hope Alexander proves my concerns are misplaced, but I doubt it. I have simply lost faith in him and his style of football and fear for what lies ahead if he continues on this path.  As others have said, it was just about bearable when we were winning the odd game.......who didn't enjoy looking at the table?...... but now we are in freefall the reality of his approach is hitting home. And it's painful. I can now appreciate why the Salford Board opted to let him go, which on the face of it looked like a crazy decision. I suppose it comes down to wanting to enjoy watching football. Each to his own.

[David]

4 minutes ago, dennyc said:

Apologies, bad wording on my part. To clarify,  I did not want Wright or Hughes to be appointed in preference to Alexander (or at all) and as such was delighted and exited by his appointment instead of either of those two. My excitement and delight re Alexander was what I intended to say was misplaced, given the shambles and and eye bleediing football I am being subjected to each week. Not to mention the excruciating pre and post match waffle that comes out of his mouth. 

At the time there were two others  I would have preferred to be serious contenders but sadly one now has moved up in the world and is well set. The other may not be available for a variety of reasons. Other options are available though.  I do hope Alexander proves my concerns are misplaced, but I doubt it. I have simply lost faith in him and his style of football and fear for what lies ahead if he continues on this path.  As others have said, it was just about bearable when we were winning the odd game.......who didn't enjoy looking at the table?...... but now we are in freefall the reality of his approach is hitting home. And it's painful. I can now appreciate why the Salford Board opted to let him go, which on the face of it looked like a crazy decision. I suppose it comes down to wanting to enjoy watching football. Each to his own.

Ah, okay. Makes sense. I'm not a big fan of his style of football, but it should be pointed out that since sacking him Gary Neville has said "Last season, Graham Alexander should never have left this club. He should never have left, I should never have made that decision that I made."

I guess the grass isn't always greener, and that's what makes it far from an easy choice to just get rid of him. 

[mfc]

Aye kelly will be sold the minute the club gets the offer that suits.the club have played it well whatever happens,we either sell for a few times more than the fee we paid for him or have a quality goalkeeper for the length of his contract.theres bound to be interest in him this summer,I wouldn't be surprised if were already keeping an eye on potential replacements just in case.we always seem to have a really good goalkeeper or a total diddy,there's never much in between,let's hope we can bring in another good one when the time comes.

[Winning by Name]

4 hours ago, David said:

Really? You think you were wrong to want Alexander over Wright, who was sacked after less than a year with Kilmarnock, who he had taken to 5th in the Championship? Or over John Hughes who's currently manager of 9th in the Championship Dunfermline?

I think it depends on where the big offer comes from. He was sitting on what was most likely a nice contract down south at QPR which was set to run until June 2023 but chose to leave that behind and return to Scotland with us. 

I have a feeling he may not be overly keen to return down south perhaps? It would be interesting to see how that plays out, but I wouldn't be surprised in the slightest if he signs an extension with us. He seems to be enjoying his football here.

It may be that London doesn't appeal but there are plenty of other clubs more northerly, and closer to home, in England he may not knock back.

[David]

2 hours ago, Winning by Name said:

It may be that London doesn't appeal but there are plenty of other clubs more northerly, and closer to home, in England he may not knock back.

That could very well be true. I would like to think that some of those clubs were maybe interested when he made it clear he was leaving QPR, but that he preferred to come back to Scotland. Let's hope he signs an extension with us.

[Winning by Name]

20 minutes ago, David said:

That could very well be true. I would like to think that some of those clubs were maybe interested when he made it clear he was leaving QPR, but that he preferred to come back to Scotland. Let's hope he signs an extension with us.

I would like to think that too but it doesnt necessarily make it so.

[Yassin]

It seems like the standard of goalkeeper available to clubs like us has improved massively, to the point that most teams in the league are relatively happy with their #1s. 

I'd obviously still rather not lose Kelly,  but over the last decade (or slightly longer) we've had Ruddy, Randolph, Carson, Gillespie and now Kelly. Definitely feels like an upgrade on the 2000s squads anyway. 

[wellman]

On 3/24/2022 at 8:49 AM, Kmac said:

But again, why would we sell? He's undoubtedly the most talented player in the squad - his passing actually puts some of our outfield players to shame. Business model or not, having 11 players on par with Nathan Mcginley next season gives me the fear and the boke in equal measures. 

Are we still talking about Kelly good shot stopper but passing rate very poor never releases an early ball pretends to throw then kicks ball to opposing players 

[well_said]

5 minutes ago, wellman said:

Are we still talking about Kelly good shot stopper but passing rate very poor never releases an early ball pretends to throw then kicks ball to opposing players 

I know , he also does daft things like saving certain goals.