Next Motherwell Manager - Steven Hammell

[Spiderpig]

15 minutes ago, Yorkyred said:

Nothing to read there that does not happen at every club up and down the country, he even states Alexander was right.

No he didn't the wotds used were maybe GA was right big difference,  the article confirms what we all suspected that Alexander was prepared to leave out a senior pro and international player when we were struggling to win a game for weeks on end, over some no doubt petty argument, a shocking way to manage a team.

[David]

17 minutes ago, Spiderpig said:

No he didn't the wotds used were maybe GA was right big difference,  the article confirms what we all suspected that Alexander was prepared to leave out a senior pro and international player when we were struggling to win a game for weeks on end, over some no doubt petty argument, a shocking way to manage a team.

Do you know what the disagreement was about, like? I didn't see it mentioned? There's every chance the disagreement was about O'Donnell not being good enough? Which many of our fans were saying week in and week out on here, on social media, and in the stands.

But hey, you can use it as another reason to bash a guy who's no longer even here.

[David]

On the subject of the next manager, I think we're at a stage where we need to either really go for someone of quality, or look at someone like Hammell who can implement his experience of the youth setup and bring some of those lads through.

I'd sound out McInnes and Malky Mackay. Hopefully the club have at least got some sort of read on them, to know if they'd be interested. I know both clubs are similar to ours in many ways, but the potential, recent results and how the club is run here may appeal to them? I'd certainly be making moves to see if they'd at least entertain the idea. Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

[Wishielad]

On 8/6/2022 at 3:04 PM, si91 said:

Sportsound reporting a shortlist of possibly 4 candidates, with two confirmed as Stevie Hammell and Simo Valakari - just guesswork perhaps…

My son's in Finland and Finnish friends and family are telling him that rumours in Finland are that Simo is being considered. Simo is significantly more highly rated than Mixu P  amongst Finns who are texting me.

[mfc]

That's both hammell and odonnell said that bringing in players is more important than a manager,as fans we all know we need some better players brought in but I just found it strange that both have came away with that statement,it sounds like it's both saying what we have isn't good enough rather than that were short of bodies.

[Yorkyred]

1 hour ago, Spiderpig said:

No he didn't the wotds used were maybe GA was right big difference,  the article confirms what we all suspected that Alexander was prepared to leave out a senior pro and international player when we were struggling to win a game for weeks on end, over some no doubt petty argument, a shocking way to manage a team.

Sorry I think you’re making a mountain out of a molehill. Was  he playing well enough to retain his place in the team ? Not according to many on here who felt he should be dropped. I personally would have kept him in the team but even I was fifty fifty on that. Dropped player is unhappy shocker is all that says to me.

[Yorkyred]

26 minutes ago, mfc said:

That's both hammell and odonnell said that bringing in players is more important than a manager,as fans we all know we need some better players brought in but I just found it strange that both have came away with that statement,it sounds like it's both saying what we have isn't good enough rather than that were short of bodies.

Personally I think a new manager comes first, it’s shown time and time again that the right man can make a huge difference with the same group of players.

[FirParkCornerExile]

7 minutes ago, Yorkyred said:

Personally I think a new manager comes first, it’s shown time and time again that the right man can make a huge difference with the same group of players.

But can he make a difference in a 3 week transfer window cos God Almighty himself wont turn that dross we have into an effective unit.

[Great Balls of Shire]

14 hours ago, wellsince75 said:

I hope not.

he’s had a couple of assistant mgr roles in 2nd tier German league , the longest lasting led to relegation .

a short stint at Cowdenbeath .

Suspect he’d be further down the pecking order than say Valakari - who would also be a punt - (unless he comes over with a mini bus full of very decent finish stars who we can test out in a bounce  game )

i am not dismissing valakari, everybody deserves a chance but i read lee erwin is top scorer in finland......he wasnt the worst, but top scorer in the league?

[Spit_It_Out]

4 minutes ago, Yorkyred said:

Personally I think a new manager comes first, it’s shown time and time again that the right man can make a huge difference with the same group of players.

Exactly right!Always said this a good manager will always get the best out of any players.Folk knock our squad but really isn't any difference between 8 or so teams in out league it's really one and the same.

I have said from the start of this experienced man at the helm with Hammell as number two definitely involved with the first team at the worst.

[Spiderpig]

1 hour ago, David said:

Do you know what the disagreement was about, like? I didn't see it mentioned? There's every chance the disagreement was about O'Donnell not being good enough? Which many of our fans were saying week in and week out on here, on social media, and in the stands.

But hey, you can use it as another reason to bash a guy who's no longer even here.

What the fallout was about is irrelevant its the fact that there was one that's important and GA'S  stubborn refusal to resolve it and play a senior pro, who was still getting picked for the international squads ffs at a time when we were struggling big time.  So yes Alexander deserves all he gets from the fans for his shocking man management and the state he got the team into.

 

[Mad Dog]

1 hour ago, David said:

On the subject of the next manager, I think we're at a stage where we need to either really go for someone of quality, or look at someone like Hammell who can implement his experience of the youth setup and bring some of those lads through.

I'd sound out McInnes and Malky Mackay. Hopefully the club have at least got some sort of read on them, to know if they'd be interested. I know both clubs are similar to ours in many ways, but the potential, recent results and how the club is run here may appeal to them? I'd certainly be making moves to see if they'd at least entertain the idea. Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

We've had clubs poach or try to poach our managers in the past and it's a shitty thing  to do. I'd rather our club didn't go down that route.

[David]

1 minute ago, Mad Dog said:

We've had clubs poach or try to poach our managers in the past and it's a shitty thing  to do. I'd rather our club didn't go down that route.

Nah, we do what we need to do to succeed. If we have a chance to take someone like Mackay or McInnes from a team around us, we do it. I'd rather we did that and succeeded, than lose our premiership status but retain our status as a club who don't do shitty things.

[Great Balls of Shire]

3 hours ago, El Grew said:

Last week, Graham Alexander was busy getting a pre-emotive strike in concerning his sacking as he was busy telling everybody about the wonderful job he did as Motherwell manager! However as Shakespeare famously wrote “methinks he doth protest too much.”

Ah, but wait. For every action there is a reaction and it finally came over the weekend.

First, we get a damning indictment on the previous managerial regime from interim manager and ‘Well legend Stevie Hammell who has pulled no punches in stating that he believes the squad needs major surgery.  

Then, Stephen O’Donnell finally publicly reveals what many suspected - that there was a rift between him and Alexander as he reveals he was stripped of the captaincy and ostracised.

A truly damning judgment and indictment on the previous managerial regime and also on those running the club.

I didnt read that article as him  being ostracised, he was on the bench , so hardly the case. He wasnt made to train with youths or anything.Sod , as good as  says in interview that maybe the manager was right to drop him, so that is fairly honest of him.

I am still glad ga has gone as it clearly wasnt going well but things are seldom black and white

[Spit_It_Out]

Said it before McKay a local lad might be tempt to move back down to  the central belt.If the club are not sounding him out and on the blower to Ross County then pretty disappointing if you ask me.

He turned Ross County last season from an awful start to a team that never gave up.Be perfect for us I think.

[Great Balls of Shire]

3 minutes ago, Spit_It_Out said:

Said it before McKay a local lad might be tempt to move back down to  the central belt.If the club are not sounding him out and on the blower to Ross County then pretty disappointing if you ask me.

He turned Ross County last season from an awful start to a team that never gave up.Be perfect for us I think.

Ross co probably have slightly bigger budget than us and we finished above them....so would it really be worth poaching him

[pretzel]

I would actually be delighted if Stevie Hammell got the gig tbf, I'm probably not adding anything thats previously been discussed in this thread but players that he has helped nurture are coming through the academy that he has worked beside so I think that will be a massive plus for his application as we have always had that emphasis on youth players breaking through, it was nice to see he had the confidence to throw a young lad in for his debut, Hammell made his 'Well debut as a 17 year old and was always in the squads after that so it was nice to see him also go down that road and show belief in someone.

I seen a few posters saying a few pages back it'll be too soon for him but the likes of Alex McLeish and Billy Davies took the role around the age of 34. I know times are different as the decades have moved on but the likes of St John and Hay had no previous managerial experience either and were both highly thought of but admittedly the likes of Malpas and Black were on that boat as well. I like the idea of having someone that truly has the club at heart but whoever gets the role has their work cut out for sure.

The club have made appointments out of left field before, most of the names mentioned via the bookies are quite underwhelming but I will admit I felt like that when McCall got the job but in all fairness I was proved wrong as in the league he done really well for the best part and enjoyed a Scottish Cup Final like five months after taking the reigns.

Looking at some past managers Harri Kampman was intriguing but massively underestimated the quality required, Gannon had a great eye for a player but like Alexander it was his way or the highway and with Baraclough, it was refreshing  to see his approach to the Rangers playoff games, he brought us Moult and despite seeing the return of the likes of Pearson and McDonald his side struggled in his first full campaign and was promptly binned. Even going further back than any of them mentioned, the likes of the experienced Jock Wallace and Ally MacLeod proved to be a mixed bag. It's a massive week ahead, it'll be interesting to see what road we go down.

 

[Kmcalpin]

59 minutes ago, Mad Dog said:

We've had clubs poach or try to poach our managers in the past and it's a shitty thing  to do. I'd rather our club didn't go down that route.

A lot will depend on their contracts in terms of release clauses etc. If you mean by "poach" tapping up, I agree. However theres nought wrong with asking permisson of a club to speak to their manager. If they say no, not now not ever, then thats should be it.

[wellfan]

If Hammy gets the job, there would hopefully be a provision in his new contract allowing him to return to his current role should it all go wrong, which it very well could if he's not enabled to sign the players required to try to fix things. Otherwise, it's a significant risk for him at this stage of his coaching career. I'd hate to lose him from the Club due to Alexander and the Board's messes.  

[grizzlyg]

With us no doubt paying off Alexander and Lucketti then I don't know where the cash would be to also pay compensation to Killie and Ross co for McInnes or Mackay. Mind you I would assume Valakari under contract unless he has a clause in his contract.  If no joy then we could just go further north to Lapland and approach Santa as he has an ahem.....claus in his contract!!......sorry folks

[Welldaft Mk1]

Take what you want re ODonnells comments but it is hardly news that a Manager does not get along with some players. Happens in every workplace. You get on with some and not with others. What I would say if he was a great Man Manager then this possibly could have been managed a bit better but it appears and was reported that he was quite a stubborn man. 

I trust the Board to make the right appointment for now. Say what you want about Alexander he got us away from relegation and into Europe. Yes he has left us with a bit of a mess in terms of current squad. But he did what he was paid to do. In fact probably overachieved based purely on eventual outcome last season. 

We still need to try and move a handful of players on and bring in minimum 4 to 5 players who will add quality to the team. I suspect this may be a major factor on who gets the job. Whether someone can come in and say I know players that can come into CB, LB that Motherwell could afford. Not saying this necessarily rules Hammell out but it probably cannot help his cause. I still see someone coming in and Hammell becoming assistant. 

The defence needs sorted pronto. The winning goal on Saturday is all that is wrong. Unable to deal with a straightforward lump into the box. Not only that making the situation worse. Then you have SODs rushing towards a player when the ball is head height and the likes of Mugabi ball watching instead of picking up St Johnstone key and most dangerous striker. Genuinely a video on how not to defend !!!

[El Grew]

Reading a lot of the comments on this board re-Stephen O’Donnell make it plain that he’s not a fans’ favourite, for whatever reason. And that’s fine because all fans have their favourites and players they don’t like.

He’s now publicly admitted that there was a rift between himself and Alexander without really divulging what caused it.  Whatever the reason, Alexander felt it necessary to exclude O'Donnell thereafter from his starting 11.

Be interesting to know when this “exclusion” started especially since Alexander had previously been glowing in his praise for O’Donnell as witnessed by his statement of 30th September 2021 when he said “Stephen’s performances along with those of Liam Kelly as vice-captain and the other leaders within our squad set the standard of what we require from our players every day.”

 

 

[dennyc]

3 hours ago, David said:

Do you know what the disagreement was about, like? I didn't see it mentioned? There's every chance the disagreement was about O'Donnell not being good enough? Which many of our fans were saying week in and week out on here, on social media, and in the stands.

But hey, you can use it as another reason to bash a guy who's no longer even here.

It does not matter what the disagreement was about, but if it was about SOD not being good enough then why was he even on the Bench? Drop him altogether if that is the Manager's considered assessment.  The fact is we had a Manager who punished a player by dumping him on the bench and (even worse) then ignoring him when the team he was managing was in freefall. That is not what I consider a professional approach. Harmed the team as a whole, the individual player and also the players exposed by being forced to play out of position. Only one person appears to have acted professionally, and it was not Alexander. And if you read O'Donnell's comments he is still conducting himself as he should. The fans call out various players every game but I did not see Alexander treating those players as he did O'Donnell. Well, not for the same length of time anyway. It seems Slattery and Carroll to name just two were paroled.  His treatment of O'Donnell was vindictive, whether or not benching him originally was justified. And it continued into the new season.

Yorkyred is correct in that fallouts happen at all clubs from time to time. But at most Clubs BOTH parties work to patch things up for the benefit of all. Does not read like that was the case here.

As for continuing to bash a guy who has thankfully gone, were you there on Saturday to see the shambles he left behind? Despite Alexander stating what a great job he had done.  Did you read Hammell's comments about the state of the squad he inherited? ...Unfit, confidence shot, players with little game time pre season....and as a result little scope for trying different set ups. On Saturday, not one fan sitting around me was happy with what they were watching but all were unanimous that Hammell had been left to tidy up a shambles of Alexander's making. And they were not just referring to the O'Donnell situation. And let's not mention his summer recruitment...or lack of.

You and a few others can defend Alexander as is your right. But the evidence against him explains why you appear to be in the vast minority.

[Yabba's Turd]

45 minutes ago, El Grew said:

He’s now publicly admitted that there was a rift between himself and Alexander without really divulging what caused it.  Whatever the reason, Alexander felt it necessary to exclude O'Donnell thereafter from his starting 11.

He called a meeting with the players and Alexander did not like it.

[David]

Just now, dennyc said:

It does not matter what the disagreement was about, but if it was about SOD not being good enough then why was he even on the Bench? Drop him altogether if that is the Manager's considered assessment.

Because it is possible to not be good enough for a starting spot, but good enough for a place on the bench. It doesn't have to be a game of absolutes. But let's be honest, if he did have a huge falling out, O'Donnell wouldn't even be training with the first team, let alone sitting on the bench.

2 minutes ago, dennyc said:

Only one person appears to have acted professionally, and it was not Alexander. And if you read O'Donnell's comments he is still conducting himself as he should.

What did Alexander do that wasn't professional? Drop a player from the starting eleven who he didn't deem good enough? A player who, by most fans accounts, simply wasn't performing well enough? A player who himself admitted that Alexander may have been correct?

I could understand if Alexander took the same approach as Paul Lambert did with Kayden Jackson and Jon Nolan at Ipswich, banishing them to train with the kids and making vague accusations about the player, but he didn't, did he? Did he disrespect O'Donnell in the media? In press interviews? Did he question O'Donnell's professionalism?

I honestly think he just didn't fancy him as a player. He didn't think he was good enough. Which is allowed, by the way. He's the manager, it's his job to make those calls. I don't personally think it was the right call, but that's on Alexander.

It wasn't unprofessional though.

7 minutes ago, dennyc said:

The fans call out various players every game but I did not see Alexander treating those players as he did O'Donnell.

Why would he? Do you think Alexander removed O'Donnell from the team because of what the fans thought? If he did, then he's got bigger problems than might first be apparent!

He dropped O'Donnell because he didn't think he was good enough. That's a managers prerogative.

9 minutes ago, dennyc said:

His treatment of O'Donnell was vindictive, whether or not benching him originally was justified. And it continued into the new season.

Why was it vindictive? Was he banished from the first team? Made to train with the kids? Embarrassed and called out publicly? I don't think he was. He was, basically, seen as surplus to requirements. It happens.

10 minutes ago, dennyc said:

Yorkyred is correct in that fallouts happen at all clubs from time to time. But at most Clubs BOTH parties work to patch things up for the benefit of all. Does not read like that was the case here.

He just wasn't good enough, mate. There's no "patching up" to be done. It was on O'Donnell to up his game and prove to the manager that he was good enough to feature. Which he didn't do, and he knows it going by his admittance that Alexander may have been correct.

Maybe he got dropped initially and the head went down? He didn't respond as he should have? Hopefully he learns from it. 

12 minutes ago, dennyc said:

As for continuing to bash a guy who has thankfully gone, were you there on Saturday to see the shambles he left behind? Despite Alexander stating what a great job he had done.  Did you read the interim Hammell's comments about the state of the squad he inherited? ...Unfit, confidence shot, players with little game time pre season....and as a result little scope for trying different set ups. On Saturday, not one fan sitting around me was happy with what they were watching but all were unanimous that Hammell had been left to tidy up a shambles of Alexander's making. And they were not just referring to the O'Donnell situation. And let's not mention his summer recruitment...or lack of.

That squad isn't a shambles. We have some quality in there, it will just take a few key signings in certain areas to make the difference. 

The recruitment thing is a fine line really. It depends who's available at any given time. It's easy for fans to say "get a striker in" but what if there's no decent strikers available within our budget? What then? Just magic one up out of thin air? Or do what we've seen managers in the past do, and sign any old shite as long as it represents a body in the door? 

Often times clubs in our position have to play the waiting game and see who becomes available on a free or via loan once the bigger clubs have conducted their business and finalised their squads. That's why there's usually always a rush of signings in the last few weeks. 

I said before the summer window opened that I'd rather we wait and sign decent quality than waste money on players who aren't going to make the cut just to get bodies in the door and keep the fans happy. If that means we're a bit light and not looking great for the first two or three games in the season then so be it. 

However, we're now in a position where we still need those quality signings, but don't have a manager to rubber stamp them. So, whatever problems we had a few weeks ago are now exacerbated. Which is why I would have stuck with Alexander until around October or so to see how we got on. Or at least until we identified a decent replacement ahead of time.

But the fans wanted him out as "it couldn't possibly be any worse." So, let's see if that's true. There's no real outstanding candidate for the job out there at this stage of the season. There never is. We've gone down the crazy road of parting ways with a manager literally days before the season starts, and we have no one who can rubber stamp signings before the window closes, unless we want to bring a manager in a few weeks from now and hand him a squad that may include brand new signings he doesn't like the look of.

Truth is, the club should either have got rid of Alexander in the summer, or waited until October or November. It seemed quite simple really. But they haven't, they dithered about until he eventually came to them obviously looking for the club to either accept his resignation or signal their intent to back him for the next few months at least.

Let's hope we don't pay the ultimate price for that.