Next Motherwell Manager - Steven Hammell

[mfc]

Hammell has said we need a couple of attacking options,hopefully one of them is an out and out striker.van veen is decent enough for our level but the problem is were relying on him far to much,to be coming into a new season still relying on a 31 year old isnt good enough,I genuinely think if alexander stayed we would have signed another efford or shields type and still had to rely on van veen.hes inconsistent to the point where he's good one game then totally anonymous for the next three,throw in any injuries and inevitable suspensions then we simply have to sign another striker,a proper winger with a bit of pace would be ideal as well.

[David]

21 hours ago, steelboy said:

Burrows has to take some blame. When Alexander comes to you and asks for Paul McGinn point to Stephen O'Donnell's contract that he signed off on 12 months ago. When he wants Blair Spittal point to Cornelius, Goss and Slattery and ask how he fits in. When he wants 31 year old journeyman Morris just say no. We have only signed three players and we didn't need any of them. 

Managers are financially insulated from failure by the nature of their contracts, they cannot be allowed to control the club's budget with no oversight. 

I understand the thinking behind this, but when a club appoints a manager they have to support him. Refusing his requests for players doesn't exactly scream "backing the manager," does it? 

Basically, the board appointed Alexander so they had to either back him, or move him out. If they started refusing his requests (if they were reasonable, of course) for new players and so on then the position becomes untenable.

20 hours ago, wellsince75 said:

My ideal appointment would be someone in the mould of Alex Neil or Eddie Howe, both were outstanding managers who knew the club, cared about the community feel.

Despite Stevie not having first team experience he ticked every other box and then some. He wants to see us develop youth and the community aspect of our club.  He also has a handle on the current issues with the team/squad.

Given we're light years away from having Alex Neil/Eddie Howe I'm enthused that we have given Stevie the opportunity do something like this.   

I'll be happy to avoid relegation scares  and start having something to cheer on and see a future with.  This should be a +3 year project with natural progression. 

What's to say Hammell won't be a Howe or Neil type appointment? 

In fact, Howe's first two games as caretaker manager at Bournemouth were defeats before he got the job full-time, and Neil got the Accies job on an interim basis initially after managing the youth team.

I'm not saying he'll be as successful as either of them, but there's shades of Hammell's situation in both.

[weeyin]

Didn't take long to reach the stage where some posters would rather Hammell fails so they can say "I was right" than see him succeed and prove them wrong

 

[Yorkyred]

1 minute ago, weeyin said:

Didn't take long to reach the stage where some posters would rather Hammell fails so they can say "I was right" than see him succeed and prove them wrong

 

Of course the important thing now is regardless of peoples opinion he gets 100% support in what going to be a difficult period. I think we all realise it’s a risky appointment, but it could end up a master stroke.

[Villageman]

28 minutes ago, weeyin said:

Didn't take long to reach the stage where some posters would rather Hammell fails so they can say "I was right" than see him succeed and prove them wrong

 

Damned right Weeyin, the major reason why I avoid this forum for long spells.

[ppower]

1 hour ago, MelvinBragg said:

How many goals did he score in the second half of the season? More than everyone else doesn't mean it's enough. He shows up in 1 in 4 or 1 in 5 games at best. Is he the best option we have up front? Probably. Does it mean he's good enough? Not really. You said he and Kelly were the two players worth a place in the team. I'm saying Van Veen is no better than much of the squad, occasional flashes of skill aside...

And don't make me dig up the old Ebbe Skovdahl quote about statistics. 

Look his goals kept us out of a dog fight. If you don't accept that then you are blind.  We have players who never fucking show up. 

[Onthefringes]

50 minutes ago, weeyin said:

Didn't take long to reach the stage where some posters would rather Hammell fails so they can say "I was right" than see him succeed and prove them wrong

Not putting each post under scrutiny but, I’m not reading anything like that

[MelvinBragg]

57 minutes ago, ppower said:

Look his goals kept us out of a dog fight. If you don't accept that then you are blind.  We have players who never fucking show up. 

Probably helped but doesn't change the fact that his decision making leaves a lot to be desired on his good days and those good days are once a month. Again is he the best attacker we have? Probably but that says a lot about our squad. Alexander had Van Veen as his plan A, B and C for goals. He's maybe good enough for plan C most of the time. A Dutch Curtis Main...

 

EDIT Had a quick check. 4 league goals in 2022, including two penalties. So the same number of non penalty league goals as Joe Efford and indeed Rickie Lamie. Since you earlier told me to check the stats and stop talking crap...

[Spit_It_Out]

I think everyone is along the lines of a a bit of risk appointment but everyone wants him to be a success.

I can't mind last time I seen everyone get behind a manager as much not one Well fan deep down doesn't want this to be winner.

I got one am looking forward to the younger guys coming through getting some first team action.Might even have a few gems the now ready to push for a place.

['WellMagic!]

28 minutes ago, MelvinBragg said:

Probably helped but doesn't change the fact that his decision making leaves a lot to be desired on his good days and those good days are once a month. Again is he the best attacker we have? Probably but that says a lot about our squad. Alexander had Van Veen as his plan A, B and C for goals. He's maybe good enough for plan C most of the time. A Dutch Curtis Main...

Watt was the only player the ball would stick to up top, his hold up play was great and he rarely lost the ball. He dragged us through a good few games. The way I see it, his overall play helped keep us out of a dogfight, rather than his goals.

His decision making was mince a lot of the time, granted, but things certainly went downhill after he left. We created virtually nothing in the final third the second half of the season, and nobody could relieve any pressure so we were under the cosh constantly.

Agree on KVV. He is mostly useless. Lazy, greedy and refuses to move. Essentially a glorified human bollard.

[star sail]

3 hours ago, Onthefringes said:

Not putting each post under scrutiny but, I’m not reading anything like that

Agreed. I think most if not all of those that have voiced concern have also expressed a wish that he succeed.

Having had 24 hours to digest the news, I have to admit that I can’t help but feel a little underwhelmed.

For me, if Hammell is the man then why was he not the man two weeks ago? He has been at the club a long time. The board will know his strengths. If integrating youth development into the first team is the way forward, good, but that seems to be a decision they have stumbled upon in the last few days rather than one that is part of an ongoing process. 

I do worry that they have been surprised by the lack of interest in the job and that Hammell is the fall back option. It is most certainly a risk given his lack of first team management experience.

Where I think we are all agreed, is that we do wish him all the very best and if his appointment is successful I don’t think there is a single Motherwell fan that would begrudge him that success. I think what  has been voiced is a concern that a great servant to the club may have inadvertently been thrown to the lions and that a reputation built over many successful years be tarnished.

 

 

 

[bobbybingo]

20 minutes ago, star sail said:

I do worry that they have been surprised by the lack of interest in the job and that Hammell is the fall back option. It is most certainly a risk given his lack of first team management experience.

 

 

 

 

If no one decent was interested in the job, it's not really a risk, it's a necessity. Unless they deliberately ignored someone they considered more capable.

[star sail]

7 minutes ago, bobbybingo said:

If no one decent was interested in the job, it's not really a risk, it's a necessity. Unless they deliberately ignored someone they considered more capable.

I suppose the point I was making is that if they had absolute confidence in Hammell they should have given him the job two weeks ago. For player recruitment alone, two weeks is a long time.  Appointing someone out of necessity is not what you might want and as a by- product brings the risk of failure. I don’t think the two are mutually exclusive.

Nobody is arguing that they deliberately ignored somebody they considered more capable.

[fizoxy]

I think it's important to do due diligence and go through a competitive process for appointing the manager. First, you never know what you might uncover or who will apply, and it also sends the message (to both the fans and players) that the internal applicant in this case was held to the same standard as the others, and earned the job.

Hammell said himself that going through the process was important to him, as he was able to see the the club bought into his vision.

Also, with us being fan owned, it was key that the well society reps were involved in the whole process for transparency.

Now, wether that was all performative and they had hammell picked from the start, who knows (I don't think so).

[dennyc]

6 minutes ago, star sail said:

 

For me, if Hammell is the man then why was he not the man two weeks ago? He has been at the club a long time. The board will know his strengths. If integrating youth development into the first team is the way forward, good, but that seems to be a decision they have stumbled upon in the last few days rather than one that is part of an ongoing process. 

 

 

 

 

Albeit everyone is broadly supportive of Hammell, the Board have faced criticism from several on here. Noteworthy that those shouting loudest have had an axe to grind with the Board (and Burrows in particular) for some considerable time. Way before the decline since last December.  So the past few weeks must have been orgasmic for them. More fuel to the fire and all that.  Others have expressed concern but in a much more supportive, constructive manner. As you would expect on a fans' forum.  But can you imagine the seethe from that first group if Hammell had been appointed within hours of Alexander leaving?

From memory Burrows and the Board have been criticised for appointing Robinson, sacking Robinson, appointing Alexander, sacking Alexander, sacking Alexander to soon,  being slow to ditch Alexander,  appointing Hammell, not appointing Hammell immediately,  and not taking enough time before appointing Hammell. 

My view is that the Board have acted promptly enough whilst taking the time to assess the merits of those interested in the position. I don't think the likes of Pep and Jurgen expressed an interest so perhaps some on here need a dose of realism. Having considered all the information available to them the Board decided to appoint Hammell, That's good enough for me and for anyone to question their integrity in doing so is farcical. For what it's worth I would have preferred Valakari but he too would have been a risk, although for different reasons.

As for integrating different areas within the Club, youth in particular, I believe that set up existed successfully when Craigen was in charge of youth development. A system that was responsible for Turnbull, Hastie, Scott etc etc  breaking into the first team and earning the Club millions. Within that system others were poached by Clubs such as Leeds, Norwich and Rangers. But again resulting in much needed income. Latterly under Robinson..... but more so under Alexander....., I believe that structure was dismissed and I wonder how much contact Alexander actually had with our younger players and Hammell/Kerr. Perhaps CoVid had a part to play.  Alexander clearly preferred to bring in his own team of like minded coaches and preferred to recruit senior players he had previously worked with and trusted. That approach continued into this season despite its limitations as evidenced by our style of play and poor results in 2022. If Hammell and the Board believe a return to that earlier set up will help to secure our future, put a more attractive product on the pitch, and provide a better balance of experience and raw talent,  then more power to them. Seems to me the people in charge are doing what they believe is best for Motherwell FC. 

[bobbybingo]

35 minutes ago, star sail said:

I suppose the point I was making is that if they had absolute confidence in Hammell they should have given him the job two weeks ago. For player recruitment alone, two weeks is a long time.  Appointing someone out of necessity is not what you might want and as a by- product brings the risk of failure. I don’t think the two are mutually exclusive.

Nobody is arguing that they deliberately ignored somebody they considered more capable.

They surely had to at least see who was available before appointing Hammell - given his lack of experience - so I'd cut them some slack on that. I hope he wasn't given the job out of necessity, but either way, we needed a manager sooner rather than later, as you say. And either way, we all support him and hope it works out, because it's obvious he cares about the club as well as his own career.

[star sail]

58 minutes ago, dennyc said:

Albeit everyone is broadly supportive of Hammell, the Board have faced criticism from several on here. Noteworthy that those shouting loudest have had an axe to grind with the Board (and Burrows in particular) for some considerable time. Way before the decline since last December.  So the past few weeks must have been orgasmic for them. More fuel to the fire and all that.  Others have expressed concern but in a much more supportive, constructive manner. As you would expect on a fans' forum.  But can you imagine the seethe from that first group if Hammell had been appointed within hours of Alexander leaving?

From memory Burrows and the Board have been criticised for appointing Robinson, sacking Robinson, appointing Alexander, sacking Alexander, sacking Alexander to soon,  being slow to ditch Alexander,  appointing Hammell, not appointing Hammell immediately,  and not taking enough time before appointing Hammell. 

My view is that the Board have acted promptly enough whilst taking the time to assess the merits of those interested in the position. I don't think the likes of Pep and Jurgen expressed an interest so perhaps some on here need a dose of realism. Having considered all the information available to them the Board decided to appoint Hammell, That's good enough for me and for anyone to question their integrity in doing so is farcical. For what it's worth I would have preferred Valakari but he too would have been a risk, although for different reasons.

As for integrating different areas within the Club, youth in particular, I believe that set up existed successfully when Craigen was in charge of youth development. A system that was responsible for Turnbull, Hastie, Scott etc etc  breaking into the first team and earning the Club millions. Within that system others were poached by Clubs such as Leeds, Norwich and Rangers. But again resulting in much needed income. Latterly under Robinson..... but more so under Alexander....., I believe that structure was dismissed and I wonder how much contact Alexander actually had with our younger players and Hammell/Kerr. Perhaps CoVid had a part to play.  Alexander clearly preferred to bring in his own team of like minded coaches and preferred to recruit senior players he had previously worked with and trusted. That approach continued into this season despite its limitations as evidenced by our style of play and poor results in 2022. If Hammell and the Board believe a return to that earlier set up will help to secure our future, put a more attractive product on the pitch, and provide a better balance of experience and raw talent,  then more power to them. Seems to me the people in charge are doing what they believe is best for Motherwell FC. 

 

44 minutes ago, bobbybingo said:

They surely had to at least see who was available before appointing Hammell - given his lack of experience - so I'd cut them some slack on that. I hope he wasn't given the job out of necessity, but either way, we needed a manager sooner rather than later, as you say. And either way, we all support him and hope it works out, because it's obvious he cares about the club as well as his own career.

I agree with much of what you both say.  The board are damned if they do damned if they don’t. Being a board member or a manager of a team like Motherwell presents significant challenges and it is so easy to be an anonymous armchair critic.

I think Alan Burrows in particular has been a huge positive for the club  over the last few years and the Board have done a remarkable job of picking the right man at the right time over the last 15 years to ensure our top flight status.  The naysayers  criticising manager after manger does get wearing after a while.

Alexander is actually the first manager since Maurice Malpas that I completely lost faith in. For me the Sligo result and performance was unacceptable. 

I just get a sense this time that this is the most crucial of appointments and the most challenging to date. I would be delighted  and impressed if they have called this one correctly. There is no doubt that it is a very tough call to make. If there is a man that I would want to be successful, Stevie Hammell is the man but I do have the fear for him. He has a really tough task ahead of him. 

[twistandshout1983]

Noticed on the Well Facebook page last night when Stevie was appointed that Colin ONeill had said Burrows should go

Bit OTT in my opinion 

[Kmcalpin]

I do have some misgivings over Stevie Hammell's appointment as I've said, but he's now in the hot seat and he's got my backing 100% (not that that means much). Its a fact of life though that his appointment has split the support.  He's got a tough job ahead of him now and needs us all to get behind him.  His first weeks will be crucial in terms of recruitment alone.  

[grizzlyg]

15 minutes ago, twistandshout1983 said:

Noticed on the Well Facebook page last night when Stevie was appointed that Colin ONeill had said Burrows should go

Bit OTT in my opinion 

Sadly he is quite bitter towards the club but what a player he was for us

[twistandshout1983]

12 minutes ago, grizzlyg said:

Sadly he is quite bitter towards the club but what a player he was for us

Totally agree , what a player he was for us and would love to have a player like this now in the team

Seem to remember he was quite bitter towards the likes of Barraclough and Robinson also 

[fizoxy]

Noticed on the Well Facebook page last night when Stevie was appointed that Colin ONeill had said Burrows should go
Bit OTT in my opinion 

Sad, bitter, man. He has lived off his cult status with us, and some weirdos still feed into it.

[twistandshout1983]

10 minutes ago, fizoxy said:

1 hour ago, twistandshout1983 said:

Noticed on the Well Facebook page last night when Stevie was appointed that Colin ONeill had said Burrows should go
Bit OTT in my opinion 

Sad, bitter, man. He has lived off his cult status with us, and some weirdos still feed into it.

Seen quite a few posts in recent years slating our club , My thoughts he is bitter at the fact Motherwell have never offered him a job , great player of course  back in the day 

 

[ML1]

13 minutes ago, fizoxy said:

1 hour ago, twistandshout1983 said:

 

 He has lived off his cult status with us,.

Thats the next manager sorted then  

[spudmfc]

7 hours ago, MelvinBragg said:

Probably helped but doesn't change the fact that his decision making leaves a lot to be desired on his good days and those good days are once a month. Again is he the best attacker we have? Probably but that says a lot about our squad. Alexander had Van Veen as his plan A, B and C for goals. He's maybe good enough for plan C most of the time. A Dutch Curtis Main...

 

EDIT Had a quick check. 4 league goals in 2022, including two penalties. So the same number of non penalty league goals as Joe Efford and indeed Rickie Lamie. Since you earlier told me to check the stats and stop talking crap...

Dont u just love a stat t show someone up as an idiot lol