St Johnstone v Motherwell 12/11/2022

[Great Balls of Shire]

3 hours ago, Kmcalpin said:

Good post. I'm not suggesting that we chuck in young lads willy nilly and in the deep end but 2/3 minutes here and there would not be amiss.

Also, I'm not suggesting that Dean Cornelius is the answer to all our problems, but you're right he gives us something different and would have given us fresh impetus and supported Moult and KVV better yesterday. 

Who is this young player, Willy Nilly?

Is he a forward?

 

[Yorkyred]

4 hours ago, Motherwellfc1991 said:

Cornelius should in my opinion start every week on the basis he has attributes that the other midfielders don’t have - he has energy , pace , can tackle and looks to play forward where possible - I think he is 21. The only other youngster to come through of late is macguire and he is the opposite of Cornelius. 

My point is that with Hammell in charge of the academy no other 20/19/18/17 year olds have really at any game time other than the lad who came on at st mirren at start of the season and then disappeared. Each of these squads is at least 20 strong so thats circa 40 players possibly more who hammell signed/coached as part of his academy role and none are ready. He has put Ferie , Miller and Ross on the bench a few times and not used much/at all. 

He sold us on youth and a team trying to play football for us to be proud of. In 4 months I’ve yet to see that other than a small spell of games around united/hearts at home. It’s a lack of progress and lack of ideas on change that’s alarming me. Some players are going backwards as well - Slatterly , Lambie for example. 

Yea it’s better than Alexander but honesty as of yet not by far. The league table and quality of what we are watching shows that. 
 

Massive January window ahead for him and his chums on the board. 

 

 

 

 

The football on the whole may be but the win percentage is certainly not and that’s the thing that depends where we finish this season. We’ve had a run of tough games but that’s not the case after the break and regardless of the entertainment level that’s the stat that needs to change. There needs to be an understanding of why some players are going backwards, why we look so disorganised, he’s been hit by injuries for sure but with a fully fit squad there is not going to be the same excuses. He can’t go on forever stating “it’s disappointing” in just about every post match interview.

[steelboy]

There's no mystery to why we are struggling. All our forwards apart from KVV are injured/rotten. 

[fizoxy]

I like Cornelius, and I would love for him to push on as a regular. However, he's no faster than the current midfield, and he's being made into something's he is not by some of our support due to not playing.

I always thought he'd thrive in that pressing role in front of the midfield, with Goss and Slattery as the 2 behind, but that probably means losing a forward.

I think that us being close in every game has left Hammel reluctant to make big changes, and I can understand that. If KVV and shields converted one of their clear chances in the last few weeks, or SOL keeps his hands to himself, we could be in a completely different mood.

[texanwellfan]

I think Slattery need to loose a few pounds. His stamina and passing seems to have gone the wrong way. I’d be looking for more from him. I think Spittal and Cornelius could be interchanged so one gives it 100% then replace with the other as they start to tire. Midfield definitely needs to work harder. They seem to get caught in the middle not up supporting forwards or back helping defense. They need to up the work rate and just sub them as they tire. 
 

or to be Grizzzly-esque. Flood the midfield and use our subs! 

[grizzlyg]

1 hour ago, texanwellfan said:

I think Slattery need to loose a few pounds. His stamina and passing seems to have gone the wrong way. I’d be looking for more from him. I think Spittal and Cornelius could be interchanged so one gives it 100% then replace with the other as they start to tire. Midfield definitely needs to work harder. They seem to get caught in the middle not up supporting forwards or back helping defense. They need to up the work rate and just sub them as they tire. 
 

or to be Grizzzly-esque. Flood the midfield and use our subs! 

Good one

[Onthefringes]

3 hours ago, Great Balls of Shire said:

Cornelius is becoming better by not playing, not saying he doesn't have attributes and maybe should get a run just so we can judge 

I like Goss and Slattery but they do lack dig , spittal is chipping in with goals, but we do something else in midfield 

You are saying he has pace, I haven't seen that, . .like I said give the boy a chance, he does have energy but that's a bit of a prerequisite for a pro footballer.

Is he?

As for your closing statement - nobody saying he has pace. What he does bring is an energy which is lacking. His engine alone (the pre requisite) will set him apart and they’ll have stats to back that up.

[Kmcalpin]

2 hours ago, steelboy said:

There's no mystery to why we are struggling. All our forwards apart from KVV are injured/rotten. 

Really? Not as clear cut as you make out. Are we playing the strikers in the best formation that suits their abilities? Are they being given decent support and ammunition?  

Does that explain a malfunctioning midfield that doesn't support the strikers and doesn't protect the defence? Does that explain a seemingly disorganised defence?

[texanwellfan]

1 hour ago, Onthefringes said:

Is he?

As for your closing statement - nobody saying he has pace. What he does bring is an energy which is lacking. His engine alone (the pre requisite) will set him apart and they’ll have stats to back that up.

Actually somebody did say he had pace. Motherwellfc1991

[Onthefringes]

24 minutes ago, texanwellfan said:

Actually somebody did say he had pace. Motherwellfc1991

1. I stand corrected.

[SteelmaninOZ]

14 hours ago, Great Balls of Shire said:

Who is this young player, Willy Nilly?

Is he a forward?

 

Sign him  

[David]

On 11/12/2022 at 5:13 PM, MJC_mkII said:

As I said he still shows flashes of his old self and he clearly has ability, but he is done.

I'm actually really glad to see you say that. Because most of the time you're absolutely wrong, and hopefully this is yet another of those instances.

[Kmcalpin]

2 hours ago, David said:

I'm actually really glad to see you say that. Because most of the time you're absolutely wrong, and hopefully this is yet another of those instances.

Careful David. Your comment is becoming a bit personal. We really need to foster and encourage discussion on here not suppress or stifle it. I may not always agree with MJC_mk11, but he/she does make some valid points and I like reading all points of view, especially those which differ from mine.  If you disagree with a comment all you have to do is argue against it and leave it at that. Park it and move on.

As for Louis Moult, I don't think he's finished but his contribution is limited and he hasn't done much to the present. As a loan signing he hasn't done a lot so far, although he put in a good shift on Saturday. Given Hammy's comments about him and his limited appearances to date, there was no way I thought he'd start on Saturday, let alone last 90+ minutes but I was wrong.

[mfc]

I'm sure moult will be working on his fitness over the break and hopefully with some bounce games throwing in,he will be a bit sharper for it,him like the rest of the squad need to hit the ground running after the world cup.we definitely need to be signing another striker,our options up front just won't do for the rest of the season.

[MJC]

2 hours ago, David said:

I'm actually really glad to see you say that. Because most of the time you're absolutely wrong, and hopefully this is yet another of those instances.

I hope so too, because a fit Louis Moult will be invaluable to us this season but sadly so far the signs regarding his fitness aren’t promising.

[joewarkfanclub]

The Louis Moult debate is an interesting one, and  I guess it maybe depends on what your expectations for him were on his return.

If you were expecting the old Louis Moult back after 5 years and a couple of serious injuries, not to mention a lack of first team football recently, Im not sure you were being very realistic.

That said, the  old Louis was never that quick in the first place and relied on his movement and instinct to create space and chances. He also played in a team and for a manager that had a game plan of getting as many crosses into the box as possible (which incidentally is a feature of how St Mirren now play).

Add to that he obviously arrived with a niggle of some kind which limited his gametime but has now been addressed by the recent procedure he underwent.

Hopefully this will have cleared up the problem, because for me he looks in decent shape, the little we have seen of him, the ability and movement are still there and he is certainly motivated to do well for the team. Whether he will remain fit and not break down again remains to be seen, but none of us can know that. It was good to see him start on Saturday and last 90 minutes though, even if that was borne out of necessity.

Hopefully the 4 week break will allow him to do some fitness/strength work that will help in that regard. Personally, I think he is worth the risk, given what he could provide.

The missing factor for me is how we get the best out of him and that comes down to our style of play.  To me we need both him and KVV on the park together. They are both intelligent players and I see the makings of a partnership there. I also think you get far more out of KVV when Moult is on the park. His body language completely changes. Whether thats because he feels his position is under threat or he just enjoys having another player on the pitch in his wavelength, I dont really care, but its something we need to take advantage of.

Hopefully Stevie Hammell and his team will take the time we now have the luxury of to look at how we play and make the changes necessary to make us a more effective unit in the second part of the season.

If he doesnt AND  we dont make efforts to address the weaknesses in the squad in the window AND we dont take advantage of the more favourable run of fixtures AND we continue to slide down the league into the relegation places, then it will be time to start asking real questions about his appointment. Until then lets all just chill out and enjoy the World Cup.

[Great Balls of Shire]

18 hours ago, Onthefringes said:

Is he?

As for your closing statement - nobody saying he has pace. What he does bring is an energy which is lacking. His engine alone (the pre requisite) will set him apart and they’ll have stats to back that up.

If you are saying there are stats to back that up, why isn't the manager playing him?

[Antrimmfc]

On 11/12/2022 at 8:11 PM, FirParkCornerExile said:

I actually think the midfield is the biggest problem. No ball winners, no pace, tackling is alien to them .. the midfield is absolutely garbage therefore an average defence is constantly exposed and the forwards get bugger all supply. How the fuck McKinstry got player of the month is beyond me an absolute lightweight who creates fuck all and cant tackle.

How many goals did we score in October. That's your answer. You've spoke about ball winners, tackling. Fuck all about skill. Typical fan that likes headless chickens instead of footballers. 

[gaz7]

8 minutes ago, Antrimmfc said:

How many goals did we score in October. That's your answer. You've spoke about ball winners, tackling. Fuck all about skill. Typical fan that likes headless chickens instead of footballers. 

I'm with you on this and although it's part of the game there's too much made of it up here especially.  If they could keep ball better we'd be miles better off.

I'm reading on here dean cornelius has best stats for fitness and last year I read in daily record that barry maguire had broke allan campbells beep test record all of which shows it doesn't guarantee you will be a good midfield player. Give me a jan molby any day of week lol

[Antrimmfc]

20 minutes ago, gaz7 said:

I'm with you on this and although it's part of the game there's too much made of it up here especially.  If they could keep ball better we'd be miles better off.

I'm reading on here dean cornelius has best stats for fitness and last year I read in daily record that barry maguire had broke allan campbells beep test record all of which shows it doesn't guarantee you will be a good midfield player. Give me a jan molby any day of week lol

We've some decent footballers if they'd just relax on the ball. Good players always look as if they've time on the ball. How many have we got. One stray pass or a missed tackle and our fans are on their back. 

[Antrimmfc]

On 11/12/2022 at 3:53 PM, steelboy said:

We have absolutely nothing in the final third. Moult is a bust, McKinstry has no end product and Spittal has zero pace.

Slattery is having another nightmare as well. 

If the video analyst wants something to do over the World Cup they can make a compilation of our last 50 long throws and see if Hammell can figure out a pattern. 

Spittal  and McKinstry have scored 3 of our 6 goals in October. McKinstry, Spittal getting better every game. Moult looking the part again. These 3 are key to our success or not. 

[Onthefringes]

2 hours ago, Antrimmfc said:

Spittal  and McKinstry have scored 3 of our 6 goals in October. McKinstry, Spittal getting better every game. Moult looking the part again. These 3 are key to our success or not. 

Therein lies the problem. If Spittal is getting better every game we’ll have some player in 2029!

[grizzlyg]

I am not a huge Spittal fan and has hee haw pace but goals and assists record is not bad. I feel he is better suited in a 4 4 2

[Winning by Name]

15 hours ago, Antrimmfc said:

Spittal  and McKinstry have scored 3 of our 6 goals in October. McKinstry, Spittal getting better every game. Moult looking the part again. These 3 are key to our success or not. 

Agree with this completely. I also think that Van Veen will be a better player with Moult alongside him.

[Antrimmfc]

On 11/12/2022 at 3:41 PM, mio said:

Right I’ve had enough, get this defence cleared out, absolute dross, stupid mistakes every week, out of position constantly, slow to react to everything, distribution appalling. 
 

midfield need a grafter urgently as well, totally pedestrian. Spittal goss slattery and mckinstry are absolute powder puff.

We need to start playing football on the deck. Grafters, diving into tackles, running about like lunatics may appease many fans. But they can't create. It all starts at the back, then into midfield and then forward. Ffs it's not rocket science. We love to launch it 90% of the time. Football wise St Johnstone passed the ball better than us. We had the ball in the air most of the match. Chest high passes. S O'D even managed to kick the ball over the stand and he wasn't the only one. I do agree that the speed of thought with our centre backs is severely lacking. By the time they figure out what they're going to do the opposition is fully set and everyone is marked, quick pass into midfield is the answer. So up in the air it goes. Anyway, rant over. "Foot"ball should be played with the "foot".