Stuart Kettlewell discussion thread

[wellgirl]

4 minutes ago, Mad Dog said:

I'm very much on the rugby side of showing respect to referees, so I dislike SK's recent antics. However, are you suggesting that he has been shouting insults at the referees? I'm hundreds of miles away from Fir Park so could not hear what was said but I would suggest that it was along the lines of "that's a free-kick, sir", "there's a head injury", "how's that a yellow card?", etc. Perhaps with a few f*****gs thrown into the mix. I very much doubt that he was calling the referees c**ts and threatening to petrol bomb their houses.

Someone posted on here a few weeks ago and said that they sit near SK and he's always been very vocal - but no different to last year. They felt that he was being unfairly targeted by referees 

[wellon]

3 hours ago, wunderwell said:

The problem that I see is akin to when Stephen Robinson (who is well regarded) left.

It was clear to see on his final game that he had ran out of ideas on how to fix things.
His rebirth at St Mirren stands him in good stead but he could be in danger there of a similar scenario.

Kettlewell I think should be held in a similar regard, albeit not two cup finals.
The danger yet again though is there is a time when things potentially fizzle out

But Robbo was regularly criticised on here...it's the life of a manager.

There's probably not much to choose between us and St Mirren if we get strongest teams on park.

[ZT_1886]

I'm very much on the rugby side of showing respect to referees, so I dislike SK's recent antics. However, are you suggesting that he has been shouting insults at the referees? I'm hundreds of miles away from Fir Park so could not hear what was said but I would suggest that it was along the lines of "that's a free-kick, sir", "there's a head injury", "how's that a yellow card?", etc. Perhaps with a few f*****gs thrown into the mix. I very much doubt that he was calling the referees c**ts and threatening to petrol bomb their houses.

I understood his frustration on Saturday. Two identical fouls in the middle of the park. First one on the Motherwell player, no yellow card. 30 seconds later, same foul committed the other way round and a yellow card for Motherwell. I’d be raging on the touchline too. Kettlewell complains and gets booked.

Far too often though he goes unnecessarily overboard. Thankfully he won’t pick up any cards this weekend.

[wellon]

On 1/20/2025 at 8:35 PM, wellfan said:

It’s exactly what I mean. I’ve also called him a donkey on here on several occasions and described him as having the tactical nous of a cabbage or something similar.

On the topic of respect, I’m sure Kettlewell has said worse things to some referees lately, hence him receiving several yellow and red cards. 

I was close to him on Saturday,  he didn't say anything particularly disrespectful,  it was more getting in face of 4th official.

I'd rather he was passionate and animated , the officiating in Scotland is a different level of incompetence tbf, as long as he can afford the fines.

[numpty]

4 hours ago, Throughthelaces said:

We should ALWAYS have 11 Nasty buggers on the pitch

If that's ever our actual plan, I'm out for good.

[Throughthelaces]

1 minute ago, numpty said:

If that's ever our actual plan, I'm out for good.

You don't want us to be difficult to play against and a big physical unit? It's what our budget can afford and it gives us a better chance than whatever our current mob are doing

[santheman]

40 minutes ago, wellgirl said:

Someone posted on here a few weeks ago and said that they sit near SK and he's always been very vocal - but no different to last year. They felt that he was being unfairly targeted by referees 

That was me.

As a former Referee(many many moons ago) shouts from the touchline comes with the territory and you generally try to ignore it but the point I was making was that since his public outburst about Casey's ordering off he seems to have come more to the attention of the officials. How many cards has he had since then 2/3?.

Did anyone notice that after his yellow card on Saturday for 15mins afterwards every 50/50 seemed to go to St Johnstone?

A coincidence perhaps but that was what I used to do if the voices from the sidelines started to piss me off and believe me it always worked. They would either quieten down or work themselves up to a frenzy and a red card, either way it had the desired effect.

Kettlewell is very vocal but no more vocal than any other manager in the League with maybe a couple of exceptions and I've never heard him swear or be abusive but he certainly likes to challenge decisions that he thinks were wrong which should be his right of course.

 

[numpty]

23 minutes ago, Throughthelaces said:

You don't want us to be difficult to play against and a big physical unit?

Not if that's what it takes. I've seen plenty of Motherwell teams that were difficult to play against, and none of them were full of nasty players or big physical units.

[mfc]

25 minutes ago, Throughthelaces said:

You don't want us to be difficult to play against and a big physical unit? It's what our budget can afford and it gives us a better chance than whatever our current mob are doing

We're a professional football club,the least we should expect is players being comfortable enough to pass the ball too each other,it's a basic skill,budget shouldn't come into it.when it comes to playing through the midfield having your best player out injured is far from ideal but we have slattery who is decent on the ball and andrews looks the same when he was actually giving the ball in the second half at easter road,there is absolutely no reason why we shouldn't be passing the ball and players moving to give there team mate an option,we do the complete opposite and it can only be down to that's how the manager wants us to play.im all for having some big units in the team at centre half and a target man up front but the constant long ball and playing right Into the oppositions hands is nothing to do with budget.

[Spit_It_Out]

We just don't have any identity about us really but it puzzles me greatly why Kettlewell is convinced the way we are playing is the way forward it's not even about how horrible it is cause I for one wouldn't give a hoot how ugly it was if it was competing and picking up wins but it isn't.

We really are not doing anything in games until the 80th minute but by then we tend to be a goal or two down this is happening week after week after week.

I am expecting more of the same on Saturday cause we know he won't budge on formation  and play to the players strengths we have available.

It's a big game on Saturday pumped out the cup and if we lose to bottom club again the new boards balls are going to be tested cause Sligo part 2 is on the cards.

[wellgirl]

1 hour ago, Spit_It_Out said:

We just don't have any identity about us really but it puzzles me greatly why Kettlewell is convinced the way we are playing is the way forward it's not even about how horrible it is cause I for one wouldn't give a hoot how ugly it was if it was competing and picking up wins but it isn't.

We really are not doing anything in games until the 80th minute but by then we tend to be a goal or two down this is happening week after week after week.

I am expecting more of the same on Saturday cause we know he won't budge on formation  and play to the players strengths we have available.

It's a big game on Saturday pumped out the cup and if we lose to bottom club again the new boards balls are going to be tested cause Sligo part 2 is on the cards.

Alexander wasn't sacked though. I don't think Kettlewell will be. 

[Spit_It_Out]

6 minutes ago, wellgirl said:

Alexander wasn't sacked though. I don't think Kettlewell will be. 

I was meaning the hostlie crowd its really close to turning that which was the main reason Alexander left cause pretty sure the board at the time would have let him plod along fine and dandy.

Loosing back to back games against a very poor St Johnstone really wont cut it with alot of the fan base.

[Kmcalpin]

2 hours ago, ZT_1886 said:

I understood his frustration on Saturday. Two identical fouls in the middle of the park. First one on the Motherwell player, no yellow card. 30 seconds later, same foul committed the other way round and a yellow card for Motherwell. I’d be raging on the touchline too. Kettlewell complains and gets booked.

Far too often though he goes unnecessarily overboard. Thankfully he won’t pick up any cards this weekend.

In the great scheme of things, the referee's poor performance on Saturday wasn't a huge issue. We had other more pressing issues with which to contend. However, John Beaton was very inconsistent. Yes, I recall that very incident  which had many fans on their feet in protest.  I can't, in all honesty, blame SK for complaining about those decisions.

I'm one of those sad fans who dislike stealing yards at free kicks and throw ins and so take an interest in such decisions. Beaton constantly pulled up our players for stealing yardage at throw ins but blatantly failed to do so  with St Johnstone who were equally as guilty.  

[joewarkfanclub]

8 minutes ago, Spit_It_Out said:

I was meaning the hostlie crowd its really close to turning that which was the main reason Alexander left cause pretty sure the board at the time would have let him plod along fine and dandy.

Loosing back to back games against a very poor St Johnstone really wont cut it with alot of the fan base.

I think thats a fair point.

Alexander failed to learn a single thing from the Sligo home game and played exactly the same way in the away leg and got the same result.

If SK does the same, he should expect the wrath of the fabs to come down on him.

It would be an absolutely ludicrous thing to do.

[wellgirl]

33 minutes ago, Spit_It_Out said:

I was meaning the hostlie crowd its really close to turning that which was the main reason Alexander left cause pretty sure the board at the time would have let him plod along fine and dandy.

Loosing back to back games against a very poor St Johnstone really wont cut it with alot of the fan base.

He got booed once (Kettlewell) I've never booed a player or a manager and I've seen a lot of honking football over the last almost four decades 

So we get rid of a manager if the crowd boos them? Once? Surely not 

[wellgirl]

14 minutes ago, joewarkfanclub said:

I think thats a fair point.

Alexander failed to learn a single thing from the Sligo home game and played exactly the same way in the away leg and got the same result.

If SK does the same, he should expect the wrath of the fabs to come down on him.

It would be an absolutely ludicrous thing to do.

What happens if we change up the playing style and still lose? 

[joewarkfanclub]

2 hours ago, wellgirl said:

What happens if we change up the playing style and still lose? 

Fans will still be unhappy. But not on the same scale as they will if we go down doing the same thing and in the same gutless fashion.

Your loyalty to the club and the manager is admirable. But here is a question for you.

At what point does your critical thinking kick in and question whether he is still the right man for the job?

Or does he have your unwavering support regardless of the circumstances?

[wunderwell]

2 hours ago, wellgirl said:

He got booed once (Kettlewell) I've never booed a player or a manager and I've seen a lot of honking football over the last almost four decades 

So we get rid of a manager if the crowd boos them? Once? Surely not 

I've never booed any player or manager.
I suppose it's my own definition of the word supporter. Many will disagree though. Just not for me.
Booed plenty of referees though especially that wee idiot Colin Steven.

[wellgirl]

51 minutes ago, joewarkfanclub said:

Fans will still be unhappy. But not on the same scale as they will if we go down doing the same thing and in the same gutless fashion.

Your loyalty to the club and the manager is admirable. But here is a question for you.

At what point does your critical thinking kick in and question whether he is still the right man for the job?

Or does he have your unwavering support regardless of the circumstances?

To the second point - no. 

The first - I'm honestly not sure - there's not a defining line in the sand for me if that makes sense - like if we are 9th - he's got to go. 

Im not happy with the performances either just now btw 

It's hard to explain. I do like Kettlewell and if he goes I'll be sorry - but it won't be down to me 

 

[wellgirl]

6 minutes ago, wunderwell said:

I've never booed any player or manager.
I suppose it's my own definition of the word supporter. Many will disagree though. Just not for me.
Booed plenty of referees though especially that wee idiot Colin Steven.

I've booed referees too

[wellfan]

7 hours ago, Mad Dog said:

Name-calling is not the same thing as debating, not by a long stretch.

Correct. What I did do was refer to Kettlewell as a donkey and exclaimed that he should get to fuck on a fans forum. I didn't perform the act of name-calling him to his face. It's him that gets in peoples faces and shouts like a madman on the touchline. 

7 hours ago, Mad Dog said:

I'm very much on the rugby side of showing respect to referees, so I dislike SK's recent antics. However, are you suggesting that he has been shouting insults at the referees? I'm hundreds of miles away from Fir Park so could not hear what was said but I would suggest that it was along the lines of "that's a free-kick, sir", "there's a head injury", "how's that a yellow card?", etc. Perhaps with a few f*****gs thrown into the mix. I very much doubt that he was calling the referees c**ts and threatening to petrol bomb their houses.

He's been been getting exasperated, leading to him shouting and getting in the face of officials. He's a marked man and should know better by now. I'm sure he's also suggested that the officials get to fuck at times and called them worse than a donkey or a cabbage or whatever. 

6 hours ago, wellon said:

I was close to him on Saturday,  he didn't say anything particularly disrespectful,  it was more getting in face of 4th official.

I'd rather he was passionate and animated , the officiating in Scotland is a different level of incompetence tbf, as long as he can afford the fines.

His passion isn't to be faulted. However, as a marked man, he needs to better control and express himself as his card count is getting embarrassing now. 

[dennyc]

2 hours ago, wellgirl said:

What happens if we change up the playing style and still lose? 

We will at least have seen evidence of a Manager that is willing to change things up after some woeful performances. Not one or two woeful performances but too many over the season, including that pathetic cup SF. For some that willingness to change will be a step forward. Might even be enough for those that want to support Kettlewell but currently have serious doubts. Like me.

Despite what is promoted on here by some, although a few have been irrationally anti Kettlewell from day one, not everybody wants SK out as of now.  But what the false narrative does is deflect from what has been evident for some time and came to a head in Perth. Throw in the injury situation, league position, the youth of some players, officiating, even Graeme Alexander to the discussion and the current issues that are concerning folk are pushed aside. Deliberately or otherwise. History is history and cannot be changed. Where we are headed is the point.

On Saturday, yet again, we saw a passive beginning handing the initiative to our opponents. Yet again we saw a formation and approach that exposed the weaknesses of certain players as they are asked to play roles for which they are not suited. Yet again we saw substitutions that had no effect and we saw little leadership on and off the pitch.  Even more worrying, for the first time this season we saw numerous players arguing with each other, questioning Managerial decisions, showing less than 100% commitment, hiding when teammates needed a get out ball,  and a bunch of players being told to F@@@ Off when they approached fans at the end of the game. Fans who have supported them through good and bad, Bois included. And not in small numbers.

So in response to your question, I do not know what happens if we change and lose. That could well happen.

I do know for sure that if we witness no change and lose, then things will become even more toxic. What fans are desperate to see is a willingness by SK to adapt our approach, send out a team in a formation that at the very least gives us the hope of a win. The players for their part need to show the unity, energy and belief that has been evident in some recent home matches. 

I was shocked....but not really that surprised.....by the reaction at full time in Perth. SK, his coaching staff and the players also looked stunned. Hopefully that will have opened a few eyes within the Club and we reset our season starting Saturday. Surely we cannot continue as we are? It's not too late and we can still have a good season. But fans need to regain hope and belief. SK has a huge part to play in that. It won't be easy

 

 

 

 

[Kmcalpin]

To put things in perspective, I was talking to Joewarkthelegend earlier in the week. We've both been going to Fir Park for decades and we agreed that last Saturday's cup performance was the worst we'd witnessed for many many years. That's how poor it was. 

We're hoping for changes this Saturday, but above all, a change in attitude both on and off the pitch. 

[wellgirl]

59 minutes ago, dennyc said:

We will at least have seen evidence of a Manager that is willing to change things up after some woeful performances. Not one or two woeful performances but too many over the season, including that pathetic cup SF. For some that willingness to change will be a step forward. Might even be enough for those that want to support Kettlewell but currently have serious doubts. Like me.

Despite what is promoted on here by some, although a few have been irrationally anti Kettlewell from day one, not everybody wants SK out as of now.  But what the false narrative does is deflect from what has been evident for some time and came to a head in Perth. Throw in the injury situation, league position, the youth of some players, officiating, even Graeme Alexander to the discussion and the current issues that are concerning folk are pushed aside. Deliberately or otherwise. History is history and cannot be changed. Where we are headed is the point.

On Saturday, yet again, we saw a passive beginning handing the initiative to our opponents. Yet again we saw a formation and approach that exposed the weaknesses of certain players as they are asked to play roles for which they are not suited. Yet again we saw substitutions that had no effect and we saw little leadership on and off the pitch.  Even more worrying, for the first time this season we saw numerous players arguing with each other, questioning Managerial decisions, showing less than 100% commitment, hiding when teammates needed a get out ball,  and a bunch of players being told to F@@@ Off when they approached fans at the end of the game. Fans who have supported them through good and bad, Bois included. And not in small numbers.

So in response to your question, I do not know what happens if we change and lose. That could well happen.

I do know for sure that if we witness no change and lose, then things will become even more toxic. What fans are desperate to see is a willingness by SK to adapt our approach, send out a team in a formation that at the very least gives us the hope of a win. The players for their part need to show the unity, energy and belief that has been evident in some recent home matches. 

I was shocked....but not really that surprised.....by the reaction at full time in Perth. SK, his coaching staff and the players also looked stunned. Hopefully that will have opened a few eyes within the Club and we reset our season starting Saturday. Surely we cannot continue as we are? It's not too late and we can still have a good season. But fans need to regain hope and belief. SK has a huge part to play in that. It won't be easy

 

 

 

 

Im personally not trying to push anyones concerns aside - and I never have. I could say more but Im not sure I'd express what I want to say well so I'll leave it at that 

[MelvinBragg]

2 minutes ago, Kmcalpin said:

To put things in perspective, I was talking to Joewarkthelegend earlier in the week. We've both been going to Fir Park for decades and we agreed that last Saturday's cup performance was the worst we'd witnessed for many many years. That's how poor it was. 

I was working so wasn't at the game, Dave, so will have to take your word for it. Must have been pretty bad if it was worse than Hammell's last game at Raith Rovers...