Stuart Kettlewell discussion thread

[Benson]

6 minutes ago, ppower said:

Just in and saw Kettlewell had resigned due to fan abuse. Jeez, that's a convenient scapegoat. Abuse goes hand in hand with a football manager. Fans pay hard earned cash in the current cost of living crisis and they go to FP for some pleasure and maybe be entertained which his team tactics couldn't provide. They are entitled to voice their displeasure. He had obviously lost the dressing room, arguments with players, throwing players under the bus in interviews, tombola football, blaming everyone but himself. Happy to take the plaudits when we won but it was everyone else's fault when we lose. Then after the last two horrendous results he turned on the fans. To be honest he should have been gone during last seasons long losing run. He has signed only two players who had a touch of skill and brought that to show, Maswanhise and Theo Bair last season. The rest of his signings you wouldn't get a balloon for. Ultimately it was his style of non football that the fans couldn't stomach any longer. We are the worst football playing team in the league and the last two games against the bottom team just brought it fully into focus. I wish him no ill, but if the board had the guts they would have sacked him before today. Either way he will walk with a severance package.

There's abuse and a different level of abuse we don't know the full story oh and it's an alleged fall out with a player not unless you're the one with inside information. 

[grizzlyg]

Wasn't at Perth games so can't comment but what would he expect come full time. Of course there will be unhappy fans and he told us all last week he has been in game a long time so sadly that comes with the package.

If fans have overstepped mark they can stay away as far as I am concerned but if Kettlewell really cared about club why through full fanbase under the bus?  Basically deflecting from his own performances.

I backed him a lot so this isn't a case of delighted he went although I feel it is right decision from him.

A lot of fans need to look at own behaviour also but I don't think thst will stop candidates. 

Kettlewell will get plenty media offers,  if on sportscene look forward to it being a 3hr highlights package!!

I wish him well though,  I never gave him personal abuse, constructive criticism yes...but I never crossed over the line 

[FirParkCornerExile]

1 hour ago, Clackscat said:

I think the 'abuse' bit is a convenient scapegoat.

He's realised he can't turn this round so he is going now to protect the legacy of the good things he has done, unsullied by a potential relegation battle, now leaving a club that has backed him to the hilt in the transfer market managerless with only a week to go in the window.

That Daily Record piece could have been written by SK himself, all the positives, none of the negatives.

 

That is a very distinct possibility and his mates in the media will ensure that's the narrative.

[FirParkCornerExile]

1 hour ago, MJC said:

A lot of human beings are deplorable. And nasty, spiteful and in some cases downright evil.

But I don't think that that applies solely to Motherwell fans.

Correct Clement continues to receive abuse and the Aberdeen fans still abuse Goodwin and actually chuck missiles at him. 

[FirParkCornerExile]

1 hour ago, Richie said:

The Daily Record is saying we're going for Robinson.

If this isnt a wind up post - The Daily Record prints shite and SR would give us a two fingered salute.

[Spit_It_Out]

Have a watch of the games vs St Johnstone via Goggsy on you tube you can hear fuck you Kettlewell maybe Kettlewell get tae fuck some other stuff you cant make out.

After he called out  fans with his walking in my shoes rant i am pretty sure the league game and the manner we lost at St Johnstone it would have got very personal i wasnt there but suspect folk would have been pretty bealing.

I would also like to add Halliday got a fuck off aswell

 

[santheman]

Frail is an interesting one.

I wonder if he supported Kettlewells tactics or whether he just went with the flow.

Looks like he's very popular with the players at least.

It'll be interesting to see what kind of team and formation he puts out in the next 2 games assuming of course he is asked to do that.

If its major changes then I think we can assume that he and Kettlewell might not have been on the same page.

[FirParkCornerExile]

1 hour ago, weeyin said:

Time to bring in Simo with that expansive, attractive football that's being played in Perth?

 

nah he looks like Mrs Doubtfire lol

[El Grew]

1 hour ago, stv said:

He is probably a good coach  but not manager material . Too one dimentional with formations and no inspirational flair to go for the win from the kickoff or when we went a goal up against teams we should be going for. His style of football was brutal. His panic buying poor.

Still wish him all the best where ever he ends up. Tried his best but ran out of ideas.

I think that’s the nub of the matter - he’s a coach not a manager and there’s a huge difference.

If he and his family have been experiencing personal abuse from our supporters then that is to be utterly condemned. I used to have a season ticket in the centre stand section above the dugouts and you wouldn’t believe some of the abuse that comes from there so if his family have attended games recently it’s quite likely they’ll have heard some of this.

However I doubt very much that this would be sufficient to force him to resign. As some have posted it does appear to be the lot of being a football manager - look at the abuse the Spurs fans have been giving Postecoglu recently.

In the past weeks as results weren’t in his favour he did show signs that he was feeling the pressure of the job - regularly arguing with match officials, getting yellow cards, a red card leading to a touchline ban and rumours of a bust-up with a senior player at half-time during the recent cup tie at Perth.

For me I think perhaps deep down he sensed that his direction of travel with the club wasn’t going the way he would’ve liked and that maybe he wasn’t able to get the players up and onside with him anymore.

I wish him all the very best for the future but if he’s being honest with himself then perhaps he’d be better suited to a coaching position or assistant manager.

[FirParkCornerExile]

1 hour ago, Ya Bezzer! said:

I never said it did.

However the ones who are should be called out.

I said after Alexander we would struggle to attract good managers to the club and we have struggled.  Now it's happened again.

What does the future hold for us when managers are rewarded with hatred for what is to all extent and purposes, relative success?

This has become a trend and if it continues we are going to be the worse for it.

Mate you are being naive if you think this doesn't happen at all clubs when fans aint happy. I'm not trying to defend abuse but its the nature of the beast and every player and manager knows it. It wont stop anyone whose genuinely interested from taking the job.

[Lobey_Dosser]

I’ve got mixed emotions about today’s surprise announcement. This may not be a common opinion but I found Kettlewell to be one of our most likeable managers and he undoubtedly worked his socks off for the club. I’ll always hold him in high regard for inheriting a shambles from our most incompetent manager in my 35+ years going to Fir Park and turning our fortunes around overnight. From there we got to see really good talents like Max, Furlong, KVV, Gent, Spittal, Bair and Miller flourish and earn us a good few quid in return. Moreover, despite the poor runs and cup exits, there have been some excellent performances and we ran Rangers and Celtic close with a refreshing regularity. The win at Ibrox is one we all craved. 

I try and not read too much into press conferences but it’s been evident since mid-late November that his demeanour has been changing and his patience thinning. First he was having a go at the referees, then the players, then finally the fans. Who knows what goes on in the background but I suspect that some relationships with players and/or staff have been deteriorating and indeed recent comments would suggest he’s felt let down by a few. 

On day one of the job, Kettlewell was clear that he didn’t want any passengers in the building. Ultimately though, we’ve ended up with a bloated squad of 31 and I don’t think Kettlewell will have been comfortable with that. 

I’ll reserve comment on the abuse, I just hope it was mostly down to the goons online and that he and his family weren’t exposed to anything severe in person. Good luck to him going forward. Whilst he’s had a parting shot at the fans he does appear to have stepped away at the right time rather than let this current slide continue for another month or so.  I don’t envy the remit of the next incumbent. 

[johnstone]

End of the day the optics of this in the media for the club are horrendous. 

I can’t imagine Kettlewell made this decision lightly so I would tend to believe that the abuse has been more than just fans shouting from the stands.

I am usually in the east stand and have certainly not heard much against him. 

So you have to think that this goes further and maybe is social media abuse?

End of the day it looks awful for us and is not going to help attract a new manger or players to the club.

[FirParkCornerExile]

1 hour ago, MJC said:

Certain media outlets now running with the headlines that Kettlewell walked due to “fan abuse”. 

of course they are , it makes headlines and the media all look after their mates in football. That why no cunt who is dreadful is ever short of a gig. Again, I don't know how bad it was and it should be condemned if it happened but you can rest assured the media will not give balance , it will ALL be the fans fault cos that agenda suits. 

[MJC]

4 minutes ago, FirParkCornerExile said:

of course they are , it makes headlines and the media all look after their mates in football. That why no cunt who is dreadful is ever short of a gig. Again, I don't know how bad it was and it should be condemned if it happened but you can rest assured the media will not give balance , it will ALL be the fans fault cos that agenda suits. 

Correct and as you rightly pointed out Rangers fans have been and still are abusing Clement and Aberdeen fans have subjected their ex manager to physical abuse recently as well as numerous occasions when they have turned on their own managers. McGhee being one of them despite being a club legend up there. 
 

But of course you will never hear the media rounding on them like this and you can guarantee that had Kettlewell been Aberdeen manager and left blaming the fans then the way it would have been reported would have been very differently, especially from BBC Scotland.

We are a much easier target however. 

[santheman]

10 minutes ago, FirParkCornerExile said:

To a degree , he might also be pointing at the easiest target other than himself. I cant comment on the personal abuse as I never witnessed it but it shouldn't happen. There is also the possibility he had lost the dressing room and could see the writing on the wall , so chuck it with a record on paper that stands up and blame everyone else and his future employment is safeguarded. We will never know the truth.

Aye there's that and he is very adept at using the media to his advantage so shifting the blame onto the fans would leave him looking like the wronged party.

Maybe he's overstated the level of abuse but there's certainly been some personal stuff directed at him which I've witnessed personally  that was out of order.

As you say we'll never know what's been said between him and the Board.

Either or I just don't think the inevitable  headlines will leave us looking in a very good light as a club.

[FirParkCornerExile]

Just now, santheman said:

Aye there's that and he is very adept at using the media to his advantage so shifting the blame onto the fans would leave him looking like the wronged party.

Maybe he's overstated the level of abuse but there's certainly been some personal stuff directed at him which I've witnessed personally  that was out of order.

As you say we'll never know what's been said between him and the Board.

Either or I just don't think the inevitable  headlines will leave us looking in a very good light as a club.

its football, its tomorrows chip paper and please don't consider that's me condoning any personal abuse of SK. I think he worked very hard for us but what we watched for most of his tenure would turn you to stone. For me he had the Ross County and Dundee game to show me something different but we will now never know.

[FirParkCornerExile]

12 minutes ago, johnstone said:

End of the day the optics of this in the media for the club are horrendous. 

I can’t imagine Kettlewell made this decision lightly so I would tend to believe that the abuse has been more than just fans shouting from the stands.

I am usually in the east stand and have certainly not heard much against him. 

So you have to think that this goes further and maybe is social media abuse?

End of the day it looks awful for us and is not going to help attract a new manger or players to the club.

Wont affect who we go for or who'd likely take it one iota.

[Villageman]

Probably be accused of being a cynic but Kettlewell for me has chosen to use  abuse rather than criticism albeit severe at times lately. Suits the narrative of every ones fault but mine.

[star sail]

25 minutes ago, MJC said:

Correct and as you rightly pointed out Rangers fans have been and still are abusing Clement and Aberdeen fans have subjected their ex manager to physical abuse recently as well as numerous occasions when they have turned on their own managers. McGhee being one of them despite being a club legend up there. 
 

But of course you will never hear the media rounding on them like this and you can guarantee that had Kettlewell been Aberdeen manager and left blaming the fans then the way it would have been reported would have been very differently, especially from BBC Scotland.

We are a much easier target however. 

The media is reporting it as fans abuse because Kettlewell has cited that as his reason for leaving and this has been confirmed by Brian Caldwell.

The media are simply reporting on what has actually happened. 

As your post suggests, the behaviour of football fans of all clubs can be poor and Motherwell are no exception. A true race to the bottom.

We have been called on it by the man who has taken the verbal beating this time round.

We cannot pretend that this abuse does not exist towards Kettlewell.As a poster above mentioned, you just have to listen to YouTube footage to hear the vitriol.  Listen to the footage from Perth and it can be heard clearly. It's fairly disgusting.

Let's, at the very least, not play the victim.

 

[wellon]

49 minutes ago, ppower said:

Just in and saw Kettlewell had resigned due to fan abuse. Jeez, that's a convenient scapegoat. Abuse goes hand in hand with a football manager. Fans pay hard earned cash in the current cost of living crisis and they go to FP for some pleasure and maybe be entertained which his team tactics couldn't provide. They are entitled to voice their displeasure. He had obviously lost the dressing room, arguments with players, throwing players under the bus in interviews, tombola football, blaming everyone but himself. Happy to take the plaudits when we won but it was everyone else's fault when we lose. Then after the last two horrendous results he turned on the fans. To be honest he should have been gone during last seasons long losing run. He has signed only two players who had a touch of skill and brought that to show, Maswanhise and Theo Bair last season. The rest of his signings you wouldn't get a balloon for. Ultimately it was his style of non football that the fans couldn't stomach any longer. We are the worst football playing team in the league and the last two games against the bottom team just brought it fully into focus. I wish him no ill, but if the board had the guts they would have sacked him before today. Either way he will walk with a severance package.

That's quite a selective appraisal...you don't know what was being shouted so you can't say fans have the right to abuse....criticise yep, but paying in shouldn't give you a free pass to hurl personal stuff....that's fitba fans tho, entitled .

[grizzlyg]

I hear comments about SK putting everything into the club and great affection.   I don't think anyone can deny that, he would be fully committed.

But if he cares about club why come out with a comment about the personal abuse?  He could have said 'a section of the fans'  plus he hasn't said his family were getting abuse.  Sounds like family upset with him getting abuse which of course is totally understandable.

I just feel he has left and left club without a name.  Board were loyal to him last season which he tends to forget.   His stubborn attitude has cost him and I'll advised comments. 

But again,  those giving out the nasty personal abuse have no place at Fir Park but I never heard much in Hunter Stand 

[eddiemunster]

Personally I think the personal abuse is bang out of order, even if his maw is a cow.

[Mootherwell86]

I’m already fed up of this chat. In an ideal world we would have kept SK until the end of season, shook his hand, wished him well and moved on. He’s done a very good job in tenure and I suspect he’s well outperformed what’s expected of him from the board. 

There’s no doubt we have a large selection of brain donors in our support, although as others have mentioned we’re absolutely no different to any other club. That being said, I am skeptical of Kettlewells reasoning behind his resignation. 

What is it that our fans actually expect? Aberdeen, Dundee United, Hearts and Hibs have all struggled over the course of SKs tenure to varying degrees despite spending vast amounts more than us. Keep seeing ‘style of play’ batted around, do any of the aforementioned teams play with an attractive style and concurrently accumulate more points than us?  Personally, I’d settle for being organised, difficult to play against and positive. Is that too much to ask? 

I won’t defend some of our powderpuff, toothless performances. The last 4 away games have been horrific. A lack of urgency, desire and ambition has left me fairly scunnered. 

As for talk of losing the dressing room and the rumoured bust-up with Dan Casey, that’s football. My gripe would be more with the player than the manager. In this instance, fans should’ve stuck by the manager and trusted his judgement, Dan Casey has been consistently part of the one of the worst defences in the league over the last 2 seasons. Dan Casey would’ve been better served organising his box and defending set pieces rather than handing out tactical advice at half time in Perth.

I suspect, that there will be fans of all clubs in our league that are similarly disillusioned with the product on display and that the clubs will ultimately bear the brunt of this. In reality, the standard of Scottish football as a whole is absolutely rotten. In fact it’s that poor, our fifth best team has just signed a striker on-loan from the worst team in League 2. Perhaps expectations need to tempered? 

I’m not particularly fussed that SK has decided to leave but I am concerned that in the bigger picture,  we will be here again in 18 months time. 
 

Not a good day for our club.

[wellup83]

Personally I would like to wish Kettlewell all the best for the future. I don't believe for a second that his family have received direct abuse from our support but at Stuart himself will be a different matter. That surely goes with the territory as unfortunate as it is. It sounds more like an excuse to deflect from the situation on the pitch to me.

[Mortonhallwell]

8 minutes ago, Mootherwell86 said:

I’m already fed up of this chat. In an ideal world we would have kept SK until the end of season, shook his hand, wished him well and moved on. He’s done a very good job in tenure and I suspect he’s well outperformed what’s expected of him from the board. 

There’s no doubt we have a large selection of brain donors in our support, although as others have mentioned we’re absolutely no different to any other club. That being said, I am skeptical of Kettlewells reasoning behind his resignation. 

What is it that our fans actually expect? Aberdeen, Dundee United, Hearts and Hibs have all struggled over the course of SKs tenure to varying degrees despite spending vast amounts more than us. Keep seeing ‘style of play’ batted around, do any of the aforementioned teams play with an attractive style and concurrently accumulate more points than us?  Personally, I’d settle for being organised, difficult to play against and positive. Is that too much to ask? 

I won’t defend some of our powderpuff, toothless performances. The last 4 away games have been horrific. A lack of urgency, desire and ambition has left me fairly scunnered. 

As for talk of losing the dressing room and the rumoured bust-up with Dan Casey, that’s football. My gripe would be more with the player than the manager. In this instance, fans should’ve stuck by the manager and trusted his judgement, Dan Casey has been consistently part of the one of the worst defences in the league over the last 2 seasons. Dan Casey would’ve been better served organising his box and defending set pieces rather than handing out tactical advice at half time in Perth.

I suspect, that there will be fans of all clubs in our league that are similarly disillusioned with the product on display and that the clubs will ultimately bear the brunt of this. In reality, the standard of Scottish football as a whole is absolutely rotten. In fact it’s that poor, our fifth best team has just signed a striker on-loan from the worst team in League 2. Perhaps expectations need to tempered? 

I’m not particularly fussed that SK has decided to leave but I am concerned that in the bigger picture,  we will be here again in 18 months time. 
 

Not a good day for our club.

Great post. Totally agree.