bobbybingo Posted November 2, 2023 Report Share Posted November 2, 2023 44 minutes ago, smiddy said: the point i am making is if your 2nd choice goalie isnt up to it,,,, then find another 2nd choice goalie that will at least give you something to think about, cause on kellys current form if steve clarke watched him he would be no where near the squad, watch killie shell long high balls into our box on sat for big vassell, and count how many kelly deals with I know what you're saying. My point is, most teams, including us, can't afford to spend much of their budget on back up goalies they hope won't be needed, so you'll probably find they're not on a par with the first choice guy. A decent goalkeeper like Mark Gillespie might be content to sit on the sidelines and watch his career drift away at Newcastle, but you won't see anyone of that standard happy to get splinters in his arse at Fir Park on our wages. I said earlier, Kettlewell doesn't have many sellable assets, but Kelly's one of them. We'll see what he thinks of Oxborough if/when he's sold, which could well be in January. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
well_said Posted November 2, 2023 Report Share Posted November 2, 2023 2 hours ago, David said: What gives you so much confidence in Oxborough? He could be absolutely honking. He might be better. It's not a high bar to be honest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grizzlyg Posted November 2, 2023 Report Share Posted November 2, 2023 Kelly wasn't great last night but wasn't the worst. As with all teams there are players who get more criticism than others who can get away with more. Actually one of our poorest players in recent games has been Casey but hopefully with Butcher back he will get back to his best 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jastons Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 15 hours ago, bobbybingo said: I said earlier, Kettlewell doesn't have many sellable assets, but Kelly's one of them. We'll see what he thinks of Oxborough if/when he's sold, which could well be in January. Another poster said Kelly was out of contract next summer. Good luck finding someone willing to pay for him in January... It won't turn him into Peter Schmichel but he could actually try releasing the ball quicker and a bit more accurately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbybingo Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 27 minutes ago, Jastons said: Another poster said Kelly was out of contract next summer. Good luck finding someone willing to pay for him in January... It won't turn him into Peter Schmichel but he could actually try releasing the ball quicker and a bit more accurately. They have to be working on his distribution, because it's awful. Between that and coming out for cross balls etc, he looks increasingly nervous to me - as does the whole defence. The Stevie Woods effect? His form's definitely not what it was, but will Kettlewell drop him if he's not totally convinced about Oxborough? We saw where chopping and changing goalies got Dundee Utd last season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wellsince75 Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 I've got a great deal of empathy for Kelly. He's the last line of defence and should have much better support from the rest of the team. Yes I think he could have done better with some of the goals recently but as I see it, he's offered very little protection. Examples from last 2 games. Wilkinson up front. Nothing stuck, he gave the ball away. Teams have been walking through the midfield with very little to stop them. Defenssively basic errors, not marking and not defending the 6 yard box. Our keeper doesn't deal with with crosses, we know this but he makes up for it in other qualities. He needs to take some accountability but we're not losing games because of him. Be careful what you wish for, assuming we can get a better keeper than someone who's kicking around the Scotland squad is a dangerous assumption to make. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
couttsy Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 3 hours ago, wellsince75 said: I've got a great deal of empathy for Kelly. He's the last line of defence and should have much better support from the rest of the team. Yes I think he could have done better with some of the goals recently but as I see it, he's offered very little protection. Examples from last 2 games. Wilkinson up front. Nothing stuck, he gave the ball away. Teams have been walking through the midfield with very little to stop them. Defenssively basic errors, not marking and not defending the 6 yard box. Our keeper doesn't deal with with crosses, we know this but he makes up for it in other qualities. He needs to take some accountability but we're not losing games because of him. Be careful what you wish for, assuming we can get a better keeper than someone who's kicking around the Scotland squad is a dangerous assumption to make. Completely agree with the watch what you wish for comment. Kelly is going through a poor patch of form, although arguably from my perspective only the 4th goal on Wed night should sit at his door in terms of a bad mistake. Those of us who’ve sat through the Samson’s, Hollis’s, Twardzik’s and Nielsen’s of the world know only too well that it’s not always easy to find a decent keeper! Kelly is far from our biggest issue right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grizzlyg Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 2 minutes ago, couttsy said: Completely agree with the watch what you wish for comment. Kelly is going through a poor patch of form, although arguably from my perspective only the 4th goal on Wed night should sit at his door in terms of a bad mistake. Those of us who’ve sat through the Samson’s, Hollis’s, Twardzik’s and Nielsen’s of the world know only too well that it’s not always easy to find a decent keeper! Kelly is far from our biggest issue right now. And those that are old enough to remember the mid 1980's will remember John Gardiner!!. Believe me....Kelly is not as bad as a lot of previous keepers 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steelman1991 Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 5 minutes ago, grizzlyg said: And those that are old enough to remember the mid 1980's will remember John Gardiner!!. Believe me....Kelly is not as bad as a lot of previous keepers Why??????..........................just WHY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grizzlyg Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 Just now, steelman1991 said: Why??????..........................just WHY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 1987 cup Replay v Hearts.....I was a heartbroken 15 year old that night as I was convinced we would win the cup that year. Gardiner howler still etched on my brain 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
couttsy Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 14 minutes ago, grizzlyg said: And those that are old enough to remember the mid 1980's will remember John Gardiner!!. Believe me....Kelly is not as bad as a lot of previous keepers Haha remember him well unfortunately! Although in my opinion Stevie Woods is the all time worst in my lifetime! Hadnt thought about it before but it seems like we’ve either had really good or really bad goalkeepers over the last 30/40 years, not much in between! Good = Goram, Ruddy, Randolph, Gillespie, Carson and Kelly. Bad = Woods, Gardner, Howie, Dubourdeau, Marshall and the others I mentioned earlier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wellsince75 Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 1 minute ago, couttsy said: Haha remember him well unfortunately! Although in my opinion Stevie Woods is the all time worst in my lifetime! Hadnt thought about it before but it seems like we’ve either had really good or really bad goalkeepers over the last 30/40 years, not much in between! Good = Ruddy, Randolph, Gillespie, Carson and Kelly. Bad = Woods, Gardner, Howie, Dubourdeau, Marshall and the others I mentioned earlier. Two that I remember with fondness Hugh Sproat and Big Sieb. Any keeper willing to swing on the bar or ready to destroy anyone who came into his box is a winner in my eyes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grizzlyg Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 1 minute ago, couttsy said: Haha remember him well unfortunately! Although in my opinion Stevie Woods is the all time worst in my lifetime! Hadnt thought about it before but it seems like we’ve either had really good or really bad goalkeepers over the last 30/40 years, not much in between! Good = Goram, Ruddy, Randolph, Gillespie, Carson and Kelly. Bad = Woods, Gardner, Howie, Dubourdeau, Marshall and the others I mentioned earlier. A bit like our left backs, never had an average one.....just outstanding or rank rotten!! 🤪🤪 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grizzlyg Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 Just now, wellsince75 said: Two that I remember with fondness Hugh Sproat and Big Sieb. Any keeper willing to swing on the bar or ready to destroy anyone who came into his box is a winner in my eyes. Shug wearing green top v Rangers and Blue Top v Sellik...... legend 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
well_said Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 31 minutes ago, couttsy said: Completely agree with the watch what you wish for comment. Kelly is going through a poor patch of form, although arguably from my perspective only the 4th goal on Wed night should sit at his door in terms of a bad mistake. Those of us who’ve sat through the Samson’s, Hollis’s, Twardzik’s and Nielsen’s of the world know only too well that it’s not always easy to find a decent keeper! Kelly is far from our biggest issue right now. Lots of us have also sat through Randolph, Ruddy, Carson and Gillespie . Kelly is much nearer the list of goalkeepers you mention than my list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
couttsy Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 9 minutes ago, well_said said: Lots of us have also sat through Randolph, Ruddy, Carson and Gillespie . Kelly is much nearer the list of goalkeepers you mention than my list. Think we might need to agree to disagree there! Whilst Kelly is not in the Randolph/Ruddy class, maybe not even Gillespie, but he’s a million miles from the duds in my original list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
well_said Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 10 minutes ago, couttsy said: Think we might need to agree to disagree there! Whilst Kelly is not in the Randolph/Ruddy class, maybe not even Gillespie, but he’s a million miles from the duds in my original list. Fair enough Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ropy Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 On 11/2/2023 at 12:13 AM, Jastons said: Only thing the ref got right all night was booking the Aberdeen player for waving an imaginary card Did this happen? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grizzlyg Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 6 minutes ago, ropy said: Did this happen? Dont remember that but if it was case it must have been Shinnie.... horrible annoying character Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ropy Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 17 minutes ago, grizzlyg said: Dont remember that but if it was case it must have been Shinnie.... horrible annoying character Their keeper got booked in what could only be described as a token yellow card because he wasn’t really time wasting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grizzlyg Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 26 minutes ago, ropy said: Their keeper got booked in what could only be described as a token yellow card because he wasn’t really time wasting. Funnily enough my mate and I said same thing. Was as if ref felt he had to book a dons player Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kmcalpin Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 1 hour ago, ropy said: Did this happen? Not to my knowledge. Shinnie didn't book the ref. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grizzlyg Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 10 minutes ago, Kmcalpin said: Not to my knowledge. Shinnie didn't book the ref. Good one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kmcalpin Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 Having seen a few keepers in my time at Fir Park I'd rate Kelly at about a 6.5 or 7 out of ten. Slightly better than average. A lot were worse, a good few have been better. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretzel Posted November 3, 2023 Report Share Posted November 3, 2023 Speaking of keepers who were Lillian Gish, I noticed Craig Samson is the Aberdeen GK coach, he was with Hibs and Sunderland with Jack Ross. Any shot that wasn't straight at him usually ended up in the net. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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