St Johnstone v Motherwell 07/11/2023

[SteelmaninOZ]

The pp game think we might scrape a win here god knows we need one to restore the faith. 
Let’s get behind SK and the team.

Since I was young I followed on Motherwell fc THE team for me….

[MJC]

With certain defeats to Hearts and Celtic looming after this one then anything but a win here will confirm 100% that we are in serious relegation trouble and should spell the end for Stuart Kettlewell.

Needless to say I can’t see us getting the much needed win.

0-0

[wellsince75]

I'm hoping we return to winning ways - 3 points will make a huge difference 

I'd set the team up as  3-5-2 or 5-3-2 depending how you look at it.   This is due to personnel rather than any benefit/magical formation. 

Several players could be replaced and it's an either/or situation. 

The way I see it is I'd have players in their natural positions and go back to a formation that everyone is familiar with. 

                                              Kelly/Oxborough 

                         McGinn                 Butcher                   Casey 

Spencer             Slattery/Spittal       Davor/Miller         Paton    Gent

                                   Bair/Wilkinson/Shaw      Mika 

                                      

   

[bobbybingo]

Take it McGinn will be out. Kettlewell was talking about a possible fractured cheekbone - and 2 broken hooters (Butcher and?)

[Kmcalpin]

I assume that both Butcher and McGinn will be out for this one, and possibly Miller too, given the battering he suffered against Aberdeen. My plea is that whatever formation we set out with on paper, we play with 2 strikers playing close together on the park and to support them from  midfield. Oh, and to play round pegs in round holes. 

[Mad Dog]

There's talk that Craig Levein will be named as their new manager ahead of the game. Not sure if that is a good thing or not.

[wellfan]

If we lose this, I see no road back for Kettlewell. 

[couttsy]

2 hours ago, wellsince75 said:

I'm hoping we return to winning ways - 3 points will make a huge difference 

I'd set the team up as  3-5-2 or 5-3-2 depending how you look at it.   This is due to personnel rather than any benefit/magical formation. 

Several players could be replaced and it's an either/or situation. 

The way I see it is I'd have players in their natural positions and go back to a formation that everyone is familiar with. 

                                              Kelly/Oxborough 

                         McGinn                 Butcher                   Casey 

Spencer             Slattery/Spittal       Davor/Miller         Paton    Gent

                                   Bair/Wilkinson/Shaw      Mika 

                                      

   

Yeh, I agree wellsince75, we know that we have a core that are good enough for this league Kelly, Butcher, Casey, McGinn, Spencer, Spittal, Slattery, Paton, Biereth, and whilst some of them have been playing poorly recently, I think we have to persevere with them.

Just need to work out who the other 2 should be. I’d go Gent and Bair. Gent as he’ll give us better balance and allow us to get Spencer on the right where I think he’ll be more effective, and Bair as he’s probably the best foil for Biereth.
 

If McGinn and/or Butcher are missing then Blaney followed by Mugabi to come in. 

[wellfan]

9 minutes ago, couttsy said:

and Bair as he’s probably the best foil for Biereth.

In a weird case of what feels a bit like Stockholm Syndrome, but that's not quite the correct analogy here, the more games that pass, the more I find myself liking Bair for his effort, but only as long as you consider him as not being a goalscorer but as a foil or battering ram or whatever you want to see him as. It does feel a little like clutching at straws, but it's all we've got when the alternative options of Wilkinson and Shaw are considered. Also, perhaps Obika will come back and link well with Biereth?! I am scraping the barrel for positives here. 

[Kmcalpin]

16 minutes ago, wellfan said:

In a weird case of what feels a bit like Stockholm Syndrome, but that's not quite the correct analogy here, the more games that pass, the more I find myself liking Bair for his effort, but only as long as you consider him as not being a goalscorer but as a foil or battering ram or whatever you want to see him as.

At the moment, and assuming both are fit, I'd play Bair alongside Biereth up front. The "but" though is that they have to play close together. Also for that to work, they both need a midfielder who can support them. 

Spencer at right back please.

[MJC]

The change kit yet again making an appearance on Tuesday night it seems. 
 

We really need a win but the best result we’ll get is a 0-0 draw I reckon.

[bobbybingo]

Spencer's the other broken nose. Doubtful, along with Butcher.

[Kmcalpin]

1 hour ago, bobbybingo said:

Spencer's the other broken nose. Doubtful, along with Butcher.

Also Miller and McGinn doubtful.

[SteelmaninOZ]

1 hour ago, MJC said:

The change kit yet again making an appearance on Tuesday night it seems. 
 

We really need a win but the best result we’ll get is a 0-0 draw I reckon.

Love that change kit 

[GazzyB]

20 hours ago, wellfan said:

In a weird case of what feels a bit like Stockholm Syndrome, but that's not quite the correct analogy here, the more games that pass, the more I find myself liking Bair for his effort, but only as long as you consider him as not being a goalscorer but as a foil or battering ram or whatever you want to see him as. It does feel a little like clutching at straws, but it's all we've got when the alternative options of Wilkinson and Shaw are considered. Also, perhaps Obika will come back and link well with Biereth?! I am scraping the barrel for positives here. 

Interestingly enough he looked like he offered virtually no goal threat over the past couple of months when Biereth & Wilkinson were unavailable, but he scored against Aberdeen and made a few bursting runs through the middle against St Johnstone. I was surprised at how quick he was with said bursts. He is capable of being a goal threat, but he just isn't offering it enough. He is a better option than Wilkinson so far, though that's not saying much.

As for the game, I dunno what we'll line up, but I'd like to see us back to being solid at the back, retain the ball far far better than we did at the weekend, and start two up top. Not a lone striker, not three so that the central guy has no support, two up top.

 

Kettlewell's career hangs in the balance here. Let's hope he can get us right up for this.

[Kmcalpin]

Mistakes were made with our striker recruitment; most though not all fans would agree about that. However, I don't think we've been using them to their albeit limited strengths. My impression, and thats up for debate, so far is that:

Bair is a target man end of; Wilkinson is a limited penalty box striker; Obika is a target man and possibly a little more; Biereth is an all rounder but not a target man; Shaw?

Irrespective of what formation we play the striker(s) need close support, which they've not been getting. That means a mobile midfield and its questionable if we have that; and if we play 2 or more strikers together, then they have to play close to each other. I think a 2 man strikeforce is worth trying tomorrow with Bair as the target man and Biereth feeding off him.

Defence could be a concern. If rumours and reports are to be believed, then it could any 5 from O'Donnell, Gent, Mugabi, Blaney and Casey.  Back up?????

Its a critical game for both sides with Saints being desperate to have a new manager in place by tomorrow.

 

[Spiderpig]

31 minutes ago, Kmcalpin said:

 

Its a critical game for both sides with Saints being desperate to have a new manager in place by tomorrow.

 

They have just announced Craig Levein as their new manager on a 2 1/2 year deal, SK better be ready to face up to a 4-6-0 formation tomorrow.

[Kmcalpin]

A genuine guy by all accounts but not my type of manager. That said, he'll be an excellent fit for St Johnstone and will represent a continuity candidate who is consistent with their style of play over the past decade or so. 

[numpty]

58 minutes ago, Spiderpig said:

They have just announced Craig Levein as their new manager on a 2 1/2 year deal, SK better be ready to face up to a 4-6-0 formation tomorrow.

To my knowledge he hasn't set up a team in that formation in the past 13 years, so that would be quite a surprise to say the least, and perhaps even a tactical masterstroke.

[SteelmaninOZ]

The number 2 says 

 

[Richie]

Yeah, Biereth and Bair up top.

As has been said, Bair is decent in the press and an OK foil for Biereth.

We also certainly need something in Midfield to go through/link play - Ie Slattery (assuming Miller injured).

On Sat we were just going long/high which rendered Biereth ineffective.

 

[David]

The fact we're putting all of our faith into a 20-year-old kid who's played around 20 career games in total gives me the fear. 

[SteelmaninOZ]

Blair Spittal has a word 
 

 

[MJC]

4 hours ago, David said:

The fact we're putting all of our faith into a 20-year-old kid who's played around 20 career games in total gives me the fear. 

Yeah a 20 year old to be our entire goal threat and a 17 year old to carry our midfield. Unrealistic and unreasonable but that’s where we are thanks to dismal summer recruitment.

[stv]

10 hours ago, Kmcalpin said:

A genuine guy by all accounts but not my type of manager. That said, he'll be an excellent fit for St Johnstone and will represent a continuity candidate who is consistent with their style of play over the past decade or so. 

He’s an arsehole, too smart for his own good.