0Neils40yarder Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 33 minutes ago, MJC said: Perhaps not the entire group, but from what I have seen and heard for myself over the years there are certainly some members of that section that are on good terms with certain Green Brigade members. Certain ones I’ve had the misfortune to encounter seem to share similar ‘political’ outlooks as well and are extremely aggressive about it into the bargain. Then you take into account that the Well Bois willingly stood shoulder to shoulder with the GB at Fir Park and held a joint protest over heavy handed policing less than two years after that Friday night game where the Celtic support led by the GB caused thousands of pounds worth of damage to the South Stand. Yet they went along with that regardless. Then you’ve got all the behaviours and tactics which are similar to that of the Green Brigade… Being aggressive and confrontational to police and stewards then immediately playing the victim card when challenged. The pyro, the banners, the pitch invasions. Churning out big long winded statements calling for boycotts and trying to manipulate and lead the rest of the support into following them. Even dressing in a similar way with face coverings albeit without the dark green jackets, instead they wear all black. As I said, so much of their behaviour is very Green Brigade. Ya_bezzers post above puts it a lot better than I could with the key point being that groups like this seem to put themselves and their interests before that of the clubs. That’s exactly how I see the Well Bois I’m afraid. I think I know the individuals you're talking about here...and aye, in the past they may have got a bit too close to some of the green brigade 'off the park' if you like...however you're going back years and I think I can safely say there is no love lost between the majority of each group, considering the green brigade have a clearly visible presence in Motherwell most nights of the week. The pyro and behaviours is very much the 'ultras scene'...you'll have noticed a fairly sizeable contingent in the Hearts end on Sunday and you'll also be aware that the Union Bears behave in exactly the same manner as the Green Brigade 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJC Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 I can only go on personal experience and as I said I’ve seen and heard first hand the people they associate with and the questionable views they express. Some of them are thoroughly nasty individuals and it’s not just me who has that experience of some ‘the Bois’ either. I get the pyro culture thing and indeed every club nowadays seems to have an element like that in their fanbase. Obviously though the Well Bois are the ones that I see up close and a lot more often and I don’t know if any of the other groups have the same Green Brigade style behaviours like the faux victim mentality, releasing big victim-y statements and the general entitlement like our clubs lot have. I’m sorry but from what I can see there is just too much similarity between the Block E brigade and the Green Brigade for my liking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0Neils40yarder Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 9 minutes ago, MJC said: I can only go on personal experience and as I said I’ve seen and heard first hand the people they associate with and the questionable views they express. Some of them are thoroughly nasty individuals and it’s not just me who has that experience of some ‘the Bois’ either. I get the pyro culture thing and indeed every club nowadays seems to have an element like that in their fanbase. Obviously though the Well Bois are the ones that I see up close and a lot more often and I don’t know if any of the other groups have the same Green Brigade style behaviours like the faux victim mentality, releasing big victim-y statements and the general entitlement like our clubs lot have. I’m sorry but from what I can see there is just too much similarity between the Block E brigade and the Green Brigade for my liking. It's amazing that you can the likeness to the Green Brigade but not the Union Bears...they all very similar attributes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJC Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 Just now, 0Neils40yarder said: It's amazing that you can the likeness to the Green Brigade but not the Union Bears...they all very similar attributes The Green Brigade are way, way out in front of the Union Bears in every level, just like their club is way out in front of Rangers in that regard too. The GB are far bigger, far more dangerous and have a lot more clout than the UB could ever hope to have. They have powerful people with big voices and a lot of influence at various levels of sport and politics on their side and in their ranks. So even though the Union Bears might display similar behaviours, they don’t have the same leverage with police and authorities. Even Celtic as a club can’t control the Green Brigade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuwell2 Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 4 hours ago, MJC said: Perhaps not the entire group, but from what I have seen and heard for myself over the years there are certainly some members of that section that are on good terms with certain Green Brigade members. Certain ones I’ve had the misfortune to encounter seem to share similar ‘political’ outlooks as well and are extremely aggressive about it into the bargain. Then you’ve got all the behaviours and tactics which are similar to that of the Green Brigade… Firstly I’m not against the club banning people who they believe to have caused trouble but I’d hope they have sufficient evidence to back up the ban. If the people want to appeal then a meeting should be held with them and members of their family and the evidence produced. MJC, can you explain the political beliefs part as - although I don’t like the GB - there are certain things the I can agree with and I’ve never witnessed the Block E displaying political views in their displays or any other way at games outwith the heavy hands stuff. Although you have the right to disagree, that part smacks to me of your political views and your inability to accept others have the right to their views and has nothing to do with the way they support the club. Lastly, you and others keep referring and comparing them to the GB but never mention the Union Bears who in the context to this dispute are by far closer linked as some of them also recently stole a drum, Rangers banned those responsible without any court case and no one is shouting about that as far as I know. edit: Just seen your reply to 40yarder which does appear to back up my thoughts that it’s political for you. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0Neils40yarder Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 1 hour ago, MJC said: The Green Brigade are way, way out in front of the Union Bears in every level, just like their club is way out in front of Rangers in that regard too. The GB are far bigger, far more dangerous and have a lot more clout than the UB could ever hope to have. They have powerful people with big voices and a lot of influence at various levels of sport and politics on their side and in their ranks. So even though the Union Bears might display similar behaviours, they don’t have the same leverage with police and authorities. Even Celtic as a club can’t control the Green Brigade. No one has said the Green Brigade is the same size as the Union Bears or our lot...you've gone off on a tangent again 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Stall Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 1 hour ago, MJC said: The Green Brigade are way, way out in front of the Union Bears in every level, just like their club is way out in front of Rangers in that regard too. The GB are far bigger, far more dangerous and have a lot more clout than the UB could ever hope to have. They have powerful people with big voices and a lot of influence at various levels of sport and politics on their side and in their ranks. So even though the Union Bears might display similar behaviours, they don’t have the same leverage with police and authorities. Even Celtic as a club can’t control the Green Brigade. Which is why the blockE lads are more comparable to the UB. But yet you havent bothered making that link? Its a mystery why not...... almost as if it doesnt fit your agenda. Most Rangers fans i know think of the UB as a bunch of daft wee fannies. We can certainly see some similarities there. Thats not meant as an insult, plenty of us were daft wee fannies once upon a time. It doesnt mean we got to speak on behalf of the club. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJC Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 1 hour ago, Stuwell2 said: MJC, can you explain the political beliefs part No. 1 hour ago, Big Stall said: Which is why the blockE lads are more comparable to the UB. But yet you havent bothered making that link? Its a mystery why not...... almost as if it doesnt fit your agenda. Most Rangers fans i know think of the UB as a bunch of daft wee fannies. We can certainly see some similarities there. Thats not meant as an insult, plenty of us were daft wee fannies once upon a time. It doesnt mean we got to speak on behalf of the club. But as far as I can see, and maybe I am wrong, the Union Bears aren’t political in the same way the Green Brigade are. I heard about the drum incident with St.Johnstone fans and Rangers as a club acted swiftly and banned the individuals identified as being involved, and good on them for doing so. Would Celtic have done the same had it been a GB member? I highly doubt it and there would be protests, walk-outs and a lot of noise made by the GB if they had. See some similarities there too? This topic has run its course now as far as I’m concerned so the final thing for me to say is that I hate the Green Brigade and I’m not a fan of the Well Bois. MJC - over and out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0Neils40yarder Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 33 minutes ago, MJC said: No. But as far as I can see, and maybe I am wrong, the Union Bears aren’t political in the same way the Green Brigade are. I heard about the drum incident with St.Johnstone fans and Rangers as a club acted swiftly and banned the individuals identified as being involved, and good on them for doing so. Would Celtic have done the same had it been a GB member? I highly doubt it and there would be protests, walk-outs and a lot of noise made by the GB if they had. See some similarities there too? This topic has run its course now as far as I’m concerned so the final thing for me to say is that I hate the Green Brigade and I’m not a fan of the Well Bois. MJC - over and out. The 'Union' Bears aren't political? Gie me peace 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wunderwell Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 44 minutes ago, MJC said: No. But as far as I can see, and maybe I am wrong, the Union Bears aren’t political in the same way the Green Brigade are. I heard about the drum incident with St.Johnstone fans and Rangers as a club acted swiftly and banned the individuals identified as being involved, and good on them for doing so. Would Celtic have done the same had it been a GB member? I highly doubt it and there would be protests, walk-outs and a lot of noise made by the GB if they had. See some similarities there too? This topic has run its course now as far as I’m concerned so the final thing for me to say is that I hate the Green Brigade and I’m not a fan of the Well Bois. MJC - over and out. Celtic banned the entire Green Brigade previously https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-67277186 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wunderwell Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 Listen MJC we are not talking about Rangers and Celtic here. You work for the daily record? Can we concentrate on the Well Bois and Motherwell FC on a Motherwell forum? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yabba's Turd Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 2 hours ago, MJC said: MJC - over and out. When reason and argument are lost, the debater checks out. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuwell2 Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 2 hours ago, MJC said: No. If your not willing to back up your point, why bring it up to start with? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mccus28 Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 Folks As with all walks of life, there will be arses in the Bois as well as decent folk, it is what it is. Motherwell are also entitled to ban anyone they want, there isn't the same burden of proof that there is in a Scottish court so people need to realise you cant intertwine the 2 as closely as you would like, rightly or wrongly....................... Ultimately, I don't agree with all that the Bois do as a whole but it is only a small minority, the same minority who abused and threatened myself and my wife in Dundee 2 seasons ago as they didn't know I was a Motherwell fan as I didn't have colours on when walking back to my car, it was kinda pathetic if im honest from across a road but wasn't pleasant for my wife who doesnt normally go to the footy. Should some be banned.........probably 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0Neils40yarder Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 1 hour ago, Mccus28 said: Motherwell are also entitled to ban anyone they want, there isn't the same burden of proof that there is in a Scottish court so people need to realise you cant intertwine the 2 as closely as you would like, rightly or wrongly....................... That's all correct...any business has the right to ban whoever they wish, from entering their premises but as I said elsewhere if they and their mates feel its unjust then the club shouldn't be surprised when they aren't happy about it 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuwell2 Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 Most folk seem to have a broadly similar view regarding the banning of fans, it’s not desirable but if the evidence backs it up then we have to accept that it will happen. On this point I believe that whoever is being banned should have the right to appeal the ban and the club should then invite them to a review of the ban giving the person a chance to have it overturned or at least reduce it to a certain time rather than indefinite. Regarding the current issue, can anyone say the age of those who were banned without giving any other information that might identify them? The reason I’m asking is that if they’re under the age of 16, then surly their parents would have been informed of the decision and taken it up with the club if they felt it was wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kmcalpin Posted August 29 Author Report Share Posted August 29 15 minutes ago, Stuwell2 said: On this point I believe that whoever is being banned should have the right to appeal the ban and the club should then invite them to a review of the ban giving the person a chance to have it overturned or at least reduce it to a certain time rather than indefinite. Regarding the current issue, can anyone say the age of those who were banned without giving any other information that might identify them? The reason I’m asking is that if they’re under the age of 16, then surly their parents would have been informed of the decision and taken it up with the club if they felt it was wrong? Good post. Whatever the rights and wrongs of individual cases, its important that protocols are followed. Earlier some poster(s) said that the club contacted the youngsters before the Police had contacted them. That shouldn't happen. Any process should be fair and transparent and parents involved, if appropriate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busta Nut Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 I've sat down towards that end section for 20 odd years until recently. I've heard far more "f****n Bastards" type shouts than "Orange bastards" type shouts. I'm not really getting the friendly with celtic stuff. I mean I remember the throwing of tennis balls(I think) at the same time as them a good few years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuwell2 Posted August 30 Report Share Posted August 30 FFS, Bob and Brian’s influence seems to spread everywhere! Just been looking at Oasis tickets on Ticketmaster and seen this Standing: no 14 year olds or younger on the park, 14 year olds to be accompanied by an adult 18 or over Seating: No under 8’s allowed, 8-15 year olds to be accompanied by an adult 18 or over minimum 1 adult to 4 persons 8-15. How are Oasis ever going to get youngsters interested and grow their fan base with these oppressive rules. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cameron_Mcd Posted August 30 Report Share Posted August 30 Comparing apple's and oranges.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wellgirl Posted August 30 Report Share Posted August 30 32 minutes ago, Stuwell2 said: FFS, Bob and Brian’s influence seems to spread everywhere! Just been looking at Oasis tickets on Ticketmaster and seen this Standing: no 14 year olds or younger on the park, 14 year olds to be accompanied by an adult 18 or over Seating: No under 8’s allowed, 8-15 year olds to be accompanied by an adult 18 or over minimum 1 adult to 4 persons 8-15. How are Oasis ever going to get youngsters interested and grow their fan base with these oppressive rules. 🤣🤣🤣. They'll just need to go and watch football at a club that will let them in on their own (the gigs will sell out in 3 minutes anyway) 🤣 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kmcalpin Posted August 30 Author Report Share Posted August 30 39 minutes ago, Stuwell2 said: FFS, Bob and Brian’s influence seems to spread everywhere! Just been looking at Oasis tickets on Ticketmaster and seen this Standing: no 14 year olds or younger on the park, 14 year olds to be accompanied by an adult 18 or over Seating: No under 8’s allowed, 8-15 year olds to be accompanied by an adult 18 or over minimum 1 adult to 4 persons 8-15. How are Oasis ever going to get youngsters interested and grow their fan base with these oppressive rules. I suspect there will be a few hundred more at the Oasis concerts than there will be at Fir Park. Different environment too with drink flowing and drugs available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted August 30 Report Share Posted August 30 18 hours ago, Mccus28 said: Motherwell are also entitled to ban anyone they want Indeed they are. But if the majority ownership group wants those bans explained to them, and the rationale behind them backed up with facts, that's surely understandable? The people discussing this, many of whom are Society members, aren't just punters who drink in a pub or customers of a business. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiderpig Posted August 30 Report Share Posted August 30 1 hour ago, David said: The people discussing this, many of whom are Society members, aren't just punters who drink in a pub or customers of a business. Take away all of the hype and tradition around supporting football clubs and That's exactly what they are, paying customers of a business just like any other leisure activity, cinema, restaurants, health clubs etc etc. So as I mentioned before certain polices, codes of conduct etc need to be followed as a condition of buy that particular service. It's up to the club to ensure these conditions are not detrimental and actually make Fir park a better place to pay to go to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grizzlyg Posted August 30 Report Share Posted August 30 3 hours ago, Stuwell2 said: FFS, Bob and Brian’s influence seems to spread everywhere! Just been looking at Oasis tickets on Ticketmaster and seen this Standing: no 14 year olds or younger on the park, 14 year olds to be accompanied by an adult 18 or over Seating: No under 8’s allowed, 8-15 year olds to be accompanied by an adult 18 or over minimum 1 adult to 4 persons 8-15. How are Oasis ever going to get youngsters interested and grow their fan base with these oppressive rules. Liam Gallagher walks into a chippy and says "ayyyyyyyyyyy bag of chips please mate" Guy behind counter says "you want a roll with it?" Thank you.....good night 🤪🤪 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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