Interesting stats on

[David]

1 hour ago, 0Neils40yarder said:

As I've said elsewhere, I'm not a massive fan of Clark, and I could have cracked his jaw if I had bumped into him in Germany in the Summer, but I'm a bit puzzled by your take on this, and others to be fair.

I don't think it's that confusing really. I've stated my reasoning, which includes Clarke contradicting himself regularly.

1 hour ago, 0Neils40yarder said:

Doak plays in a position that we are literally completely bereft of anyone playing at any sort of level, the fact that he signed for Liverpool suggests that he's a very exciting talent and the fact that he's ripping it up week in and out at Middlesbrough currently would back that up.

Oh, if Doak were selected now for his first cap then I'd have no complaint. But he was selected when he'd played basically no first team senior football at all. Which flies in the face of the criteria Clarke has mentioned a few times in the media, which includes not picking players because they don't have enough experience. 

If having experience and playing regular club football isn't going to be a prerequisite for being picked, don't say it. It really is that simple. When he was making excuses for not picking Shankland despite him rattling goals in left, right and centre, he said Shankland wasn't experienced enough, and didn't have enough "responsibility." Absolute nonsense. Just be honest, and tell us that you didn't want to pick him because you don't rate the Scottish game and that you'd rather pick someone who's playing sporadically down south, and scoring a fraction of the goals. 

1 hour ago, 0Neils40yarder said:

Miller plays in a position where we currently, literally do not need him, ahead of him are players that play in Serie A and the English Premier and Championship, players that aren't completely over the hill and players that the manager trusts, rightly or wrongly.

Key word being "currently."

How many friendlies do we play now? Games that would have been used to begin involving guys like Miller in the squad? We should be looking to the future and asking ourselves if we believe that the guys you mention will be prime candidates to play at the World Cup in a few years? 

Again, I pretty much guarantee you that if Miller makes a move in January he'll suddenly be good enough to get picked. 

1 hour ago, 0Neils40yarder said:

Clarke will have watched Miller umpteen times and it's his job to decide if he adds something to his squad, and he clearly feels that at this moment he is right down the pecking order.

If he thinks that one of the most talented youngsters in our game has nothing to offer, then he's mental. 

Again, stop bleating on about how we don't produce any good young players then dismiss one of our top talents as basically being over-hyped. 

[gaz7]

38 minutes ago, David said:

 

David I agree that clarke can contradict himself however no manager is going to come out and say a player isn't gd enough so they have to say something to the press which is what he's doing.

Your point on doak is not my view as no doubt if you are training with liverpool players every day and showing to be as good as them then that is worth a lot more than playing for motherwell in spfl. Plus  without trying to sound too negative i have never saw miller dominate any game even other day for u19s he wasn't best on park. He has gd moments certainly. 

If he joins so called big league team and if he gets in their team then no doubt he will be in squad as he will be proving himself at a level similar to international football. If he joins a so called superclub I.e liverpool man city etc and is in and around 1st team again I would expect same for him as he will be up against elite players everyday

Unless you are outstanding in spfl and even if you are then you are likely going to struggle against kovacic.modric.silva zielinski. Etc who are who he'd be up against in these matches

I believe he can maybe get there  but loads to do and as I say his next move is crucial 

[David]

I guess my final thought on this is that there isn't a world where I'd choose 32 year old Kenny McLean over Lennon Miller. unless Clarke is planning to take a 34 year old Kenny McLean to the World Cup.

In which case, God help us all.

[santheman]

I think we're forgetting sometimes that Lennon is only 18 but still has LOTS to learn.

He's by far the best young prospect from the SPL and should be managed as an 18 year old not a 23/24 year old with loads of experience.

I've always thought that Scotland should have some kind of development squad where players who are too old for the u19/21 but considered not quite ready for the full team or older players on the fringes off the full team could get game time and experience at full international level.

It could provide a pathway from u21 to full team whereas just now it's a massive step up in one go.

[texanwellfan]

If Miller is good enough to play for the national team he should be selected. Many players have started their full international careers as teenagers. 
   So do we regard Miller as good for an 18 year old or good in comparison to other players? 
  I sometimes wonder if we actually do our young players a disservice by treating them with kid gloves due to their age. 

[Happy Dosser]

2 hours ago, David said:

I guess my final thought on this is that there isn't a world where I'd choose 32 year old Kenny McLean over Lennon Miller. unless Clarke is planning to take a 34 year old Kenny McLean to the World Cup.

In which case, God help us all.

Exactly, and you are quite right to draw attention to Clarke's contradictory statements. He's getting to be as thrawnly defensive/prickly and dismissive as Strachan was in his final phase as international manager. I also  notice  that  he sometimes  pushes Carver out  to do his talking for him before matches now.

I'm pretty sure Lennon Miller will be in a Scotland squad as soon as  he's left Fir Park.

[grizzlyg]

13 minutes ago, Happy Dosser said:

Exactly, and you are quite right to draw attention to Clarke's contradictory statements. He's getting to be as thrawnly defensive/prickly and dismissive as Strachan was in his final phase as international manager. I also  notice  that  he sometimes  pushes Carver out  to do his talking for him before matches now.

I'm pretty sure Lennon Miller will be in a Scotland squad as soon as  he's left Fir Park.

Carver is just as bad to listen to, saying we are close to matching the top teams and that he enjoyed Ronaldo taking the huff......aye very good John

[Orinoco]

Totally agree with your comments David.

Look at how Turnbull was and is still over looked or more recently Gauld.

Players that are physically strong  and can run are preferred over technically gifted players. I thought we had moved passed the big strong laddie approach. But when you have Gemmil (what's he done to merit his position?) and safety first Clark then modern and forward thinking coaching is not happening. 

Look at Northern Irelands and Wales approach. Playing young players and building for the future. Our dour faced manager only thinks about the coming 90 minutes and not getting beat. See how that's going. 

As been said there have been plenty of opportunities to give fringe players some experience but he picks the same players who have failed over and over.

Guys like Max Johnstone should be playing ahead of Devlin and Ralston. Miller should be getting minutes at a higher level to get him learning. Playing with better players can only help him improve. 

It's beyond the time for a fresh approach on and off the field. But when you see how our outgoing chairman saw the world, then we can't really be surprised that others running the game are equally clueless and lack any intelligence or desire to improve things. 

 

[grizzlyg]

Some common sense in line up as no mcginn or dykes, good to see Conway get a start but ralston and Hanley in defence just gives me the fear

[mfc]

After his performances at the euros,ralston should never have been selected again.hes a total bombscare that's never going to improve beyond that.max Johnstone took the step to move abroad and improve as a player and it should be rewarded but yet we have selected a dumpling that will be happy sitting on the bench at his beloved celtic every week.

[Stuwell2]

A few thoughts, LM wanted to play u19’s and will have learned more from those 90 minutes than he would training with the seniors and then sitting on the bench.

He - probably rightly -wouldn’t have got on in front of McGinn who’s on the bench. 
MJ should be starting. 
Clarke is a numpty. 

[David]

32 minutes ago, mfc said:

After his performances at the euros,ralston should never have been selected again.hes a total bombscare that's never going to improve beyond that.max Johnstone took the step to move abroad and improve as a player and it should be rewarded but yet we have selected a dumpling that will be happy sitting on the bench at his beloved celtic every week.

Yeah, but Max Johnston is "only" 20 years old. Probably just another of those young ones "that everybody wants to hype and push."

[Orinoco]

Miller's shooting is of a higher quality than Gilmour.

In fact tonight Miller would have been a better option.

Dykes ahead of even a fat Shankland says it all about Clark.

[grizzlyg]

1 hour ago, Orinoco said:

Miller's shooting is of a higher quality than Gilmour.

In fact tonight Miller would have been a better option.

Dykes ahead of even a fat Shankland says it all about Clark.

Tonight showed that Hanley mclean and christie should be nowhere near starting xi, gauld deserves a start.  Wee doak was immense, always positive

[0Neils40yarder]

9 hours ago, Orinoco said:

Miller's shooting is of a higher quality than Gilmour.

In fact tonight Miller would have been a better option.

Dykes ahead of even a fat Shankland says it all about Clark.

Have you watched much of Shankland this season? Add in , 'pish', 'lazy' and 'uninterested' to 'fat' and that's my take on him...other than that, he's no very good either.

 

Not for a 2nd saying that Dykes is much better (if at all) but again I wouldn't be hanging Clark for choosing Dykes over Shankland, or vice versa for what it's worth. Our striking options are all very poor at that level.

[gaz7]

12 hours ago, grizzlyg said:

Tonight showed that Hanley mclean and christie should be nowhere near starting xi, gauld deserves a start.  Wee doak was immense, always positive

Hanley and mclean were only playing because of their performances against Portugal I think Grizzly but think that will now be start of phase out. I think your harsh on christie his determination and workrate of the ball are up there with best in team plus he's tidy with it and he is getting played out of position .let's see him in his club position next to gilmour and he will thrive I feel.

Ralston done well again last night and gilmour was good other than his shooting. Wee doak outstanding we have not had that in years where when he gets the ball their is excitement in crowd. I was disappointed with conway but his 1st start against top class defenders. Gauld impressed again and him and mcginn made big difference when on.

Hope some of the takes from last night are having a wee re think today

[wellfan]

Max supporting Doak on that right wing needs to happen sooner or later, although Hickey will likely be ahead of him in the pecking order once fit again. 

[grizzlyg]

3 hours ago, gaz7 said:

Hanley and mclean were only playing because of their performances against Portugal I think Grizzly but think that will now be start of phase out. I think your harsh on christie his determination and workrate of the ball are up there with best in team plus he's tidy with it and he is getting played out of position .let's see him in his club position next to gilmour and he will thrive I feel.

Ralston done well again last night and gilmour was good other than his shooting. Wee doak outstanding we have not had that in years where when he gets the ball their is excitement in crowd. I was disappointed with conway but his 1st start against top class defenders. Gauld impressed again and him and mcginn made big difference when on.

Hope some of the takes from last night are having a wee re think today

Agree it would have been difficult to change team that drew with Portugal.   I am not a big christie fan, runs about a lot and loads of energy but no real product.  I am big gilmour fan but his shooting was woeful.  Gauld deserves a start but I doubt it will happen on Monday. And please don't start Dykes

[joewarkfanclub]

7 hours ago, grizzlyg said:

Agree it would have been difficult to change team that drew with Portugal.   I am not a big christie fan, runs about a lot and loads of energy but no real product.  I am big gilmour fan but his shooting was woeful.  Gauld deserves a start but I doubt it will happen on Monday. And please don't start Dykes

Dykes gets us up the park.

He doesnt have much of a goal threat, but none of our strikers do given the way we set up.

Conway worked really hard last night, but he was no nearer to scoring a goal than Dykes, Adams or Shankland before him.

Our goals basically come from midfielders arriving late in the box. McGinn, McTominay, Armstrong, McGregor, McLean have all been beneficiaries of the work done by Dykes since his arrival in our squad.

That may change with Doaks rise to prominence, but I wouldnt be writing Dykes off just yet.

[joewarkfanclub]

11 hours ago, wellfan said:

Max supporting Doak on that right wing needs to happen sooner or later, although Hickey will likely be ahead of him in the pecking order once fit again. 

The future is bright.......

[joewarkfanclub]

On 11/15/2024 at 12:03 PM, David said:

Ready to start for the senior team? Probably not. Ready to be part of the squad and see some minutes? Absolutely. 

We can say that he’s more prepared for this than Doak was when he received his first call-up. The reason for this is simple: Doak had played so little football at that point, it was almost impossible to know what he was truly capable of. He was picked because he'd signed for Liverpool. He was chosen pretty much based entirely on potential.

Lennon, on the other hand, has already featured in over 50 senior matches. And the way he's being spoken about reflects that. It's not just because of his potential, but because he has shown it during the senior games he's played.

I just want Clarke to be honest. Stop talking nonsense about how we don't have a conveyor belt of young players then actively tell us that you're not picking one of the nation's hottest young talents because he's just "another young one that everybody wants to hype and push."

stop telling us that you aren't picking Lawrence Shankland when he's scored 16 goals in 16 games because he needs more experience and more responsibility, then go and pick Tommy Conway who's managed to hit double figures twice in his entire career. 

Stop telling us that players need to be playing regularly for their clubs to really be considered for international selection then pick players who don't fit that criteria. 

He's constantly contradicting himself. And in my opinion, should have been punted after the Euros. 

Doak plays in a position where he has no competition.

Its much easier to make a case for his inclusion when there is a weakness in the squad that he can fill. 

I think he proved it last night.

Im all for Lennon being included in a squad to get him used to the environment.

But there is no way he is getting gametime at the moment when the bench has John McGinn on it.

Re Kenny Maclean. He is one of the most underated players in the squad. 

He has played in a number of different positions for Scotland and never let us down in any of them.

Players like that are a managers dream, hence why he has been trusted in this Nations League A Group as a starter in the absence of McGregor.

I dont know whether he will still be around should we get tot he World Cup, but I wouldnt bet against it.

It would be nice for Lennon to be called up soon whilst he is still with us as it would add a bit to his value, and I have no doubts he will be a Scotland regular very soon.

Just not right now.

[David]

15 hours ago, joewarkfanclub said:

Re Kenny Maclean. He is one of the most underated players in the squad. 

That says more about the squad than it does him, I think. Sad state of affairs really.