Motherwell v Hearts 12/04/2025

[star sail]

3 minutes ago, MJC said:

Regardless of the squad he has or the way he’s used his players I will be very surprised if Michael Wimmer is still our manager come the end of 2025. It just has that feel of short term tenure.

Unfortunately I agree with this. It does not have a feeling of having any real longevity at this moment in time. 

[wellfan]

4 minutes ago, MJC said:

Regardless of the squad he has or the way he’s used his players I will be very surprised if Michael Wimmer is still our manager come the end of 2025. It just has that feel of short term tenure.

Perhaps, but, if he goes, it’ll probably be of his own volition and due to being utterly frustrated by the shite he’s burdened with. 

[David]

20 hours ago, MJC said:

So Hearts lose today at home to Dundee Utd.

That is literally the WORST result that we could have hoped for.

It was quite literally the only outcome that gave us even the faintest chance of making the top six, and somehow you think that’s the worst possible result we could have got?

Completely mad.

[wellsince75]

 
Wimmer got a really positive reaction for a couple of games but that was fleeting. 

Saturday against Kilmarnock should have felt like a cup final. Still a chance of top 6, fighting for contacts, needing to bounce back from a humping against Aberdeen. Sadly we got nada , nothing. 

Mathematically we could get top 6. Realistically feel you'd  need to be in the  'you must be smoking crack' category for this outcome. 

I hope Wimmer rings the changes and puts pace into the team.  FWIW I'd be going with:

                                 Ox

                       Gordon. Casey

Sparrow                                          Wilson 
              Andrews.           Halliday 

                    Slattery     Miller   

           Armstrong        Maswanhise 
 

Tactics - Press , Press, Press with a view to brining on Thompson, Koutroumbis., Paton  Moses when people get tired, 

[Spiderpig]

9 hours ago, Ya Bezzer! said:

With all due respect I think this is a load of rubbish.

Hammell's team was worse and in a much worse position, relegation very much on the cards, and Kettlewell came in and not only turned it round but went on a great run.

Wimmer has had multiple chances to secure a Top 6 position and not done it.

With all due respect that's pish, SK had KVV and Spittal contributing 30 goals between them, MW has Armstrong, Watt or Ebiye so hardly surprising we struggle to score goals and therefore win games

As for MW having Multiple chances to secure top 6, that would be 2 maybe 3 games out of the 6 or 7 he's been in charge, aye OK then.

Some of the posters on here need a reality check at times, does anyone really think we would be any better off after 32 games if SK had stayed, not a chance we would be at least 6 points worse off.

[wellgirl]

4 minutes ago, Spiderpig said:

With all due respect that's pish, SK had KVV and Spittal contributing 30 goals between them, MW has Armstrong, Watt or Ebiye so hardly surprising we struggle to score goals and therefore win games

As for MW having Multiple chances to secure top 6, that would be 2 maybe 3 games out of the 6 or 7 he's been in charge, aye OK then.

Some of the posters on here need a reality check at times, does anyone really think we would be any better off after 32 games if SK had stayed, not chance we would be at least 6 poi to worse off.

Ebiye seems to be well out of the picture - when was the last time he played even as a sub. 

[MJC]

1 hour ago, David said:

It was quite literally the only outcome that gave us even the faintest chance of making the top six, and somehow you think that’s the worst possible result we could have got?

Completely mad.

We need points badly to keep ourselves away from the playoff spot.

Playing a side that are coming off a bad result and who know that they need to win to secure top six does not work in our favour.

Had Hearts won yesterday and secured top six their approach to this game would have been completely different and they may even have rested players ahead of the Scottish Cup Semi Final.
 

They may we’ll still have beaten us as we are hopeless but facing a Hearts side who had already secured top six would have given us a better chance of a result against them than facing a Hearts side knowing they need to win.

[star sail]

43 minutes ago, Spiderpig said:

 

Some of the posters on here need a reality check at times, does anyone really think we would be any better off after 32 games if SK had stayed, not chance we would be at least 6 points worse off.

I don't think anybody is still of the opinion that we would have been better off with Kettlewell. His time was up. Also I don't think there will be a single poster on here that does not wish MW every success. 

I think people are reacting to the last 3 games where, had there been a media blackout for a month we could be forgiven for thinking SK was still in the dugout.

I thought Wimmer had that all too familiar Motherwell manager ghost look on his face after the game on Saturday. The jovial light-hearted smile has gone now that he realises the enormity of the task. 

Being positive, we had been really poor under Alexander for months when we needed a reaction against Hearts to clinch Euro qualification and we got it. 

The same again would be perfect.

[dennyc]

3 hours ago, Ya Bezzer! said:

With all due respect I think this is a load of rubbish.

Hammell's team was worse and in a much worse position, relegation very much on the cards, and Kettlewell came in and not only turned it round but went on a great run.

Wimmer has had multiple chances to secure a Top 6 position and not done it.

Of course he needs time to mould his own team and no one is saying he won't do a job in the long run but that doesn't mean that he's doing as well as he should be.

I alluded to it before but I'll just say it out loud now, the two key players in that squad are Lennon Miller and Tawanda Maswanhise, and so far he's show he doesn't recognise that or how to utilise either player effectively.  To me that's a bit concerning.

Managers that try to impose their own style over the strengths of a squad usually either have to concede and change or fail.

A lot of merit in what you say. But I wonder if Maswanhise is getting better every game he doesn't feature. A bit like Kaleta, until reality set in.

Maswanhise has scored some important and clever goals for us and probably merits a start given how toothless we have been of late. Armstrong certainly needs support up front. Might as well try Maswanhise. Although for some reason Watt appears to be ahead of him in our Manager's eyes.

But, and admittedly in limited spells, Maswanhise has been as rotten as the rest when he has been brought on. How someone can score the skilful goals has he has, but cannot control a simple pass first time is beyond me. Potential but a long ways to go in my opinion.

Interesting discussion regards Wimmer. I like him and want him to succeed. But having endured that showing at Aberdeen, and having listened to him afterwards, I expected a different approach and set up at Kilmarnock. Maybe not a win, but a reaction on and off the field. Sadly nothing changed and if anything the performance was worse. That concerns me.

Far too early to judge Wimmer of course, particularly given what he inherited and his lack of opportunity to bring in fresh faces or take the squad through pre season build up.  But that, and some questionable officiating, does not exempt him from scrutiny and comment. Let's see if we see anything different against Hearts. 

[wellfan]

11 minutes ago, dennyc said:

But having endured that showing at Aberdeen, and having listened to him afterwards, I expected a different approach and set up at Kilmarnock. Maybe not a win, but a reaction on and off the field. Sadly nothing changed and if anything the performance was worse. That concerns me.

Perhaps it’s the players who are the problem…

[numpty]

.

[David]

1 hour ago, MJC said:

We need points badly to keep ourselves away from the playoff spot.

Playing a side that are coming off a bad result and who know that they need to win to secure top six does not work in our favour.

Had Hearts won yesterday and secured top six their approach to this game would have been completely different and they may even have rested players ahead of the Scottish Cup Semi Final.
 

They may we’ll still have beaten us as we are hopeless but facing a Hearts side who had already secured top six would have given us a better chance of a result against them than facing a Hearts side knowing they need to win.

And if Hearts had won and secured top six you'd be saying we're in trouble because we're playing a Hearts team that's flying and now has ambitions to catch Dundee United or even Aberdeen and finish 4th or 5th.

[wellgirl]

6 minutes ago, David said:

And if Hearts had won and secured top six you'd be saying we're in trouble because we're playing a Hearts team that's flying and now has ambitions to catch Dundee United or even Aberdeen and finish 4th or 5th.

I saw fans elsewhere online say that they think a win for Hearts yesterday would have been the best outcome as they would take it easier on us next week. Don't think that's the case either tbh. 

[mfc]

8 minutes ago, wellgirl said:

I saw fans elsewhere online say that they think a win for Hearts yesterday would have been the best outcome as they would take it easier on us next week. Don't think that's the case either tbh. 

Some fans talk some amount of rubbish,hearts would take it easier on us 😂,this is a piss poor hearts team that were more than capable of beating despite the form were in.theres nothing to fear going Into this game and if we win and make it into the top 6 then great,if the other result doesn't go our way and we win anyway then it will be an equally important three points.

[dennyc]

40 minutes ago, wellfan said:

Perhaps it’s the players who are the problem…

Certainly seems like they are a major part of the problem. Looking at the options each week is depressing. Maybe Wimmer feels likewise. I just wonder how realistic is  to hope for Ox, Slattery and 9 new faces in a starting eleven come the League Cup next season. Maybe I should just settle for avoiding the play off this season. Looking at the likely bottom six opponents should we fall short on Saturday, current form and recent meetings suggests they all have our number. Killie and St J at Fir Park could be a shit fest but decisive.

A win come Saturday would ease so much pressure. Hearts will set about bullying us just like Aberdeen and Killie. Devlin will already be practicing his dark arts. Let's hope we come up with an approach to counter him and the rest.. 

 

[wellgirl]

Pretty sure Wimmer knew the task he was taking on. Hes surely not as miserable as the fans who pay to watch this. I'm not going to call it - but I hope we do enough to get out of the play off position. I also don't think every player we have is shit - we just have the same old issues of not scoring enough goals and having a leaky defence. Other seasons we scored enough to make up for the defensive errors. 

I do hope Ox is back in goals soon. I also don't think Mawhanise is the answer but the manager could do worse than give him a start on Saturday 

[grizzlyg]

2 hours ago, MJC said:

We need points badly to keep ourselves away from the playoff spot.

Playing a side that are coming off a bad result and who know that they need to win to secure top six does not work in our favour.

Had Hearts won yesterday and secured top six their approach to this game would have been completely different and they may even have rested players ahead of the Scottish Cup Semi Final.
 

They may we’ll still have beaten us as we are hopeless but facing a Hearts side who had already secured top six would have given us a better chance of a result against them than facing a Hearts side knowing they need to win.

If Hearts had won yesterday they would have been in top 6 and we were definitely in bottom 6 and facing other teams fighting relegation.     As it is we still have a chance of top 6 if we win on Saturday.

Also in most jobs you get a 6 month probation, poor wimmer got a 6 game probation judging by some of the posts.

[texanwellfan]

I think we need to put Maswanhise up front with Armstrong and press higher up the field. Having said that I don’t know if hearts have any players with speed that could hurt us on the break or with balls over the top. 
of

course Maswanhise is a gamble. We’d just have to hope we get the “good” Maswanhise

[grizzlyg]

A final point I will make is thst after the 2 St Johnstone horror shows if someone had said come the Hearts game we had chance to finish Top 6 then I think everyone would not expect us to be in that position.

Yes last 2 games have been poor but no reason why we can't win this. Come on folks....get them glasses half full.

COYW

[wellgirl]

16 minutes ago, grizzlyg said:

A final point I will make is thst after the 2 St Johnstone horror shows if someone had said come the Hearts game we had chance to finish Top 6 then I think everyone would not expect us to be in that position.

Yes last 2 games have been poor but no reason why we can't win this. Come on folks....get them glasses half full.

COYW

I understand why people are unhappy. I went to my first away game in decades and had to watch that Aberdeen shit show. But I'm old enough to remember standing on the terraces at Fir Park in the winter with us getting battered off Morton. I don't think we are a shite team. I think we've just had lots of injuries this year and other things that have conspired against us. And if we do go down - fuck it. I'll support Motherwell till the end 

I honestly do hope Wimmer turns it around but if he doesn't it is what it is. I also don't think our players don't care about the club. 

[wellgirl]

38 minutes ago, grizzlyg said:

If Hearts had won yesterday they would have been in top 6 and we were definitely in bottom 6 and facing other teams fighting relegation.     As it is we still have a chance of top 6 if we win on Saturday.

Also in most jobs you get a 6 month probation, poor wimmer got a 6 game probation judging by some of the posts.

I don't have an issue with Wimmer. I just hope that he doesn't fall into the trap of being too stubborn. I said the other week that I thought Ox should have been in goals and someone said that I wasn't being positive about Balcombe. Also we don't know the time line that Ox should be back so I won't criticise him for that either. Like you say. We need to back the team 

[Stuwell2]

11 hours ago, MJC said:

We need points badly to keep ourselves away from the playoff spot.

Playing a side that are coming off a bad result and who know that they need to win to secure top six does not work in our favour.

Had Hearts won yesterday and secured top six their approach to this game would have been completely different and they may even have rested players ahead of the Scottish Cup Semi Final.
 

They may we’ll still have beaten us as we are hopeless but facing a Hearts side who had already secured top six would have given us a better chance of a result against them than facing a Hearts side knowing they need to win.

Hearts are a team that also have their frailties and the pressure on them to make the top 6 could - potentially - have them feeling nervous.

If we get into them and close them down from the start forcing some early errors it could increase their nervousness and increase our confidence (until the usual silly fuck up)

 

 

[robsterwood]

13 hours ago, wellgirl said:

I understand why people are unhappy. I went to my first away game in decades and had to watch that Aberdeen shit show. But I'm old enough to remember standing on the terraces at Fir Park in the winter with us getting battered off Morton. I don't think we are a shite team. I think we've just had lots of injuries this year and other things that have conspired against us. And if we do go down - fuck it. I'll support Motherwell till the end 

I honestly do hope Wimmer turns it around but if he doesn't it is what it is. I also don't think our players don't care about the club. 

We got beat by Morton last year in cup and outplayed. Don't need to look too far in history to see shit results.