Jim Gannon And Referees

[milo]

I can't believe after everything that's been said that Gannon felt the ref had a good game!! Barry Robson should've been off for his 2nd bookable offence near the end and the young guy Pollock was booked for hee haw! I got texts from people watching it on the telly that McGeady was booked for kicking out off the ball, so why no red?

 

Would the penalty Celtic got have been given up the other end? I don't think so.

[nethertonwellfan]

I can't believe after everything that's been said that Gannon felt the ref had a good game!! Barry Robson should've been off for his 2nd bookable offence near the end and the young guy Pollock was booked for hee haw! I got texts from people watching it on the telly that McGeady was booked for kicking out off the ball, so why no red?

He hardly kicked out. He tripped Ross Forbes up and as much as I hate the we prick a yellow card was the right decision.

[Rickoza]

McGeady should've been sent off simply for constantly moaning the face off every time something went against his team. I always thought it was the Captain of a team who was the only one allowed to approach the Ref to question anything, yet this idiot is forever in the face of a Ref. He did it constantly yesterday.

[Brazilian]

I can't believe after everything that's been said that Gannon felt the ref had a good game!! ..........................

 

I thought he sounded like he was just giving the party line sound bite to deflect the constant questioning about refs, i.e he said about how difficult game for ref etc i even laughed when he said he's a good guy with a good personality

[eaststandfan]

Samaras? handled the ball 3 times in my opnion yesterday one the ref was in clear view and Robson should have been sent off for second bookable offence near the end who said the ref had a good game

[Haggischomper]

He hardly kicked out. He tripped Ross Forbes up and as much as I hate the we prick a yellow card was the right decision.

 

 

I think yellow was probably correct but, by the letter of the law, I think McGeady could have no complaints if the ref had actually flashed red. Mind you, I wonder what the colour might have been if it had been Forbes kicking out at McGeady...

[delboy]

I heard Tam Cowan comments on the radio and I would just like to ask who is Tam Cowan.

 

Quality post Grew and get it right up 'em, Jim Gannon!

 

I also have to point out the fact the point of Jim Gannon statement has been conveniently avoided by the SFA and the media instead they started a slagging match.

 

Everyone know the standard of refereeing is poor to average and many games are spoiled by poor decision making, I think the real problem is the lack of people wanting to be a referee so we're stuck with a very limited pool of people to pick from.

[weepom]

What bugs me about all this referee stuff is the way they are getting hammered after every game - and big Levein is probably the worst culprit. It is never a player's fault for getting sent off or booked or the team's fault for losing the game or, heaven forbid, the manager's fault for choosing the wrong tactics on the day.

 

No referee is going to get it right every time - all we can hope for is that they get it right most of the time. Duff, or contentious (depending on how you look at it) decisions by the referees is part of what makes football worth watching.

 

In the game against Dundee Utd I'd say the referee got it right with the red cards - but overall he was pretty pish - that's life so just get on with it.

 

What really pissed me off about Gannon's outburst is that it defelcted any criticism that was justifiably going to head his way about the fact that we couldn't beat nine men - another failure to beat a depleted team - just how many players does a team have to get sent off before we manage to beat them.

 

I just wish managers would shut the fuck up about blaming everyone but themselves and their players when things go wrong, get on with the friggin' game and give us all piece.

[jonnymfc]

Have to agree with everything youve posted mate, Gannan gets my backing too.

[Chris]

Che Gannon.

 

Vive la resistance!

[Tweed]

What really pissed me off about Gannon's outburst is that it defelcted any criticism that was justifiably going to head his way about the fact that we couldn't beat nine men - another failure to beat a depleted team - just how many players does a team have to get sent off before we manage to beat them.

 

I just wish managers would shut the fuck up about blaming everyone but themselves and their players when things go wrong, get on with the friggin' game and give us all piece.

 

I'm pretty sure Gannon would have had words with the players privately. However 'Gannon says team lacks bottle' or something to that affect all over the sensationalist tabloid press is hardly going to do his young team any good. I'm sure he was disappointed with some of the decisions he and his players made in that game but the press going on about referees meant the players weren't encountering headlines about their bottle at every turn.

[Frazzie]

I didn't hear Tam Cowans show so I'm not defending what he's said, but it strikes me that there's still a high number of people on here who won't accept that Jim Gannon is not immune from criticism. He's taken a job as a football manager (for a six figure salary, lets not forget) so he must accept that negative feedback from fans is part of the package.

 

It also seems to me that a lot of the blindly loyal Gannonites are the same folk who had Mutley on a pedestal until he left. To my mind that makes them just as fickle as the folk who turn on the manager after a couple of bad results, if not more so.

[Ya Bezzer!]

Why are we complaining against referees again?

 

We've never had so many penalties and opposition players sent off.

 

When it comes down to it, how many mistakes by referee's have cost us points this season and how many mistakes by the manager have cost us points this season? But, hey, your not allowed to criticize the manager unless you've been in the game!

 

And for the record I don't think referee's should be immune from criticism and if they consistantly make mistakes something should be done but the problem is that the referee's are an big easy target.

 

I can't think of one stonewall match altering decision that has gone against us this season (Jamie Murphy? We got well and truly humped at Easter Road!) but the players and manager have thrown away so many points in the last couple of months its not true.

 

This whole thing is a deflection from the fact that multiple times we've thrown away leads, struggled to beat a mid league 1st Division side at home, consistantly couldn't beat 10 men, or even 9 men and have 1 win in the last 8.

 

If we'd won 6 games in a row none of this would happening. This Gannon crusade is phoney baloney bullshit that parallels exactly a long winless streak, starting at Accies since when we haven't won a single game despite being in the lead in four of the five matches.

[milo]

Why are we complaining against referees again?

 

We've never had so many penalties and opposition players sent off.

 

When it comes down to it, how many mistakes by referee's have cost us points this season and how many mistakes by the manager have cost us points this season? But, hey, your not allowed to criticize the manager unless you've been in the game!

 

And for the record I don't think referee's shouldn't be immune from criticism and if they consistantly make mistakes something should be done but the problem is that the referee's are an big easy target.

 

I can't think of one stonewall match altering decision that has gone against us this season (Jamie Murphy? We got well and truly humped at Easter Road!) but the players and manager have thrown away so many points in the last couple of months its not true.

 

This whole thing is a deflection from the fact that multiple times we've thrown away leads, struggled to beat a mid league 1st Division side at home, consistantly couldn't beat 10 men, or even 9 men and have 1 win in the last 8.

 

If we'd won 6 games in a row none of this would happening. This Gannon crusade is phoney baloney bullshit.

 

Difficult to argue with any of that to be honest.

[fatcalf]

Difficult to argue with any of that to be honest.

 

Naw it's no', it's dead easy if you put some thought intae it

Ah just cannae be bothered

[johnstone]

Why are we complaining against referees again?

 

We've never had so many penalties and opposition players sent off.

 

When it comes down to it, how many mistakes by referee's have cost us points this season and how many mistakes by the manager have cost us points this season? But, hey, your not allowed to criticize the manager unless you've been in the game!

 

And for the record I don't think referee's should be immune from criticism and if they consistantly make mistakes something should be done but the problem is that the referee's are an big easy target.

 

I can't think of one stonewall match altering decision that has gone against us this season (Jamie Murphy? We got well and truly humped at Easter Road!) but the players and manager have thrown away so many points in the last couple of months its not true.

 

This whole thing is a deflection from the fact that multiple times we've thrown away leads, struggled to beat a mid league 1st Division side at home, consistantly couldn't beat 10 men, or even 9 men and have 1 win in the last 8.

 

If we'd won 6 games in a row none of this would happening. This Gannon crusade is phoney baloney bullshit that parallels exactly a long winless streak, starting at Accies since when we haven't won a single game despite being in the lead in four of the five matches.

 

You are missing the point he is complaing about refs across the board. Not just what goes in our favour.

 

I agree, some of Gannons decisions have been quite strange, but the way I look at it is this.

 

Gannon does not want our team to close down and tackle, he wants us to play a passing game that is patient and builds from the back. He is teaching young players to play the game properly and if that means we don't win much then 'thats life'. Its a learning experience

 

You need time to create a decent team and also time to make them do what you want.

 

Some of the criticsm on here baffles me sometimes. This is a fresh start for a very very young team and it might take one season, it might take two, but I hope by the end of it we are watching really good football at Fir Park, win lose or draw.

 

We can maon all we want about results and team selection, but the fact of the matter is we are watching a team learning a new skill - passing! Not many teams in the SPL do that very well.

[Jonesy]

You are missing the point he is complaing about refs across the board. Not just what goes in our favour.

 

I agree, some of Gannons decisions have been quite strange, but the way I look at it is this.

 

Gannon does not want our team to close down and tackle, he wants us to play a passing game that is patient and builds from the back. He is teaching young players to play the game properly and if that means we don't win much then 'thats life'. Its a learning experience

 

You need time to create a decent team and also time to make them do what you want.

 

Some of the criticsm on here baffles me sometimes. This is a fresh start for a very very young team and it might take one season, it might take two, but I hope by the end of it we are watching really good football at Fir Park, win lose or draw.

 

We can maon all we want about results and team selection, but the fact of the matter is we are watching a team learning a new skill - passing! Not many teams in the SPL do that very well.

 

Amen.

[milo]

Naw it's no', it's dead easy if you put some thought intae it

Ah just cannae be bothered

 

To be honest, I can see both sides.

[Welltastic]

QUOTE (steelboy @ Dec 12 2009, 10:21 PM) 1. we probably disagree in the difference in quality but if the epl with near infinite resources and ten times the population with only 3.5xs the games can't solve every problem what chance do we have.

 

2. we need a certain amount of refs. changing how exams are graded isn't going to effect which refs are most capable of handling spl matches. it'll be the same people with the highest grades they'll just score lower in the tests.

 

3. i don't see how that would improve standards. it just heaps more pressure on the refs and undermines them.

 

netherton - i honestly don't believe refs are incompetent. before the dundee united game i can't remember a single thread on here complaining about refs.

 

Steelboy, in regard to point 3, I think that there are methods for improving refereing standards (although without resorting to public criticism) and these can be outlined as follows: -

 

• Use the grading official for the referees to address serious complaints from the manager(s) regarding bookings etc so that an independant observer is used to gage the performance of the referee on that game. This can be done directly after the game and might prevent the on-air tirades that have been coming from Manager's.
  
• Every Monday after the game, the independant official reviews the game with the referee to see what improvements/points can be made.
  
• Every Wednesday, a Managers/Referees panel can be convened to allow better understanding of the rules of the game and their application by referees in general. This should promote greater understanding between Referees and Managers.
  
• Publish a Referee Standards Table at the end of the month/season to allow people to see progress of the refs and thus dispel the notion that they aren't improving.
  
• If a Referee makes a howler repeatedly, then submit that referee for advanced refresher course to allow them to improve their standards. After the course, the grading official evaluates the ref to see if they have taken on-board the course teaching and it's application to a game setting.
  

These suggestions could therefore in turn help promote better understanding and release some of the pressure on officials, so as to allow them to give more consistent perfomrances at the top of their game.

[Big Trac]

I'm quite happy that he's trying to develop a passing game. I'm not sure it always works (like against St. Mirren when we attempted to pass it, but played it back and forth along the back 5 THEN humped it) , but it's a good idea and it's giving us something different. (Though again, I'd prefer it if we could press the ball more when not in possession. Even if we're not tackling constantly we can still put pressure on.)

 

But I digress.

 

What worries me is that he suddenly decided to be a one man army versus the referees. He's right to complain about the quiality of refs, and shouldn't be scared to do so, but he has gone on and on about it and then suddenly says he's not interested in talking about it, and that he hasn't bothered opening letters he received. Just seems like he's being an arrogant arse for the sake of it.

 

All teams have the same refs. Make your complaint and have a discussion by all means. But leave it at that and deal with people in the correct manner.

 

I also worry, that he talks a lot about what he's trying to do, and stuff about no favourites, players play on merit, and he wants them to play a passing game. But what he actually does is often different. There're players that complete about 1 in 10 passes, which would instantly make me think they're not right for his team, but he seems to have developed favourites just like McGhee did. (Again, after saying everyone would get a chance)

 

I'll re-iterate, that I like what he's trying to do. I'm just not sure he's doing it well. But I accept it may take youngsters longer to develop and they will be more inconsistent than others.

[Steve Diggle]

He didn't make himself a one man army tho!

[nethertonwellfan]

and that he hasn't bothered opening letters he received.

what you talking about? When he said that during an interview he explained that he had just received the letters and that he hadn't had time to open them due to said interview. I am sure they have been opened now.

[Big Trac]

what you talking about? When he said that during an interview he explained that he had just received the letters and that he hadn't had time to open them due to said interview. I am sure they have been opened now.

 

Probably, aye. Just thought he seemed a bit offhand after making such a fuss about it.

Then when he was asked about it after the Celtic game he said he wasn't going to talk about that because it had been a good game. He seemed like he thought that was very clever and was smiling, and I just wondered why he'd bothered in the first place.

[stoney]

Probably, aye. Just thought he seemed a bit offhand after making such a fuss about it.

Then when he was asked about it after the Celtic game he said he wasn't going to talk about that because it had been a good game. He seemed like he thought that was very clever and was smiling, and I just wondered why he'd bothered in the first place.

 

nope what hge said was that he wa surprised that the media were wanting to continue with their story line of Jim having a go at the referees. Jim complianed publically 2 times and the media spun it into controversy to sell papers. Since then he has asked repeatedly for the media to ask and report on our team. It has not stopped the media from running with the "one man war" cr@p tho

[Wellfan1984]

Gannon does not want our team to close down and tackle, he wants us to play a passing game that is patient and builds from the back. He is teaching young players to play the game properly and if that means we don't win much then 'thats life'. Its a learning experience

 

Basically this.

 

Gannon is now doing what these players should have learned when they were kids. You know what kids in most other countries learn when they're 10-13 years old

 

As for his comments after the Celtic game. He was spot on, why the hell did the media want Gannon to talk about the referees after a relatively decent game of football.