Summer Football

[Wellfan1984]

Problem is you don't have a Dunfermline supporters club in LA, an Inverness Caley Thistle one in Boston or a Motherwell one in Brisbane. I lived in LA and went to both the Rangers and Celtic clubs to watch them play Motherwell, I paid $15-20 to get in because Setanta (at the time) and now ESPN charge a fortune. Don't be naive and suggest that the Old Firm aren't the greatest TV draw for our game. There is no/a fraction of the audience for St Mirren vs Dundee Utd.

 

So? East Stirling, you know the team in the Scottish Third Division is like the 5th or 6th biggest Club in Norway - having at it's height a supporters club with 6000 members.

[LadywellToi]

And in the 2001 census people were asked via the internet and a email campaign to put down they were Jedi Knights so it would get official status as a religion. So one guy and his mate visited the ground because of the novelty factor, returned to Norway and made up a page. 6,000 people joined, don't understand the relevance to the SPL and TV revenues.

[Wellfan1984]

And in the 2001 census people were asked via the internet and a email campaign to put down they were Jedi Knights so it would get official status as a religion. So one guy and his mate visited the ground because of the novelty factor, returned to Norway and made up a page. 6,000 people joined, don't understand the relevance to the SPL and TV revenues.

 

 

Eh naw that's not what happened. It's a paying Supporters Club, you know like most Supporter Clubs. So it has the same relavance that Celtic and Rangers have supporter clubs in other countries, but unlike Rangers and Celtic, East Stirlings' ones weren't probably made by ex-pats.

 

Basically if you market something well enough then it doesn't matter what the product is it will sell. So if the SPL Marketing Department, The SFA and the SFL get together and market summer football as the best thing on the box, then it won't depend on how many games are Old Firm games (still could have 4 a season if they did a round robin Regional League Cup) or who's in what league or whatever other sport is on it will still get an audience to match - if not greater than current.

[Malky79]

Problem is you don't have a Dunfermline supporters club in LA, an Inverness Caley Thistle one in Boston or a Motherwell one in Brisbane. I lived in LA and went to both the Rangers and Celtic clubs to watch them play Motherwell, I paid $15-20 to get in because Setanta (at the time) and now ESPN charge a fortune. Don't be naive and suggest that the Old Firm aren't the greatest TV draw for our game. There is no/a fraction of the audience for St Mirren vs Dundee Utd.

 

We'd all love it if they didn't rule the roost, full of glory-hunters and bigots, but they do. Why are so quit walking around with a chip on the shoulder and deal with basic business sense.

 

As for groundskeeping, golf courses seem to manage to keep the grass in good nick and they are used at their peak in summer all day opposed to 1.5 hours. (granted studs cause more damage and I've never slide tackled someone for playing through). The issue is the grass is left alone from Dec to March and used when its at its most regenerating.

 

I wouldn't pay for Scandanavian football either, however if I was English (God forbid) and Scottish football was covered on Sky Sports 1-3, with a common language, familiarity and rudimentary interest I would be inclined to watch it.

 

Irrelevant so long as they remain in the SPL. Needs more than them to make a league, so they are the big draw but no reason for them to take the bigger share. They'd get he-haw for a league of just the two of them!

[nethertonwellfan]

So whit is your argument Ladywell. I thought you were on here to get ideas on how to make the better. Would it not be a good start to please the fans ?

I have came up with numerous ideas and I don't expect everyone to agree with them but you shoot them down with the same shite What about the old firm? What about the bigot scum c***s? The fact of the matter is the other 10 clubs have been letting the OF bully them for years and it's time to stand up and distribute the cash fairly. What are the old firm really gonna do if the others vote to expand the league and distribute the money fairly? Leave? Nobody wants them and nobody cares for them.

It seems to me that you think the answer should be the status quo but played in the summer. I have news for you mate, that aint gonna cut it. There is far more competition for football in the summer What are kids gonna choose between Hamilton V St Mirren or a day down at M&Ds in the summer sunshine?

I'll ask you the very same as you aked me earlier in this thread. What initiatives of mine do you agree with?

[Shaka]

Heres my 10 point view on scottish football change,unfortunately will never happen due to the bigwigs self interest + everyones fear of the bigot brothers

 

1. SFA,SPL,SFL merge into 1 governing body for football, less chiefs,less cash squandered

 

2. SFA annual grant for all clubs to help toward reduction of gate prices

 

3. Government help in the form of both Grants for youth coaching (a paid youth coach for every team in the Scottish league and cash toward youth league costs) + a structured school football system, local league,regional cup,national cup

 

4. Premier League of 16 , (play each other twice) (2 Relegated,3rd bottom play off)

1st Division of 14 , (2 promoted,2 relegated + 3rd top play off,3rd bottom play off)

2nd Division of 12 (2 promoted,3rd play off)

 

5. Premier League starts last saturday in July, Break after NYD Games,back 2nd sat in Feb, end 1st Sat in may, Scottish Cup Final 2nd sat in may

 

6. 30 games in Prem means tv deal can stay the same (60 games per season?) just means 2 live games every weekend.

 

7. ALL monies from sponsorship split evenly between EVERY league member, if the Old Firm dont like it, fuck off to your Jackanory North Atlantic Super European Vauxhall Conference League and we wont take the pish much when you come crawling back on your knees (Remember they need us as much or more than we need them)

 

8. League cup split into 8 regional groups of 4 with the 8 winners contesting the Quarters onwards (ie Well v Airdrie (win cse were pish in cups) , Hamilton (win) v Albion Rov, Airdrie v Hamilton , Hamilton into quarters)

 

9. Terracing allowed in ALL grounds

 

10. Premier League squad cap of 24, Wage cap of 60% of Turnover, Match day squad of 18 (7 subs)

[LadywellToi]

I think you can't ignore the two biggest draws in our league because they dominate it on the pitch or their association with religion. We're now in a different debate. If its fair to share the money equally between all league members then I take it we gloss over sharing it dependant on average attendance or TV demand or audience.

 

To use an analogy, poll tax riots in late 80's early 90's people rioted because they felt a blanket tax regardless of income was unfair. You are suggesting a blanket payout regardless of any other criteria other than they make up 2 members of a 12 member league. We might see Old Firms fans rioting like Trafalgar Square c.1990 .... oh wait .... Manchester ... and that's just because their plasma telly broke.

 

Tell you what, SPL go to Sky and say, OK switch to pay per game rather than fee for the whole season. Ask how much they'd pay for Rangers vs Hibs and then St Johnstone vs Aberdeen then you've got your answer.

 

Netherton - I did say that I agreed with some of your points (post #40), suggest absorbing what is written rather than seeing red every time I mention the Old Firm. If you want specifics, the idea for the league cup, 2 and 5.

 

If it was my kid who wanted to opt for MD's I'd bitch slap the ned out of him.

 

Summer football because it offers a sea change, improved conditions and better product. Ask Rugby union fans if its not worked for them or if the pitches can't handle it.

[weeyin]

Summer football because it offers a sea change, improved conditions and better product. Ask Rugby union fans if its not worked for them or if the pitches can't handle it.

Ireland switched to summer football and their attendances remained static. So even if it improved the product (which I doubt), it had no effect on the revenue being generated. And they don't have to cope with domestic teams making it to the group stages of the Europa or Champions League, far less have players shooting off to World Cups and Euros.

[numpty]

Ireland switched to summer football and their attendances remained static. So even if it improved the product (which I doubt), it had no effect on the revenue being generated.

Then again, it usually rains even more here in Ireland during the summer than it does during the winter

[nethertonwellfan]

I think you can't ignore the two biggest draws in our league because they dominate it on the pitch or their association with religion. We're now in a different debate. If its fair to share the money equally between all league members then I take it we gloss over sharing it dependant on average attendance or TV demand or audience.

 

To use an analogy, poll tax riots in late 80's early 90's people rioted because they felt a blanket tax regardless of income was unfair. You are suggesting a blanket payout regardless of any other criteria other than they make up 2 members of a 12 member league. We might see Old Firms fans rioting like Trafalgar Square c.1990 .... oh wait .... Manchester ... and that's just because their plasma telly broke.

 

Tell you what, SPL go to Sky and say, OK switch to pay per game rather than fee for the whole season. Ask how much they'd pay for Rangers vs Hibs and then St Johnstone vs Aberdeen then you've got your answer.

 

Netherton - I did say that I agreed with some of your points (post #40), suggest absorbing what is written rather than seeing red every time I mention the Old Firm. If you want specifics, the idea for the league cup, 2 and 5.

 

If it was my kid who wanted to opt for MD's I'd bitch slap the ned out of him.

 

Summer football because it offers a sea change, improved conditions and better product. Ask Rugby union fans if its not worked for them or if the pitches can't handle it.

It was specifics I was after. As for the Old Firm if they riot tough shit . What they really gonna do if we bully them for a change?

[LadywellToi]

http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/d.../crank2010.html

 

Ireland's league is rated at 29th, ours at 15th, at present we have a better and higher exposure league, there would be someone willing to pick up the TV rights in addition if summer football went ahead with us. Irish revenues haven't changed because they have a lacklustre product at present (Local football plays second fiddle to English/Scottish which competes on a more even footing with Gaelic Hurling/Football and Rugby than here). I thought there would have been an increase in gate revenue.

 

Do the fans of Irish clubs prefer the new structure and watching their football in the sun or hanker back to traditional setup?

 

Any cataclysmic events ensuring the pitches are less playable than when it was a Aug to May season?

 

Any postponements at all?

[numpty]

http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/d.../crank2010.html

 

Ireland's league is rated at 29th, ours at 15th, at present we have a better and higher exposure league, there would be someone willing to pick up the TV rights in addition if summer football went ahead with us. Irish revenues haven't changed because they have a lacklustre product at present (Local football plays second fiddle to English/Scottish which competes on a more even footing with Gaelic Hurling/Football and Rugby than here). I thought there would have been an increase in gate revenue.

 

Do the fans of Irish clubs prefer the new structure and watching their football in the sun or hanker back to traditional setup?

 

Any cataclysmic events ensuring the pitches are less playable than when it was a Aug to May season?

 

Any postponements at all?

One thing to note is that most top-flight Irish football matches are played on a Friday evening, in a move to reduce the competition with those other sports to some extent.

 

League of Ireland attendances did initially increase when summer football was introduced, but have dwindled again since the novelty wore off. The main complaints tend to be the same as ours, though, rather than anything to do with the Friday night/summer experience-- too expensive, poor quality entertainment, and unpopular league format (top 10 teams playing each other four times a season).

 

You certainly do still get the odd postponement in the latter stages of the season too, there were a few around October/November last year due to waterlogged pitches.

[Malky79]

I think you can't ignore the two biggest draws in our league because they dominate it on the pitch or their association with religion. We're now in a different debate. If its fair to share the money equally between all league members then I take it we gloss over sharing it dependant on average attendance or TV demand or audience.

 

To use an analogy, poll tax riots in late 80's early 90's people rioted because they felt a blanket tax regardless of income was unfair. You are suggesting a blanket payout regardless of any other criteria other than they make up 2 members of a 12 member league. We might see Old Firms fans rioting like Trafalgar Square c.1990 .... oh wait .... Manchester ... and that's just because their plasma telly broke.

 

Tell you what, SPL go to Sky and say, OK switch to pay per game rather than fee for the whole season. Ask how much they'd pay for Rangers vs Hibs and then St Johnstone vs Aberdeen then you've got your answer.

 

Netherton - I did say that I agreed with some of your points (post #40), suggest absorbing what is written rather than seeing red every time I mention the Old Firm. If you want specifics, the idea for the league cup, 2 and 5.

 

If it was my kid who wanted to opt for MD's I'd bitch slap the ned out of him.

 

Summer football because it offers a sea change, improved conditions and better product. Ask Rugby union fans if its not worked for them or if the pitches can't handle it.

 

I don't think that is a useful analogy as in that case it was an unfair burden on poorer people. Arguably it is vice versa with the richer clubs recieving less than they might feel is due.

 

Well I don't see a problem. All of the clubs should take TV revenue as a collective income. Now the OF's appeal might bring in the money, but seeing as they can't really play each other 30 times a season every other club is JUST as important in making up the league and therefore should get an equal share.

 

It is better all round as it at least somewhat reduces the financial imbalance and allows for a slightly more level playing field, something which in a more competative league might even bring in increased crowds around the division(assuming the OF hordes don't disappear like snow of a dyke if their dominance is threatened). But with their larger fanbase and other commerical advantages would still leave the OF with an advantage that really should make them big favourites most of the time, but just maybe other teams might at least threaten now and again and maybe at least do better in the cups.

[LadywellToi]

So at present there hasn't been much of a change except fans can watch the games in their t-shirt and sit outside a pub for a drink beforehand for 3 extra months?

 

Interesting about the Friday night thing though, I underestimated the pull of the Gaelic sports until I saw the size of Croke Park and remembered C4's attempt to show it in the early 90's. Guess we wouldn't have to reschedule because Kingussie was playing Clachnicuddin.

 

I think another good thing about it is Amateur and Junior players could get to senior games for a portion of the season they would normally miss.

[LadywellToi]

I know it will not only be us in the SPL that is affected but wonder how the pitch will fare until the start of April when it starts to regenerate.

 

Cue all sorts of abuse on Clyde, Real and Sportsound with the league cup semi to be played. Could do without it. I know its the best option that is equidistant and it will probably be near to full giving a better atmosphere opposed to playing at Hampden.

 

I really can't be arsed with winter football any more, over it. Ended up almost doing the Olympic speed walk down Airbles Road because two of my mates were freezing. I'm more of a saunterer.

[DEWELL]

This really is a no brainer. Go and watch a game with shirt sleeves on or go when it's minus 5 and the pitch is like a tattie field like saturday?? Also NEVER on a friday night. Sat afternoons in June watching the Well. You know it makes sense. I'd have a winter shutdown from the 3rd week in December till February.