Leeann D

[star sail]

The problems in football go beyond anything that the people at Motherwell can solve. There are different factors affecting the game worldwide and specific factors that cause problems for the game in Scotland.

 

The biggest problem Motherwell as a club faces is it's proximity to Glasgow. I find it depressing to stand at Motherwell station at 5.30pm on a Saturday eve to see trains from Glasgow offload a few thousand Rangers and Celtic supporting Motherwell residents. This is a historical problem and there is nothing Motherwell can do to fix it.

 

From what I see and hear the people at Motherwell try very hard to make the business viable and they have not been shy over the years to try new initiatives.

For me the only way forward is to keep investing in the young players. Hopefully Motherwell could be seen as a centre of excellence for young players such that the most talanted youngsters in the country would choose Motherwell as a club to sign for. I think supporters need something to buy into and given that the Old Firm have a strangle hold on the SPL, I think that the next best thing for a support is to have the satisfaction of seeing the next James McFadden develop under the Fir Park floodlights giving us some thrills and spills along the way.

 

Whichever way is up Leann Dempster has a hell of a difficult job and we can't expect miracles.

[mjw]

So we just carry on regardless, shit product in a shit stadium, new strips every season,extortionate catering prices, Motherwell fans sitting in the house on a saturday because we don't really care if they can't afford it-thats their tough luck,so much for the family/community club.When the cuts that are coming from this new government start biting in, going to watch Motherwell will be a luxury that very few will be able to afford. where will be in 5-10 years or is it enough to just get by.

[maxywell]

for the club it is enough,very few clubs are making any money and if they are just coming out even then they can't afford to make cuts to help a few and risk going bust and leaving 1000s without a team and 100s without a job.there is no miracle cure that's going to leave everbody happy.things like this have a way of working themselves out and if they don't then we're all fucked anyway.

[airfinz]

Tenner a game and I'll be there every week. Will pick and choose the games to go to otherwise. First season in ages I aint got the season ticket, and dont miss it yet.

 

I will treat the well as a 'club' as soon as the 'club' treats us like a 'club,'

[Burn_Broomfield]

where will be in 5-10 years or is it enough to just get by.

 

 

Part-Time, like the maybe 7 other SPL Clubs. Scottish football is completely fucked and this time there is no saving us. We will be a semi-pro team in a decade as will St Mirren, Killie, Falkirk, ICT, Hamilton, St Johnstone, Dundee etc... The fans have had enough and there is no repairing the damage every club has done to it's fanbases. We are already on the long fall down and it will only get worse as time goes by. Rangers and Celtic will also suffer dramatically and eventually we will be on the same level as the LOW or Irish Premier. Fans aren't interested in watching Dundee Utd play Killie 4 times, they aren't interested in being treated like the worst criminals when they enter a football ground, they aren't interested in sub standard stadia, sub standard food, and most paying a small fortune to watch sub standard football.

 

We will dip below 3k on a few home games this season, It's all fucked

[Steve Diggle]

BB is essentially on the money and I can completely sympathise with Airfinz.

 

The bones of their point though is the biggest disgrace ever in Scottish Football.

 

The fans have been 'speaking' for years upon years and never once have the SPL or the SFA (or any other body)taken heed of anything that's been said. It's the same old same old every single year in terms of the way the game is 'marketed'.

 

Unfortunately at some point quite soon - the entire football world in Scotland will roll uncontrollably over the cliff.

[star sail]

BB is essentially on the money and I can completely sympathise with Airfinz.

 

The bones of their point though is the biggest disgrace ever in Scottish Football.

 

The fans have been 'speaking' for years upon years and never once have the SPL or the SFA (or any other body)taken heed of anything that's been said. It's the same old same old every single year in terms of the way the game is 'marketed'.

 

Unfortunately at some point quite soon - the entire football world in Scotland will roll uncontrollably over the cliff.

 

Agreed but it's not just the SPL and SFA that seem to think that change is bad. Remember Graeme Spiers article not so long ago speaking of Motherwell as a yo-yo club with nothing but self interest regarding league reconstruction. I think it was an article in response to Craig Browns comments on league reconstruction.

 

The press in Scotland have possibly the greatest power in our game (as regards creating the atmosphere in which our game operates) and could if they were responsible enough have an influence on the future of the game in this country. Unfortunately they are so obsessed with stories (or non stories) regarding the Old Firm that they completely ignore the bigger picture.

[Pepper]

I think the dodgy cable boxes being zapped good and proper might result in a cheeky wee jump in attendances this year.

[Guest 'Flow]

Flow, fair point but what many are trying to say is that without some major changes in the near future to stop the downward spiral of attendances and income - you will be making redundancies every year!!

Its no longer about cutting ticket prices to try and tempt people back to Fir Park as its now more important just to keep those that are still turning up every week!

Yep, I totally agree SCC - However, those major changes will probably have to come from more than just (i.e. way above) Motherwell Football Club I suspect.

 

So we just carry on regardless, shit product in a shit stadium, new strips every season,extortionate catering prices, Motherwell fans sitting in the house on a saturday because we don't really care if they can't afford it-thats their tough luck,so much for the family/community club.When the cuts that are coming from this new government start biting in, going to watch Motherwell will be a luxury that very few will be able to afford. where will be in 5-10 years or is it enough to just get by.

I ain't having a go but I think you're being a little unfair there mate.

 

Doing my best not to biased, I think Motherwell Football Club is one of the clubs in the SPL who are trying to improve the lot, not only of our individual club, but the league and the Scottish game in general. We have a forward-thinking, modern Chief Executive with fresh and un-biased opinions and thoughts about where the club/game should go and they are very sensible indeed.

 

The club have made some positive strides in the past few years, I'd say, in improving things at Fir Park. Whilst everything isn't all perfect, we've made great advances in our communication channels (which will continue to improve as time goes on).

 

We've cemented much better relationships with the relevant bodies who have influence in running our matches and games.

 

With the exception of last year - we have turned five successive operating profits in what is one of the most financially challenging periods the world has ever faced.

 

We have taken great time and effort to revolutionise our community programme aimed at placing the football club at the heart of the Lanarkshire public - with much, MUCH more to come from that.

 

We've invested time, money and infrastructure into our Youth Development programme that has supplied numerous International players over the last five to ten years and, currently, has the most graduates in the current first-team than any other SPL club.

 

We have listened to the fans when reintroducing some more traditional elements to the club; things like the return of the hoop on the strip right down to the return of the catering to a club product this season which heralds the return of the famous Chapman’s Pie.

 

We've still got one of the cheapest Season Tickets in the SPL and this year and are one of the few clubs who operate a trust based interest free payment plan to help fans spread the cost burden. We have a family ticket in the Cooper Stand that allows up to two free kids enter completely free of charge the whole season.

 

We have, albeit still in the early stages, a fans committee established to further enhance the relationship the club has with its fans.

 

That may all sounds like some sort of exert from Pravda, but I don't accept the club shrugs its shoulders and gives the fans a take it as it is, or leave it ultimatum. Yes, there is much to do. Yes, there is much to be improved on but, as far as Motherwell Football Club goes, we're on a sound footing with the people currently making the calls and are heading down the correct path.

 

The problems and issues with football transcend our club and stretch way beyond even our borders. I agree we need positive change but getting it will be very difficult. However, at MFC, we have people actively working for a better future but that'll take time.

[Guest 'Flow]

The press in Scotland have possibly the greatest power in our game (as regards creating the atmosphere in which our game operates) and could if they were responsible enough have an influence on the future of the game in this country. Unfortunately they are so obsessed with stories (or non stories) regarding the Old Firm that they completely ignore the bigger picture.

Couldn't agree more and it is something I bang on about constantly to the point of tedium...

 

As a nation, I think we'd all accept that, generally speaking, we deal in negatives. Scandal and bad news sells and that is reflected in the coverage we see and read every day in our newspapers and televisions.

 

The more you say something is bad and not working, the more people will believe it and that's one of the major problems facing the game in Scotland. Take England as a quick example. Everyone and their aunty, south of the border, will tell you the Premiership is the best league in the world. Through coverage on Sky, BBC and online, I have watched plenty of football matches from the top league in England that have been absolutely woeful.

 

However, it is packaged in such a way that we are almost brainwashed into overlooking the dross and focusing on the positives. A combination of the very clever, and expensive, marketing teamed with the English psyche. Fair play to them; the same is currently happening with the Championship after an overhaul a few years ago and I believe now that it is approaching the top five 'most expensive' leagues in the world; absolutely incredible.

 

We need the media, in the country, to get behind our product and that comes in involving them in how the whole thing is structured (no, I am not kidding). If they believe they have had an influence in how things shape up in this country, they are much less likely to have the knives out each and every day in our newspapers and televisions. It's the same model our colleagues in England used.

 

The less "Scottish Football in Crisis" headlines we read each and every day, the less people will start to believe that.

 

Then, and only then, do you really start making pushes for change in the nitty gritty things that are keeping people away - I am thinking about how the game is priced, when games take place, the rules people need to abide by when they enter the ground (and much, much more).

 

As I said in my previous post, these issues are for much more than Motherwell FC but, thankfully, we have really good people in charge banging the drum for positive change.

[Fergie79]

I've read everyone's comments and money is tight for both the club and fans. Unfortunately there is no magic wand.

 

I am sure like many of you I have spent a lot of time thinking what would u do with motherwell if u won the lottery. One of the first things would prob be reduce ticket prices to £10 adults and £5 kids and take a hit in the lottery fund but should mean more people at for park, and more fans of tomorrow, kids, coming to games.

 

Motherwell are giving free season tickets to kids just now in the cooper, this is superb in my opinion and maybe hasn't been publisised in the media enough. A lot of my friends have kids and are old firm fans, but they don't want to start taking their kids there and have said they would take them to see motherwell instead. I think there is a new fan base there its just about making a day watching motherwell more appealing and family friendly.

 

Back to the lottery win. Just now motherwell won't make much money pre match. Instead the local pubs are the only place that do. Before every home game I would have a big marquee selling lunches with stalls for kids to enjoy. I would have beat the goalie comps, bouncie castles, musical entertainment, and need I say a beer tent. Call it a fan zone if you will. Going to the football should be a day out with not just the game to look forward too. This could mean reduced match entry prices, but still making money before and after the game to cover this and making match DAY a proper event!

 

Of course this would take initial investment to build a fan zone that is winter friendly bit would entice more fans, families away from the old firm and make motherwell that bit more different and community spirited.

 

I also thought about investing in a training complex of our own but looks like the new indoor facility at ravenscraig is going to be used.

 

That's me away out to buy more lottery tickets

[hoof hearted]

yous aww shag flows arse

[decal]

All of these points made, from both sides, I think are valid, however the answer is staring folk in the face everytime they turn up at fir park........'fir park'.

 

The stadium is years past its best and I honestly think it puts people of coming to the games.

We need to spend to save and secure a future for the club by moving to a new purpose built stadium where, we can income generate...conferences, weddings and functions, schools, meals etc. I don't suspect that we will, at this time given the state of the place, be making much money from these sort of areas. Before any of you start throwing daggers, I had my wedding, a birthday party and recently a leaving party at FP, so I think I'm entitled to pass comment. If there is money being made from these areas currently, it certainly isn't being put back into the 'stadium', the pictures taken over the last cold snap are evidence of this.

 

Football is a business now, whether we (the supporter) like it or not. Fir Park is a traditional football ground which cannot facilitate the business ventures the club should be pursuing. Name me another SPL club that has not, over the past 5-10 years, invested significantly in their stadia? Exactly.

 

D

[Kmcalpin]

So we just carry on regardless, shit product in a shit stadium, new strips every season,extortionate catering prices, Motherwell fans sitting in the house on a saturday because we don't really care if they can't afford it-thats their tough luck,so much for the family/community club.

 

Nothing personal MJW but I felt that I had to come out of self imposed exile to reply to your post. I'll start by saying that admission prices are far too high - the fans know that as does MFC. No argument there.

 

Leeann Dempster is 100% right when she said that fans lacked an understanding of football clubs' finances. As Brazilian pointed out she wasn't referring to gate prices when she said that. I'm not blaming anyone for that, its simply a fact. For example, few fans seem to realise that 17.5%, shortly to become 20% of course, of ticket prices, programme prices and transfer fees is siphoned off by the Teasury in the form of VAT. Thats a lot of dosh.

 

The club knows we have an out of date stadium and will move as soon as we can afford to. What else can it do? I don't agree at all that we have a "shit product". We were the 5th best club in Scotland last year. In attending Fir park for 50 years I've seen many, many worse Well sides. What are you comparing us with? The EPL, La Liga? if so thats totally unrealsitic.

 

By way of comparison I recently attended the SECC for what was in effect a 90 minute concert. It cost £40 per ticket with a programme being a tenner. The seats were awful and the accoustics poor.

 

Flow makes 2 very good posts and I have no guilt about saying so. He is right that the state of football is no one party's fault. The press have a huge role to play and many fans are brainwashed. I read this comment by Ewing Grahame in this morning's SoS about our forthcoming tie.

 

"This tie is unlikely to quicken pulses outwith North Lanarkshire."

 

There was no need go overboard to dress it up but equally there was no need to demean it. A totally unnecessary statement and one which illutstrates the problems the so called Scots media cause our game.

 

The club is making a great effort to win over the community.

 

I can only suggest that you contact Ms Dempster and ask to meet her to explain "financial reality" and her vision for the club. You might learn something interesting and surprising as might many. The future isn't all rosy but the club is in good hands.

[Guest]

What I don't understand is folk greeting about a 'poor product.' I'm a Motherwell fan and I'll go and see them whenever I can over any other football game. Its not an inferior product to any other type of football because I actually care about it. The EPL has some good games and European league games hold no interest for me whatsoever.

 

The SPL is a cracking league with competitive games played at 100 miles an hour week in week out.

[star sail]

Flow makes 2 very good posts and I have no guilt about saying so. He is right that the state of football is non one party's fault. The press have a huge role to play and many fans are brainwashed. I read this comment by Ewing Grahame in theis morning's SoS about our forthcoming tie.

 

"This tie is unlikely to quicken pulses outwith North Lanarkshire."

 

There was no need go overboard to dress it up but equally there was no need to demean it. A totally unnecessary statement and one which illutstrates the problems the so called Scots media cause our game.

 

A brilliant example and in todays papers too. This shows in a nutshell the disrespect journalists show to the teams outwith the Old Firm. Over the last few days we have seen the papers full of Martin O Neils comment that Aiden McGeady is a Preimiership standard player. This is a complete non story and yet it is given much more significance than two of the Scottish teams playing in Europe this week.

 

We all know the reasons for it but it is slowly killing the Scottish game. I am sure that Ewing Grahame is much too full of self importance to worry about that.

[steelboy]

So we just carry on regardless, shit product in a shit stadium, new strips every season,extortionate catering prices, Motherwell fans sitting in the house on a saturday because we don't really care if they can't afford it-thats their tough luck,so much for the family/community club.When the cuts that are coming from this new government start biting in, going to watch Motherwell will be a luxury that very few will be able to afford. where will be in 5-10 years or is it enough to just get by.

 

at least you to get moan about it on here for free, every cloud and all at.

[john_M_F_C]

Making it a tenner to get in isn't going to make people turn up. Some people will still rather spend a tenner on afew pints and watch a shite Premiership game or and OF game.

 

All this Fir Park scaring the punters away's a lot of shite aswell. It's one of the thigs keeping the crowds as high imo. The vast majority our fans stay pretty local and probablly walk, it's near 2 train stations, one on the Edinburgh line and both to Glasgow opening us up to both home and away fans coming to games with relative ease. Now moving up to somewhere where there is no train station seems daft. Moving to Ravenscraig would turn alot of people away, who wants to walk as much as an extra 20 minutes for some fans in the pissing rain on a cold saturday to see St. Mirren. If the East and Main are too old for people then they should sit in the fucking coooper stand. I really don't see how an old stand tuns people away, when mst of the talk about our preseason games was about going to good old wee stadiums.

[Tweed]

The club knows we have an out of date stadium and will move as soon as we can afford to. What else can it do? I don't agree at all that we have a "shit product". We were the 5th best club in Scotland last year. In attending Fir park for 50 years I've seen many, many worse Well sides. What are you comparing us with? The EPL, La Liga? if so thats totally unrealsitic.

 

I think the fact that we were the 5th best team in Scotland last year only highlights the fact that the product is rotten. I can think of many Motherwell teams who have fought relegation over the years who would have beaten last year's crop.

 

As for Ewing Grahame's point. I think Celtic's game this week has been underplayed as well given how important it is. I think the thing that worries me most is that ten years ago I'd have been confident of all three playing this week progressing; today I look ahead and say Celtic have a chance but will struggle, Hibs much the same and we are 50-50. Its only three years since Rangers were in a European final yet the prospect of a Scottish team being in Europe after Christmas seems light years away today.

 

I think what Scottish football needs is the Old Firm to get a few players who will really excite the public. Seeing someone like a Laudrup or a Gascoinge or a Larsson will bring people back and if they can get them for a couple of years it may entice a few others to come here to play them. But we need money for that to happen

[mjw]

at least you to get moan about it on here for free, every cloud and all at.

 

Is it moaning though or can i not be concerned about the future of a club that has been a massive part of my life since my old man lifted me over the turnstyle 30+years ago.I applaud all those who think everything is rosy but i make no apologies for how i feel,we are the fifth best of a bad lot in the SPL and our game(club and inernational) is dire.If people are happy to lay the blame at the door of the scottish media and absolve the govening bodies and clubs of any blame then the ball is well and truly burst.

[tree]

Yep, I totally agree SCC - However, those major changes will probably have to come from more than just (i.e. way above) Motherwell Football Club I suspect.

 

 

I ain't having a go but I think you're being a little unfair there mate.

 

Doing my best not to biased, I think Motherwell Football Club is one of the clubs in the SPL who are trying to improve the lot, not only of our individual club, but the league and the Scottish game in general. We have a forward-thinking, modern Chief Executive with fresh and un-biased opinions and thoughts about where the club/game should go and they are very sensible indeed.

 

The club have made some positive strides in the past few years, I'd say, in improving things at Fir Park. Whilst everything isn't all perfect, we've made great advances in our communication channels (which will continue to improve as time goes on).

 

We've cemented much better relationships with the relevant bodies who have influence in running our matches and games.

 

With the exception of last year - we have turned five successive operating profits in what is one of the most financially challenging periods the world has ever faced.

 

We have taken great time and effort to revolutionise our community programme aimed at placing the football club at the heart of the Lanarkshire public - with much, MUCH more to come from that.

 

We've invested time, money and infrastructure into our Youth Development programme that has supplied numerous International players over the last five to ten years and, currently, has the most graduates in the current first-team than any other SPL club.

 

We have listened to the fans when reintroducing some more traditional elements to the club; things like the return of the hoop on the strip right down to the return of the catering to a club product this season which heralds the return of the famous Chapman's Pie.

 

We've still got one of the cheapest Season Tickets in the SPL and this year and are one of the few clubs who operate a trust based interest free payment plan to help fans spread the cost burden. We have a family ticket in the Cooper Stand that allows up to two free kids enter completely free of charge the whole season.

 

We have, albeit still in the early stages, a fans committee established to further enhance the relationship the club has with its fans.

 

That may all sounds like some sort of exert from Pravda, but I don't accept the club shrugs its shoulders and gives the fans a take it as it is, or leave it ultimatum. Yes, there is much to do. Yes, there is much to be improved on but, as far as Motherwell Football Club goes, we're on a sound footing with the people currently making the calls and are heading down the correct path.

 

The problems and issues with football transcend our club and stretch way beyond even our borders. I agree we need positive change but getting it will be very difficult. However, at MFC, we have people actively working for a better future but that'll take time.

 

 

Praise should indeed be given to MFC for all the points you've mentioned above. But the crux of it is that despite the successes of last season - european football, money coming in from players being sold/manager leaving, new strip sales, reduced wage bill/promotion of youth players and a suprising top six finish (surely at the start of the year the club did not budget for a top six finish), we still made a loss.

 

Are the cost of pitch repairs responsible for last years loss?

[Brazilian]

would it not have been the 7th place finish that contributed to the last published accounts, I reckon the bonus of top six finish season 2009/2010 isn't seen until accounts published in April ish 2011

[john_M_F_C]

Is it moaning though or can i not be concerned about the future of a club that has been a massive part of my life since my old man lifted me over the turnstyle 30+years ago.I applaud all those who think everything is rosy but i make no apologies for how i feel,we are the fifth best of a bad lot in the SPL and our game(club and inernational) is dire.If people are happy to lay the blame at the door of the scottish media and absolve the govening bodies and clubs of any blame then the ball is well and truly burst.

 

The SPL is an ok league, easily Championship class, outside the OF, and more league1 maybe in the bottom 3 or 4. We could easily compete with our team in the Championship though, and given the size of club up here I don't think we can be any thing other than happy with that. However, it's perhaps this gap of standard that isn't good for the game.

The International team suffered lately from a lack of good management, but is't dire. Look at the players now in "the best league in the world" when was the last time we had as many post premiership and big money? Danny Wilson- Liverpool, Darren Fletcher- Man Utd, Craig Gordon- Sunderland, James McFadden- Birmingham, Steven Fletcher- Wolves, Gary Caldwell- Wigan, Hutton- Spurs/Sunderland on loan last season, Dorrans- West Brom, McArthur- Wigan. Add to that there's the McCarthy's and the Cuellars etc who're foreigners who've went from up here to premiership sides and play regularly.

 

I may not be as old as some on here but I really can't remember it being better than this.

[SuperCC]

The SPL is an ok league, easily Championship class, outside the OF, and more league1 maybe in the bottom 3 or 4. We could easily compete with our team in the Championship though, and given the size of club up here I don't think we can be any thing other than happy with that. However, it's perhaps this gap of standard that isn't good for the game.

The International team suffered lately from a lack of good management, but is't dire. Look at the players now in "the best league in the world" when was the last time we had as many post premiership and big money? Danny Wilson- Liverpool, Darren Fletcher- Man Utd, Craig Gordon- Sunderland, James McFadden- Birmingham, Steven Fletcher- Wolves, Gary Caldwell- Wigan, Hutton- Spurs/Sunderland on loan last season, Dorrans- West Brom, McArthur- Wigan. Add to that there's the McCarthy's and the Cuellars etc who're foreigners who've went from up here to premiership sides and play regularly.

 

I may not be as old as some on here but I really can't remember it being better than this.

 

How many people would agree with that statement?

[john_M_F_C]

How many people would agree with that statement?

 

 

I'd like to think most people who looked at the situation objectively they would agree.